Discussion
SchillingTwo said:
I was disappointed with McLaren s attitude when first looking to buy (patronising salesman in Ascot), and slowly got lite disappointed as I ve gone on, with issues such as (I feel) unfairly rejected warranty claims and no interest in trying to make owners feel valued.
I ve found Ferrari to be so very much better in this respect.
I understand that this is in part down to finances, but for me nowadays while I still live the car I ve little time for the manufacturer.
Mc Leeds have been quite the opposite for me. Great.I ve found Ferrari to be so very much better in this respect.
I understand that this is in part down to finances, but for me nowadays while I still live the car I ve little time for the manufacturer.
ChrisW. said:
SchillingTwo said:
I was disappointed with McLaren s attitude when first looking to buy (patronising salesman in Ascot), and slowly got lite disappointed as I ve gone on, with issues such as (I feel) unfairly rejected warranty claims and no interest in trying to make owners feel valued.
I ve found Ferrari to be so very much better in this respect.
I understand that this is in part down to finances, but for me nowadays while I still live the car I ve little time for the manufacturer.
Mc Leeds have been quite the opposite for me. Great.I ve found Ferrari to be so very much better in this respect.
I understand that this is in part down to finances, but for me nowadays while I still live the car I ve little time for the manufacturer.
Zorbathegreek said:
Frankychops said:
How much have you spent over the £80k purchase 6 months ago?
That s quite a direct and private question but I ll elaborate: It was 18th March when I purchased it, so four months ago. The final price was a little over £80K - private sale so was a very fair price for a such a highly specced 650S - I took all risk. I ve known the car since approximately 2019 when I first clapped eyes on it at a Wilton House McLaren owners get together (I had a 720S at the time). When it came up for sale close to where I live, I jumped on it.The pre-sale inspection and further post-sale work by Jack Webb Motorsport threw up some minor issues - cracked plastic front undertray - oil seal leaking - intermittent faulty rear brake light - coolant not filled with the G48 blue stuff - misting front right damper. All now sorted. JWM are a good bunch and even fixed the faulty damper FOC.
When JWM replaced the coolant with the correct G48 , it required the system to be pressurised. This threw up a weeping metal pipe running from engine to front low temp radiators (underside near front subframe was weeping) - it could have been patched up but I ve decided to have the full pipe replaced, which requires the fuel tank to be dropped - will be sorted next week. Fortunately, I m out of the UK for a few months so JWM have been working on it at their leisure with no time pressures.
As a matter of good maintenance and care, I ve decided to have the brake pads and all undertray bolts replaced. The OEM superlight ten spoke wheels have been painted in OEM silver. The undertray bolts will be replaced with stainless steel items. Carbon fibre wheel centre caps and bonnet badge were a bit tired so I ve purchased OEM replacements. Sometime in August it will be transported to Project Customs (McLaren approved repairer) to have the two front wheel arches repaired and painted. The aging PPF will be replaced.
By the time all is complete, I ve allowed approximately £12 - £15K to bring it up to what should be a very high standard. Arguably one of the best examples (that s the plan anyway). The OEM brake light, wheel centres and bonnet badge replacements were in the region of £1K.
So, if it were to be sold for £120K, I d make approximately £20K profit.
G48 Coolant
Oil leak
EDIT: I forgot to mention that during the service, I also had both air filters replaced with BMC. The turbos are slightly more vocal but not by much.
Edited by Zorbathegreek on Saturday 25th July 13:36
I make the point as you’ve mention values a lot and are trying to push them, while then saying about your car and £120k etc etc etc. when your got a good car for £80k ish, you can find good cars from private sellers for £80-95k. Which you and the market prove
Frankychops said:
Where s the £15k come from in that list?
I make the point as you ve mention values a lot and are trying to push them, while then saying about your car and £120k etc etc etc. when your got a good car for £80k ish, you can find good cars from private sellers for £80-95k. Which you and the market prove
I’m not pushing any values. I’d be tempted to sell for £120K as it’s a decent profit.if I got an offer for £120K, I’d be stupid not to seriously consider it.I make the point as you ve mention values a lot and are trying to push them, while then saying about your car and £120k etc etc etc. when your got a good car for £80k ish, you can find good cars from private sellers for £80-95k. Which you and the market prove
You feeling a bit sore?
Zorbathegreek said:
I m not pushing any values. I d be tempted to sell for £120K as it s a decent profit.if I got an offer for £120K, I d be stupid not to seriously consider it.
You feeling a bit sore?
not at all! sell it for £1m, you'd make more profit then. Still like to see where £15k comes from?You feeling a bit sore?
I don't see 650S falling back to where they were, unless perhaps there's a real economic shock. They still look quite good value compared to anything comparable, and there aren't that many of them. The fact that they used to be cheaper recently doesn't prove that they soon will be again.
CTE said:
They are undervalued (all 2nd hand McLaren`s) when compared to the competition due to McLaren`s woeful customer attitude.
Exactly - but the thing is, the older the car gets, the smaller the part the franchised dealers play in the ownership experience. Hence as the cars age and more decent McLaren independent specialists open, the better the ownership experience and the more the cars are worth.Frankychops said:
Zorbathegreek said:
I m not pushing any values. I d be tempted to sell for £120K as it s a decent profit.if I got an offer for £120K, I d be stupid not to seriously consider it.
You feeling a bit sore?
not at all! sell it for £1m, you'd make more profit then. Still like to see where £15k comes from?You feeling a bit sore?
There’s a lot of effort being put into this car.
I think they are great value for money (especially in the UK, and a little less in other markets). I highly doubt they will ever depreciate given the relatively limited numbers. a couple of things that people keep touting as amazing do not matter all that much to me though:
- chassis flex, sure nice to have less, but really not that important to me in a road car. I'd take engine sound over that any day. I do not track my road cars, so am not jumping kerbs regularly and I really do not mind if my rearview mirror looks like some kaleidoscope (like it does in my 1971 911 Targa)
- metal roof, I really prefer a fabric roof or "no roof" at all over those contraptions with their shut lines (applies to every car, not specifically McLaren)
what I do like though is steering with proper feel (ideally unassisted, but assisted works too in some cases), sound (not necessarily loud at low revs, more like "make your hairs stand up as the revs rise at different rev levels), ideally short gearing (who needs top speed), looks (pretty, not aggressive per se), light weight as you can really feel that even if computers can "mask" it - most of those things are highly individual/personal and some cars have it for me and other cars less so.
- chassis flex, sure nice to have less, but really not that important to me in a road car. I'd take engine sound over that any day. I do not track my road cars, so am not jumping kerbs regularly and I really do not mind if my rearview mirror looks like some kaleidoscope (like it does in my 1971 911 Targa)
- metal roof, I really prefer a fabric roof or "no roof" at all over those contraptions with their shut lines (applies to every car, not specifically McLaren)
what I do like though is steering with proper feel (ideally unassisted, but assisted works too in some cases), sound (not necessarily loud at low revs, more like "make your hairs stand up as the revs rise at different rev levels), ideally short gearing (who needs top speed), looks (pretty, not aggressive per se), light weight as you can really feel that even if computers can "mask" it - most of those things are highly individual/personal and some cars have it for me and other cars less so.
MDL111 said:
....a couple of things that people keep touting as amazing do not matter all that much to me though:
...
- metal roof, I really prefer a fabric roof or "no roof" at all over those contraptions with their shut lines (applies to every car, not specifically McLaren)
If that's related to my comment: It's less about the metal roof being "amazing" and simply that keeping a fabric roof in decent condition on a car that lives outside is a pain in the arse - I have another car with a fabric roof, and it's a battle to stop it turning green (although admittedly, the fact that it gets washed about once a year might contribute to that)....
- metal roof, I really prefer a fabric roof or "no roof" at all over those contraptions with their shut lines (applies to every car, not specifically McLaren)
meridian said:
Purso said:
No requirment to share what the job is costing you.
I agree..All credit to Zorba if he chooses to discuss, but if it were me I'd tell people politely to keep their snouts out of my business
TBH, I’ve no real idea how much it will cost in the end. I just know that having already owned two 720S, that I have not jumped into 650S ownership with eyes closed. I bought it at a fair price and I guestimated that costs would be in the region of 12-15K. If it costs a total of £100K (including vehicle purchase), I’ll end up with a 650S at a much lower price than it would have been through a trader. Fortunately, it was a known vehicle to me and I bought when 650S prices are on the increase. There’d need to be a significant repair bill to lose my shirt.
Zorbathegreek said:
McLaren nailed it with the front end view.
Agree, some prefer the mp4 but I don't think there's a bad angle on the 650, does more for me than even the 7's personally.akadk said:
They are great
However after having x3 12C s and x2 650 I am happy to step up to a 720, and whilst I m yet to drive it in anger, everyone I ve spoken to has said it is another level speed wise to the 650
Not that you need it or can use it in the uk, or the public road for that matter
Don't know if anyones done something like the litchfield 720bhp tune on the 650 but would be interesting to know how it compares and what it does for longevityHowever after having x3 12C s and x2 650 I am happy to step up to a 720, and whilst I m yet to drive it in anger, everyone I ve spoken to has said it is another level speed wise to the 650
Not that you need it or can use it in the uk, or the public road for that matter
Zorbathegreek said:
I ve no issues with sharing the project and its costs - helps prospective owners identify where common issues may occur, associated repair costs and where to buy. If you look through the TVR forums, it s full of owner experiences and solutions. For instance; JWM have posted today on FB that they have a solution for the not so uncommon broken stalk issue.
TBH, I ve no real idea how much it will cost in the end. I just know that having already owned two 720S, that I have not jumped into 650S ownership with eyes closed. I bought it at a fair price and I guestimated that costs would be in the region of 12-15K. If it costs a total of £100K (including vehicle purchase), I ll end up with a 650S at a much lower price than it would have been through a trader. Fortunately, it was a known vehicle to me and I bought when 650S prices are on the increase. There d need to be a significant repair bill to lose my shirt.
Awesome that JWB are doing this, but it just increases my frustration that McLaren don't. I have been in the unfortunate position of having to replace my MRM due to a single small component within it going wrong. It is totally modular, there is literally no reason why all the bits within it need to be bundled together like that, and it creates a terrible experience for the owner.TBH, I ve no real idea how much it will cost in the end. I just know that having already owned two 720S, that I have not jumped into 650S ownership with eyes closed. I bought it at a fair price and I guestimated that costs would be in the region of 12-15K. If it costs a total of £100K (including vehicle purchase), I ll end up with a 650S at a much lower price than it would have been through a trader. Fortunately, it was a known vehicle to me and I bought when 650S prices are on the increase. There d need to be a significant repair bill to lose my shirt.
I was lucky that I was able to find a used one and take off just the part I needed, but why should I have to do that?
We used to repair electrical goods down to component level.
In the main this is no longer possible due to multi-layer boards etc. in much more compact assemblies aiding packaging and speed of manufacture.
We want small / clever / cheap ... and this is the price.
Hence we need specialists who have the know-how and the incentive to find better solutions. e.g. rechargeable accumulators ... etc.
The manufacturers will not do this because they don't want to stock all the individual components and they like the margin.
In the main this is no longer possible due to multi-layer boards etc. in much more compact assemblies aiding packaging and speed of manufacture.
We want small / clever / cheap ... and this is the price.
Hence we need specialists who have the know-how and the incentive to find better solutions. e.g. rechargeable accumulators ... etc.
The manufacturers will not do this because they don't want to stock all the individual components and they like the margin.
ChrisW. said:
We used to repair electrical goods down to component level.
In the main this is no longer possible due to multi-layer boards etc. in much more compact assemblies aiding packaging and speed of manufacture.
We want small / clever / cheap ... and this is the price.
Hence we need specialists who have the know-how and the incentive to find better solutions. e.g. rechargeable accumulators ... etc.
The manufacturers will not do this because they don't want to stock all the individual components and they like the margin.
Yes, they don't want to have to stock a bunch of components, plus they'd rather sell a £3500 assembly rather than a £150 indicator stalk. Which makes sense in isolation.In the main this is no longer possible due to multi-layer boards etc. in much more compact assemblies aiding packaging and speed of manufacture.
We want small / clever / cheap ... and this is the price.
Hence we need specialists who have the know-how and the incentive to find better solutions. e.g. rechargeable accumulators ... etc.
The manufacturers will not do this because they don't want to stock all the individual components and they like the margin.
It's desperately short sighted though. It vastly drives up the cost of maintenance of the older models, which gives them a reputation for being expensive and unreliable, which drives down demand and hence prices. Low used prices means high depreciation, which hits demand for the new cars. How many sales have McLaren lost to Ferrari because the buyer knows they will loose a heck of a lot more money on a new McLaren than a new Ferrari?
Ferrari understand that a poor ownership experience for used car buyers, even those that will never buy a new one, is bad for business.
BSM1984 said:
Quite a high spec on it but no lift which along with being a little bit tatty in places and needing some tidying up kicked it into the side lines for us.
Wouldn't have taken too much to get it up to scratch but combined with no lift also, it just didn't stack up for us even at its previous price..
What exactly was 'tatty' about it? I know pics are hard to see details but that looks far from tatty?Wouldn't have taken too much to get it up to scratch but combined with no lift also, it just didn't stack up for us even at its previous price..
davek_964 said:
MDL111 said:
....a couple of things that people keep touting as amazing do not matter all that much to me though:
...
- metal roof, I really prefer a fabric roof or "no roof" at all over those contraptions with their shut lines (applies to every car, not specifically McLaren)
If that's related to my comment: It's less about the metal roof being "amazing" and simply that keeping a fabric roof in decent condition on a car that lives outside is a pain in the arse - I have another car with a fabric roof, and it's a battle to stop it turning green (although admittedly, the fact that it gets washed about once a year might contribute to that)....
- metal roof, I really prefer a fabric roof or "no roof" at all over those contraptions with their shut lines (applies to every car, not specifically McLaren)
tty little "engine window" on the deck, which I would much rather have in metal like on something like a 355). I do get your point about those roofs being more susceptible to turning crappy looking though - something I ever really considered tbh. Gassing Station | McLaren | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff