Tesla and Uber Unlikely to Survive...
Discussion
As opposed to any other industry?
Lets look at the German manufacturers
Mercedes CEO - quits
BMW CEO - quits/fired
Audi CEO - arrested
Tesla have no greater turnover of higher level staff than any other company its just the press make a deal out of it.
Elon is by far the longest surviving Auto industry CEO now.
Lets look at the German manufacturers
Mercedes CEO - quits
BMW CEO - quits/fired
Audi CEO - arrested
Tesla have no greater turnover of higher level staff than any other company its just the press make a deal out of it.
Elon is by far the longest surviving Auto industry CEO now.
CoolHands said:
When are the tesla lorries going to be on the road?
Well they are now but only for Teslas own use. They occasionally test them by delivering Teslas.They have also loaned them to people with preorders to test.
So maybe we will see them for real in 2020? I'd guess end of 2020 start of 2021. Tesla will probably deliver a tiny number in 2020 just to keep to their recent time scale. They did the same for the Model3.
I have no interest in Tesla one way or another, and don't hold any positions or shares - but came across this article on SeekingAlpha
https://seekingalpha.com/article/4275807-tesla-dem...
I don't think I have ever read such a pathetic attempt at an article, and have no idea why SeekingAlpha published it - it basically amounts to "Could Tesla be in trouble? I don't know and I am just guessing at the numbers, but listen to me anyway".
Normally SeekingAlpha is a half decent source of reading material if you play in the stock market, but that article is the most miserable, useless attempt at making your name in economics I have ever read...
https://seekingalpha.com/article/4275807-tesla-dem...
I don't think I have ever read such a pathetic attempt at an article, and have no idea why SeekingAlpha published it - it basically amounts to "Could Tesla be in trouble? I don't know and I am just guessing at the numbers, but listen to me anyway".
Normally SeekingAlpha is a half decent source of reading material if you play in the stock market, but that article is the most miserable, useless attempt at making your name in economics I have ever read...
Record deliveries shifts my guess of Q2 financials.
I now think it could get close to breakeven. $100m either side of breakeven is the range i’d go for. That from something like $1.2bn gross profit
Unless it is more than $500m either way, I don’t think it will move the needle much
Not sure on cashflow, but I think there will scrutiny of receivables / payables / emissions credits etc as usual
We will soon know
I now think it could get close to breakeven. $100m either side of breakeven is the range i’d go for. That from something like $1.2bn gross profit
Unless it is more than $500m either way, I don’t think it will move the needle much
Not sure on cashflow, but I think there will scrutiny of receivables / payables / emissions credits etc as usual
We will soon know
RobDickinson said:
sme gump said:
Q2 had lower list prices
Q2 had increased logistics costs.
Q2 had a delivery mix swing towards the lower price model.
On those points.. Q2 had increased logistics costs.
Q2 had a delivery mix swing towards the lower price model.
Q2 Tesla increased the base price of the model 3 variants (excluding 35k off men car)
By official statement they reduced logistics costs
I'm not sure what evidence you have for point 3 because almost all the euro cars were high end models, almost no sr+cars have reached Europe, and that's about 30k out of the 77k 3s
No way that logistics costs to export markets are lower than domestic. There has been a swing towards export according to what i can find online.
Q1 was 25% volume in s and x, Q2 was 22% volume in s and x. The mix is towards the cheaper model.
Roll on the 24th. It'll swap endless speculation for an actual set of results.
Edited by Some Gump on Friday 19th July 18:24
jjwilde said:
I wish Tesla would get on and release their pickup. It looks amazingly cool from what we've seen.
It’ll be interesting to see how a left wing, climate change believing, hippy, commie, traitor drivetrain will be accepted into a Freedom Fries, God loving, animal loving, apocalypse expecting, colour hating, sister loving body shape. It’s a massive market but when you start much more than 70 miles from the sea in America it goes Nazi mental really quickly.
It’s also a really US specific product in many ways which gives it weak appeal overseas in contrast to say a mid sized SUV.
hyphen said:
skwdenyer said:
On Brick Lane tonight, a white 2017 Model X 100D was parked, owned by a chauffeur company who operate only Teslas. Probably 50% of passers by stopped to take a look. At the same time, due to a local Asian wedding, one of the "yoot done good" was parading around in a hired Aventador. That Lamborghini got nary a glance compared to the Tesla.
It should be pointed out that Brick Lane is frequently home to glammed-up Range Rovers, various hired exotica, the odd Bentley or Rolls Royce, some Porsches, etc. Decent cars are not uncommon. Admiring glances are not unusual. But a gaggle of passers-by flocking around a plain white SUV asking "how much" and "how fast" and "only £60k for a 2017 plate with free fuel for life? I'm off to look on Autotrader!" is a little more unusual.
Nice anecdote. Meanwhile in the real world a member on here started a thread just a few days ago, saying its a nightmare to sell his X. Tesla won't buy it, no one else will, he is doing a sale or return...It should be pointed out that Brick Lane is frequently home to glammed-up Range Rovers, various hired exotica, the odd Bentley or Rolls Royce, some Porsches, etc. Decent cars are not uncommon. Admiring glances are not unusual. But a gaggle of passers-by flocking around a plain white SUV asking "how much" and "how fast" and "only £60k for a 2017 plate with free fuel for life? I'm off to look on Autotrader!" is a little more unusual.
"Tesla won't buy it" - I'm unclear why that's a surprise, as they don't have used car lots, a feature apparent to anyone buying one! Whilst one might imagine that, if they really can sell every one they make, they might like to make a turn on a used motor, but without physical customer inspection of used goods how could they make that work with their current sales model?
"No one else will" - the poster in that thread had a firm offer at £70k IIRC and a commission sale option listing at £82k. The poster believed his 67 car to have lifetime transferable supercharging (as many 17 cars have), but it doesn't. I don't know what that poster paid. But note that thread lasted just 3 days, starting with the poster having made some calls and ending with getting the above prices. Whilst we don't have the full timeline, "no one else will" seems a strange characterisation - not every £70-80k car is a commodity ready to be snapped up when you get the whim to sell it, is it? The market for second-hand £80k cars is often a little illiquid...
hyphen said:
skwdenyer said:
On Brick Lane tonight, a white 2017 Model X 100D was parked, owned by a chauffeur company who operate only Teslas. Probably 50% of passers by stopped to take a look. At the same time, due to a local Asian wedding, one of the "yoot done good" was parading around in a hired Aventador. That Lamborghini got nary a glance compared to the Tesla.
It should be pointed out that Brick Lane is frequently home to glammed-up Range Rovers, various hired exotica, the odd Bentley or Rolls Royce, some Porsches, etc. Decent cars are not uncommon. Admiring glances are not unusual. But a gaggle of passers-by flocking around a plain white SUV asking "how much" and "how fast" and "only £60k for a 2017 plate with free fuel for life? I'm off to look on Autotrader!" is a little more unusual.
Nice anecdote. Meanwhile in the real world a member on here started a thread just a few days ago, saying its a nightmare to sell his X. Tesla won't buy it, no one else will, he is doing a sale or return...It should be pointed out that Brick Lane is frequently home to glammed-up Range Rovers, various hired exotica, the odd Bentley or Rolls Royce, some Porsches, etc. Decent cars are not uncommon. Admiring glances are not unusual. But a gaggle of passers-by flocking around a plain white SUV asking "how much" and "how fast" and "only £60k for a 2017 plate with free fuel for life? I'm off to look on Autotrader!" is a little more unusual.
skwdenyer said:
But Tesla is already as large as BMW were when they launched the iconic E30 3 series
Im not sure you can directly compare the sales volumes of two dates that far apart...Edited by anonymous-user on Thursday 18th July 23:00
Are you imagining the poster standing there, counting the passers by, estimating how many of them were expressing positive comments as they stopped?
Doesn’t happen. Not even with proper super cars.
I doubt most people would even notice a Tesla of any flavour, anywhere, any more than any other car. They just don’t.
It’s the myth of fingerprints.
skwdenyer said:
hyphen said:
skwdenyer said:
On Brick Lane tonight, a white 2017 Model X 100D was parked, owned by a chauffeur company who operate only Teslas. Probably 50% of passers by stopped to take a look. At the same time, due to a local Asian wedding, one of the "yoot done good" was parading around in a hired Aventador. That Lamborghini got nary a glance compared to the Tesla.
It should be pointed out that Brick Lane is frequently home to glammed-up Range Rovers, various hired exotica, the odd Bentley or Rolls Royce, some Porsches, etc. Decent cars are not uncommon. Admiring glances are not unusual. But a gaggle of passers-by flocking around a plain white SUV asking "how much" and "how fast" and "only £60k for a 2017 plate with free fuel for life? I'm off to look on Autotrader!" is a little more unusual.
Nice anecdote. Meanwhile in the real world a member on here started a thread just a few days ago, saying its a nightmare to sell his X. Tesla won't buy it, no one else will, he is doing a sale or return...It should be pointed out that Brick Lane is frequently home to glammed-up Range Rovers, various hired exotica, the odd Bentley or Rolls Royce, some Porsches, etc. Decent cars are not uncommon. Admiring glances are not unusual. But a gaggle of passers-by flocking around a plain white SUV asking "how much" and "how fast" and "only £60k for a 2017 plate with free fuel for life? I'm off to look on Autotrader!" is a little more unusual.
"Tesla won't buy it" - I'm unclear why that's a surprise, as they don't have used car lots, a feature apparent to anyone buying one! Whilst one might imagine that, if they really can sell every one they make, they might like to make a turn on a used motor, but without physical customer inspection of used goods how could they make that work with their current sales model?
"No one else will" - the poster in that thread had a firm offer at £70k IIRC and a commission sale option listing at £82k. The poster believed his 67 car to have lifetime transferable supercharging (as many 17 cars have), but it doesn't. I don't know what that poster paid. But note that thread lasted just 3 days, starting with the poster having made some calls and ending with getting the above prices. Whilst we don't have the full timeline, "no one else will" seems a strange characterisation - not every £70-80k car is a commodity ready to be snapped up when you get the whim to sell it, is it? The market for second-hand £80k cars is often a little illiquid...
I've got enough data points to make your eyes weep at some of the price changes. A 2017 MX 100D average advertised price has dropped 11k in the last 3 months, it was holding its value fairly well, but its on a free fall at the moment as the P100Ds are tumbling after the price cuts earlier in the year.
These are the average advertsied prices each quarter for the make and model
REALIST123 said:
hyphen said:
skwdenyer said:
On Brick Lane tonight, a white 2017 Model X 100D was parked, owned by a chauffeur company who operate only Teslas. Probably 50% of passers by stopped to take a look. At the same time, due to a local Asian wedding, one of the "yoot done good" was parading around in a hired Aventador. That Lamborghini got nary a glance compared to the Tesla.
It should be pointed out that Brick Lane is frequently home to glammed-up Range Rovers, various hired exotica, the odd Bentley or Rolls Royce, some Porsches, etc. Decent cars are not uncommon. Admiring glances are not unusual. But a gaggle of passers-by flocking around a plain white SUV asking "how much" and "how fast" and "only £60k for a 2017 plate with free fuel for life? I'm off to look on Autotrader!" is a little more unusual.
Nice anecdote. Meanwhile in the real world a member on here started a thread just a few days ago, saying its a nightmare to sell his X. Tesla won't buy it, no one else will, he is doing a sale or return...It should be pointed out that Brick Lane is frequently home to glammed-up Range Rovers, various hired exotica, the odd Bentley or Rolls Royce, some Porsches, etc. Decent cars are not uncommon. Admiring glances are not unusual. But a gaggle of passers-by flocking around a plain white SUV asking "how much" and "how fast" and "only £60k for a 2017 plate with free fuel for life? I'm off to look on Autotrader!" is a little more unusual.
skwdenyer said:
But Tesla is already as large as BMW were when they launched the iconic E30 3 series
Im not sure you can directly compare the sales volumes of two dates that far apart...Edited by hyphen on Thursday 18th July 23:00
Are you imagining the poster standing there, counting the passers by, estimating how many of them were expressing positive comments as they stopped?
DonkeyApple said:
jjwilde said:
I wish Tesla would get on and release their pickup. It looks amazingly cool from what we've seen.
It’ll be interesting to see how a left wing, climate change believing, hippy, commie, traitor drivetrain will be accepted into a Freedom Fries, God loving, animal loving, apocalypse expecting, colour hating, sister loving body shape. It’s a massive market but when you start much more than 70 miles from the sea in America it goes Nazi mental really quickly.
It’s also a really US specific product in many ways which gives it weak appeal overseas in contrast to say a mid sized SUV.
But then again for the people who you refer to their hatred of being seen as ‘green’ probably overrules that.
JonChalk said:
Burwood said:
Burwood - what's the source for that photo, please?Or can I shamelessly steal it and re-post on SpeakEv - that opening vent in the ID.3 bonnet is curious & not seen that in any ID.3 picture before.
p1stonhead said:
JonChalk said:
Could actually be popped open for something?
k, I hate that word) on the ID.3 - traditional layout & storage. So not sure if it's cooling? maintenance?Gassing Station | EV and Alternative Fuels | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff