McLaren receives £300m.......
Discussion
Slippydiff said:
MclaesLaren said:
After seeing this video.
https://youtu.be/Dh2iQSU9DJE
Ron Dennis might be the only way out for McLaren. If he likes to restart after the age of 70 and invest in the Automotive business. F1 I guess is a too big challenge. He has the money and knowledge. Hope he has the spirit as well.
He understand that running a car factory is not like the stock market. Result is achieved over many years. Look at Porsche
Ithankyou, that’s the same video I linked to a couple of posts previously https://youtu.be/Dh2iQSU9DJE
Ron Dennis might be the only way out for McLaren. If he likes to restart after the age of 70 and invest in the Automotive business. F1 I guess is a too big challenge. He has the money and knowledge. Hope he has the spirit as well.
He understand that running a car factory is not like the stock market. Result is achieved over many years. Look at Porsche
I suppose I was a Ron fan if ever there could be such a thing but amongst all the OCD stuff (that really just makes good copy) there is one of the most passionate men in motorsport.
How do I know? I (stupidly) wrote two letters to him when I was probably 12 or so to explain how I thought I'd come up with some a unique way of gaining an aerodynamic advantage in the F1 cars-h(is PA)e wrote back to explain how they would be illegal!
The paper was the thickest embossed stuff I'd ever seen. In grey!
It's not the end for McLaren their main shareholder has deep pockets and will need them to get through this crisis and the oncoming recession but they will survive in a smaller entity. Smaller pool of buyers out there will mean balancing production with demand rather than over-supply like recently which has pushed down the residuals.
They need to just build 1 car less than is needed for the market, support the independent specialists who can bring down the used car maintenance costs which will create further demand and stronger residuals and stop launching so many new cars.
They need to just build 1 car less than is needed for the market, support the independent specialists who can bring down the used car maintenance costs which will create further demand and stronger residuals and stop launching so many new cars.
Crazy4557 said:
It's not the end for McLaren their main shareholder has deep pockets and will need them to get through this crisis and the oncoming recession but they will survive in a smaller entity. Smaller pool of buyers out there will mean balancing production with demand rather than over-supply like recently which has pushed down the residuals.
They need to just build 1 car less than is needed for the market, support the independent specialists who can bring down the used car maintenance costs which will create further demand and stronger residuals and stop launching so many new cars.
If Mumtalakat still have deep pockets and want to keep investing in McLaren, they should be buying up the debt that they don’t own.They need to just build 1 car less than is needed for the market, support the independent specialists who can bring down the used car maintenance costs which will create further demand and stronger residuals and stop launching so many new cars.
If they don’t, then when the inevitable debt equity swap comes, it’ll be interesting to see who the holders are at that point, who then controls it and what their goal will be?
rev-erend said:
Are Mumtalakat in a little bit of cash flow issues with oil revenues hit by a slump in demand and a price war with Russia.
They are hurting. Have announced budget cuts of up to 30% in places at home and suspended construction projects. I don't think there is much of an appetite to get deeper into a plaything. eadingleberry said:
They are hurting. Have announced budget cuts of up to 30% in places at home and suspended construction projects. I don't think there is much of an appetite to get deeper into a plaything.
The investor / owner Mumtalakat rating. Fitch rating is BB-. Standard and Poor rating is B.
Not a company I would issue a credit line to.
Rich on oil do not mean that they are rich on cash.
Edited by MclaesLaren on Wednesday 27th May 06:59
Slippydiff said:
He's about as shrewd as they come, though he's clearly incredibly intense. All in all a very interesting character, though he has some interesting character traits that haven't exactly endeared him to those who've worked with/for him. Adrian Newey paints a less than gushing picture of him in his book.
But the interview in the video I've linked to below gives an excellent insight into the man (I found myself alternating between deep admiration for what he's done with his life and his consummate business/deal making skills, but then thinking what an obnoxious individual he is)
One senses a huge amount of bitterness on his part at the way he was ousted from McLaren (no real surprise there) this despite him saying he thought he'd had a good deal. Maybe this will turn out to be a case of he who laughs last, laughs longest ??
When the video ended, I felt rather sorry for him, but I really couldn't decide whether I liked him or loathed him :
https://youtu.be/Dh2iQSU9DJE
At least he has the self-awareness to appreciate he can be hard work and irritating to others.
Thanks for sharing the video, he certainly is a complex character and this provides a deeper insight. The video further reinforces my belief that whilst I would have loved for him to have remained at the helm of McLaren, I can't see him returning....But the interview in the video I've linked to below gives an excellent insight into the man (I found myself alternating between deep admiration for what he's done with his life and his consummate business/deal making skills, but then thinking what an obnoxious individual he is)
One senses a huge amount of bitterness on his part at the way he was ousted from McLaren (no real surprise there) this despite him saying he thought he'd had a good deal. Maybe this will turn out to be a case of he who laughs last, laughs longest ??
When the video ended, I felt rather sorry for him, but I really couldn't decide whether I liked him or loathed him :
https://youtu.be/Dh2iQSU9DJE
At least he has the self-awareness to appreciate he can be hard work and irritating to others.
It is a real shame to hear of the financial difficulty and subsequent job losses at McLaren announced yesterday. Unfortunately like Aston Martin and so many other VM's, the R&D costs are huge today, and scale is seen as the only answer to absorb these costs and maximize returns., The strategy of producing cars to a level that far outstrips demand is a short term one, as RV's get destroyed and they can't sell new cars for anything close to list price.
Sad times, but hopefully a restructure of the business models, will make them stronger in the longer term....
Project 4 said:
Slippydiff said:
He's about as shrewd as they come, though he's clearly incredibly intense. All in all a very interesting character, though he has some interesting character traits that haven't exactly endeared him to those who've worked with/for him. Adrian Newey paints a less than gushing picture of him in his book.
But the interview in the video I've linked to below gives an excellent insight into the man (I found myself alternating between deep admiration for what he's done with his life and his consummate business/deal making skills, but then thinking what an obnoxious individual he is)
One senses a huge amount of bitterness on his part at the way he was ousted from McLaren (no real surprise there) this despite him saying he thought he'd had a good deal. Maybe this will turn out to be a case of he who laughs last, laughs longest ??
When the video ended, I felt rather sorry for him, but I really couldn't decide whether I liked him or loathed him :
https://youtu.be/Dh2iQSU9DJE
At least he has the self-awareness to appreciate he can be hard work and irritating to others.
Thanks for sharing the video, he certainly is a complex character and this provides a deeper insight. The video further reinforces my belief that whilst I would have loved for him to have remained at the helm of McLaren, I can't see him returning....But the interview in the video I've linked to below gives an excellent insight into the man (I found myself alternating between deep admiration for what he's done with his life and his consummate business/deal making skills, but then thinking what an obnoxious individual he is)
One senses a huge amount of bitterness on his part at the way he was ousted from McLaren (no real surprise there) this despite him saying he thought he'd had a good deal. Maybe this will turn out to be a case of he who laughs last, laughs longest ??
When the video ended, I felt rather sorry for him, but I really couldn't decide whether I liked him or loathed him :
https://youtu.be/Dh2iQSU9DJE
At least he has the self-awareness to appreciate he can be hard work and irritating to others.
It is a real shame to hear of the financial difficulty and subsequent job losses at McLaren announced yesterday. Unfortunately like Aston Martin and so many other VM's, the R&D costs are huge today, and scale is seen as the only answer to absorb these costs and maximize returns., The strategy of producing cars to a level that far outstrips demand is a short term one, as RV's get destroyed and they can't sell new cars for anything close to list price.
Sad times, but hopefully a restructure of the business models, will make them stronger in the longer term....
If anyone's interested, there is a good Collecting Cars podcast where Chris Harris talks with Chris Goodwin which includes some good anecdotes of RD's time at McL.
Ron Dennis was the soul reason I purchased a 12C before they were even launched. He is a man who wanted to change the whole super car ownership experience and he did initially, he knew it was a long term proposition, but then the bean counters took over with his investors wanting a return quicker, not wanting to play the long game. They ousted the best asset McLaren had, and set about trying to be like all the rest, build build build knock em out as fast as you can and don’t worry about brand loyalty or residuals there’s a long line of punters. Unfortunately this over crowded market is imploding and punters prepared to drop large sums on cars is gone, new markets like China are no more. There is simply an oversupply of supercars globally, I just hope they can restructure and survive because their cars are amount the best in the world even without Ron Dennis just their business planning is at fault, just like most British manufacturers of niche cars, Lotus, Aston Martin, TVR
Strange times and many of my friends are feeling the same way about cars as I am right now,mine have been SORN for a few months and right now I just don't feel the same sense of urgency to get out in them,maybe I'm overreacting but it just doesn't seem that important at the moment
With regards to this topic I've always fancied and wanted to own a Mclaren,I got as far once as having a deposit on one. The problem has never been with the cars themselves but the proposition of the overall ownership.People can hark on about not being bothered about depreciation, high running and warranty costs but those things alone were already putting Mclaren in a difficult position before Covid
Mclaren should have always been a niche car supplied in a niche way,the desire for some of the companies to ramp up volume and expect the business model to soak up the excess volume is utter madness,it just isn't going to work as demonstrated.
Covid has definitely played a part in the acceleration of this problem but the problem was going to rear its head at some point anyway
All we can hope is that someone does have deep enough pockets and the desire to reinvent this brand in the format that it should have followed in the first place
With regards to this topic I've always fancied and wanted to own a Mclaren,I got as far once as having a deposit on one. The problem has never been with the cars themselves but the proposition of the overall ownership.People can hark on about not being bothered about depreciation, high running and warranty costs but those things alone were already putting Mclaren in a difficult position before Covid
Mclaren should have always been a niche car supplied in a niche way,the desire for some of the companies to ramp up volume and expect the business model to soak up the excess volume is utter madness,it just isn't going to work as demonstrated.
Covid has definitely played a part in the acceleration of this problem but the problem was going to rear its head at some point anyway
All we can hope is that someone does have deep enough pockets and the desire to reinvent this brand in the format that it should have followed in the first place
Juno said:
All we can hope is that someone does have deep enough pockets and the desire to reinvent this brand in the format that it should have followed in the first place
What I can see in my crystal ball is that a company like Ford Motor Co, can take over ML.Mike Flewitt is a ex vp of Ford.
Ford has a history of F1 engines, Cosworth.
With the inroads to Ford I see that they now can aquire a prestige brand, plus getting a foot in the F1 arena.
Cash is King.. Ford can do this easily.
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