Tesco 99 RON Super Unleaded A+++++
Discussion
So I filled up on this stuff over the weekend in my 12c not expecting a big difference from Shell 98 RON but I was in for a surprise.
The torque has definately gone up and it pulls harder now especially noticable in 2/3/4/5 gear. I am surprised how much of a difference just 1 RON makes.
I definately recommend all 12c/650s owners to fill up on Tesco Super Unleaded 99 RON. I think the engine ECU notices the higher octane and increases boost pressure. Makes a heck of a difference.
The torque has definately gone up and it pulls harder now especially noticable in 2/3/4/5 gear. I am surprised how much of a difference just 1 RON makes.
I definately recommend all 12c/650s owners to fill up on Tesco Super Unleaded 99 RON. I think the engine ECU notices the higher octane and increases boost pressure. Makes a heck of a difference.
Gibbo205 said:
Interesting.
I have heard that Shell have changed Vpower recently and heard some complaints so could also be that, also seen that Texaco now has 99 fuel as well.
I think Esso Supreme is also 99 and at some garages in UK has 0% ethanol too.
IIRC Esso Supreme is all 0% Ethanol.I have heard that Shell have changed Vpower recently and heard some complaints so could also be that, also seen that Texaco now has 99 fuel as well.
I think Esso Supreme is also 99 and at some garages in UK has 0% ethanol too.
Abacus21 said:
So I filled up on this stuff over the weekend in my 12c not expecting a big difference from Shell 98 RON but I was in for a surprise.
The torque has definately gone up and it pulls harder now especially noticable in 2/3/4/5 gear. I am surprised how much of a difference just 1 RON makes.
Shell V Power is 99 RON (not 98) also so cannot see why they’d be any performance difference between the two? Think the ethonol content varies slightly depending on which part of the country you are in but nothing that should impact engine power?The torque has definately gone up and it pulls harder now especially noticable in 2/3/4/5 gear. I am surprised how much of a difference just 1 RON makes.
Interesting.
I mostly fill up at Costco (which is 97) but I have a Tesco about a mile down the road so I do occasionally fill up there. Very occasionally I fill up at Shell but otherwise its just whatever premium is around when I need it.
I've never noticed any difference between any of the premium fuels in any car except when mapping my old supercharged MX-5, where on the "as far as I dare push it" map there was a little bit more knock audible through the det cans with BP fuel vs Shell when the intake temps were silly hot. This was many years before ethanol etc in fuel (afaik) so things might be different now at the extreme end of things. IME in regular cars with factory maps it doesn't seem to make a difference to me.
I mostly fill up at Costco (which is 97) but I have a Tesco about a mile down the road so I do occasionally fill up there. Very occasionally I fill up at Shell but otherwise its just whatever premium is around when I need it.
I've never noticed any difference between any of the premium fuels in any car except when mapping my old supercharged MX-5, where on the "as far as I dare push it" map there was a little bit more knock audible through the det cans with BP fuel vs Shell when the intake temps were silly hot. This was many years before ethanol etc in fuel (afaik) so things might be different now at the extreme end of things. IME in regular cars with factory maps it doesn't seem to make a difference to me.
garystoybox said:
Shell V Power is 99 RON (not 98) also so cannot see why they’d be any performance difference between the two? Think the ethonol content varies slightly depending on which part of the country you are in but nothing that should impact engine power?
From the latest spec sheets I was able to find, which are admittedly years old now, Tesco M99 has a higher MON at 88.5 vs 86. That could account for better performance at WOT/load. It also has a higher oxygenate content which turbos prefer, and significantly lower olefins (3 vs 15) compared to V-Power. Just because the octane is the same, doesn't mean the rest of the fuel is. Of course that's just two samples, but that's how it looks on paper. Tesco spec sheet.
Shell spec sheet.
They both do the job, but I've typically found M99 more 'explosive' and responsive, and more consistent batch to batch. It's also 16ppl cheaper than V-Power here atm, so why not?
Abacus21 said:
So I filled up on this stuff over the weekend in my 12c not expecting a big difference from Shell 98 RON but I was in for a surprise.
The torque has definately gone up and it pulls harder now especially noticable in 2/3/4/5 gear. I am surprised how much of a difference just 1 RON makes.
I definately recommend all 12c/650s owners to fill up on Tesco Super Unleaded 99 RON. I think the engine ECU notices the higher octane and increases boost pressure. Makes a heck of a difference.
I think this is total placebo. it'll take quite a few tanks for knock values to get adjusted properly. its just that 'new' thing feeling. The torque has definately gone up and it pulls harder now especially noticable in 2/3/4/5 gear. I am surprised how much of a difference just 1 RON makes.
I definately recommend all 12c/650s owners to fill up on Tesco Super Unleaded 99 RON. I think the engine ECU notices the higher octane and increases boost pressure. Makes a heck of a difference.
jason61c said:
I think this is total placebo. it'll take quite a few tanks for knock values to get adjusted properly. its just that 'new' thing feeling.
Given that the ECU and knock sensor take measurements in basically real time, what makes you say it would take upwards of 1,000 miles or more, depending on how you quantify 'quite a few tanks' and range per tank, for timing to adjust? That's a *lot* of time - weeks or months, for most - for something as 'simple' as advancing timing. Everything I've read, including owners' manuals and technical data for various engines, suggests that timing is immediately retarded on detection of detonation, but likewise in absence of detonation it is also continuously advanced either to the preset level or until detonation occurs, whichever comes first. Rinse and repeat continuously. You can see this constant advance/retardation/advance happening in real time with an OBD reader and an app on your phone.On the 99 RON price thread, anarki posted a recent YouTube vid showing back-to-back dyno runs of the various super fuels, as well as 95 RON E10 fuel and an E30 'spicy fuel' mix. That video also suggests the timing adjusts almost in real time. The test car gained upwards of 60 BHP in seconds after switching from 99 RON to a higher octane E30 mix(!), lost timing and power instantly when switching to 95 RON (the tank was drained between runs), and gained back both the timing advance and the extra HP again instantly when the fuels are switched back around to 99 RON. No 'several full tanks and thousands of miles to adjust' required... I feel this is just another urban myth, unless you have evidence I haven't considered?
That's an interesting video however with regards to the e30 mix he does retune the car to a more aggressive timing map, he even re-does the test with tesco 99 with the very aggressive map and it actually loses 1hp which id suggest is run to run variance. Only saying to highlight that the retune for e30 likely make the difference higher, I.e. timing pushed harder which the 99 can't make use of but the e30 can, and so it isn't an apple's for apples comparison in this particular test
I generally use esso 99 as its on my route whereas the local tesco is presently being refurbed. Also both esso and Shell claim extra detergent for "keeping the engine clean", whether this actually makes much difference I don't know but may be a contributing factor to relative performance to tesco, they made no mention in the video of the detergent claims, they only tested the power, which coincidentally they only used the peak run for rather than the average of the 3 runs. Im not sure if a total range of 5hp between fuels on a 460hp car is statistically significant or not, would have been nice to see the 3 combined average runs per fuel plotted to see if they were actually consistent and as clear cut as presented. I'm actually somewhat surprised the normal 95 was within spitting distance in this test as far as peak power was concerned.
Interesting though..
I generally use esso 99 as its on my route whereas the local tesco is presently being refurbed. Also both esso and Shell claim extra detergent for "keeping the engine clean", whether this actually makes much difference I don't know but may be a contributing factor to relative performance to tesco, they made no mention in the video of the detergent claims, they only tested the power, which coincidentally they only used the peak run for rather than the average of the 3 runs. Im not sure if a total range of 5hp between fuels on a 460hp car is statistically significant or not, would have been nice to see the 3 combined average runs per fuel plotted to see if they were actually consistent and as clear cut as presented. I'm actually somewhat surprised the normal 95 was within spitting distance in this test as far as peak power was concerned.
Interesting though..
Its placebo.
i have mates at both shell and glencore who are directly involved in this sort of stuff and the shell one of those who is responsible for deciding when to let the tankers unload or sit offshore accruing costs yet waiting for the market to move.
the only difference is the additive's and cleaners, there's no doubt long term v power is better for engine health but most performance cars wont be kept long enough to make a difference for the first owner at least. No difference on the calorific content and its effect on 'torque' after one tank!
perhaps op was comparing it to normal unleaded which is 95 ron whereas vpower is 99 (not 98 as they mention)
i have mates at both shell and glencore who are directly involved in this sort of stuff and the shell one of those who is responsible for deciding when to let the tankers unload or sit offshore accruing costs yet waiting for the market to move.
the only difference is the additive's and cleaners, there's no doubt long term v power is better for engine health but most performance cars wont be kept long enough to make a difference for the first owner at least. No difference on the calorific content and its effect on 'torque' after one tank!
perhaps op was comparing it to normal unleaded which is 95 ron whereas vpower is 99 (not 98 as they mention)
Jawls said:
Total placebo effect.
What’s the mechanism for there being a difference when the base fuel literally comes out of the same tank? Additive pixie dust really making a difference you can notice?
Yep additive pixie dust does the job. Which is perhaps not all that surprising as that is the difference between fuels. What’s the mechanism for there being a difference when the base fuel literally comes out of the same tank? Additive pixie dust really making a difference you can notice?
If you can’t tell the difference then don’t bother with the expensive stuff, simples. It’s also highly car dependent in my experience and I most definitely don’t bother with stuff like V Power in cars where I can’t feel the difference.
DMZ said:
Jawls said:
Total placebo effect.
What’s the mechanism for there being a difference when the base fuel literally comes out of the same tank? Additive pixie dust really making a difference you can notice?
Yep additive pixie dust does the job. Which is perhaps not all that surprising as that is the difference between fuels. What’s the mechanism for there being a difference when the base fuel literally comes out of the same tank? Additive pixie dust really making a difference you can notice?
If you can’t tell the difference then don’t bother with the expensive stuff, simples. It’s also highly car dependent in my experience and I most definitely don’t bother with stuff like V Power in cars where I can’t feel the difference.
I just don’t see the mechanism through which such a micro dosed component could have a noticeable effect on torque, as claimed in OP. I can see how there could be better cleaning effects, but performance ones? Seems incredibly marginal.
The OP cited octane differences, which would at least make sense, it’s just factually wrong in the case of Tesco vs Shell.
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