Labour to nationalise Tesla Superchargers
Discussion
Andeh1 said:
Kurok68, whilst I disagree with you, i am pleased to see you still debating here. Its interesting to know more about your/29% of the voting public's thoughts & thinking regarding Corbyn & Labour. 
I'm not actually a massive fan of Labour, I've voted for other parties in the past. I wish Corbyn had done more re Brexit.But right now they are the best choice. Boris is unfit and we can't take another 5 years of Tory government and Tory Brexit. The NHS can't take it, the police can't take it. Of course their spending pledges will be quickly forgotten after the election, as always.
Maybe the best outcome would be a coalition with Labour and either the SNP or the Lib Dems. Coalitions do moderate.
By the way, 30% today :-) If you compare to 2017 though the Tories are down 2-3% and Labour are down 7-8%. Their losses are mostly being picked up by the Lib Dems and Greens and SNP, with Brexit headed for oblivion. The way things stand it will either be a minority Tory government or a coalition.
Shuks76 said:
I know I said I was not going to say anything on this subject anymore, but when I read this I felt the need to point out that Corbyn has spent his whole political life trying to vote down EU legislation and was a true Bennite - always against the EU and what it stood for. He becomes Labour leader and all of a sudden doesn't seem to know what he wants anymore. How is that sticking to your principles? I call it cowardice. This is why Labour voters in Leave areas cannot trust the man anymore (leaving aside the weak response to Anti-semitism which is plain to see).
Boris was already a known Eurosceptic during his time as a journalist in Brussels. When it came to the Leave vote in the UK, he did what most people would do..write down the pros and cons and make a final choice. Since then, he not only helped win the Leave vote but now trying to get it done so democracy in this country does not get flushed down the toilet.
Corbyn has, first and foremost, always been a democrat. He's always been pushing to get power back into the hands of the people, and he is happy to have policy set by the Labour membership at conference.Boris was already a known Eurosceptic during his time as a journalist in Brussels. When it came to the Leave vote in the UK, he did what most people would do..write down the pros and cons and make a final choice. Since then, he not only helped win the Leave vote but now trying to get it done so democracy in this country does not get flushed down the toilet.
His stance on Brexit is what the party decided. At the moment it's what we need, a neutral leader to get the best possible deal and then let the people democratically decide if they want it or not.
Boris picked the side he thought would do his career the most good. He's on record as saying that the EU is overall a good thing and that the UK benefits from it, and that our problems are not the fault of the EU but of Tory policies. It's all on video, he made public speeches saying that. More recently he said May's deal was terrible and would damage the UK economy, and has now negotiated one that by his own standards is even worse.
Don't buy his rubbish about having got the EU to budge either. They originally suggested the border down the Irish sea, he just went back to the earlier plan and bulls
tted both sides by telling the EU there would be a border and NI that there wouldn't.kuro68k said:
Shuks76 said:
I know I said I was not going to say anything on this subject anymore, but when I read this I felt the need to point out that Corbyn has spent his whole political life trying to vote down EU legislation and was a true Bennite - always against the EU and what it stood for. He becomes Labour leader and all of a sudden doesn't seem to know what he wants anymore. How is that sticking to your principles? I call it cowardice. This is why Labour voters in Leave areas cannot trust the man anymore (leaving aside the weak response to Anti-semitism which is plain to see).
Boris was already a known Eurosceptic during his time as a journalist in Brussels. When it came to the Leave vote in the UK, he did what most people would do..write down the pros and cons and make a final choice. Since then, he not only helped win the Leave vote but now trying to get it done so democracy in this country does not get flushed down the toilet.
Corbyn has, first and foremost, always been a democrat. He's always been pushing to get power back into the hands of the people, and he is happy to have policy set by the Labour membership at conference.Boris was already a known Eurosceptic during his time as a journalist in Brussels. When it came to the Leave vote in the UK, he did what most people would do..write down the pros and cons and make a final choice. Since then, he not only helped win the Leave vote but now trying to get it done so democracy in this country does not get flushed down the toilet.
His stance on Brexit is what the party decided. At the moment it's what we need, a neutral leader to get the best possible deal and then let the people democratically decide if they want it or not.
Boris picked the side he thought would do his career the most good. He's on record as saying that the EU is overall a good thing and that the UK benefits from it, and that our problems are not the fault of the EU but of Tory policies. It's all on video, he made public speeches saying that. More recently he said May's deal was terrible and would damage the UK economy, and has now negotiated one that by his own standards is even worse.
Don't buy his rubbish about having got the EU to budge either. They originally suggested the border down the Irish sea, he just went back to the earlier plan and bulls
tted both sides by telling the EU there would be a border and NI that there wouldn't.Everything borris says is a lie or his spin on the truth. Corbyn was supposed to be whiter than white, a saviour and he can’t even be honest that he’s always supported brexit. He even wanted it before Farage had retired from the city and needed a hobby.
Corbyn lost his credibility over brexit, the party, and by that we mean the minority who are actually members, coupled with the majority of labour mps want remain.
Neutral is nothing but a con to keep the north east and other brexit voters happy in the labour heartlands. But it’s not working.
It’s a shame as a genuine socialist pm would have been an interesting proposition. Unfortunately like all mps he’s dishonest.
kuro68k said:
Reminded me a bit of Cameron. Not as bad as Boris but he certainly does better with questions from an audience.
Listening to Jewish people phoning in tonight to radio stations after the Andrew Neil interview in genuine fear is an extremely sad thing to witness. Your comments show a complete lack of understanding of the issues or you are just a paid up member of Momentum cc3 said:
Corbyn appalling tonight on the Andrew Neil interview. Utterly useless
and refusing to apologise for antisemitism. Quite extraordinary really - surely all he had to say was something along the lines of "...I'm sorry you feel that way. I'm not Jewish and so can't comment on whether or not you feel labour is racist but as leader the buck has to stop with me so I apologise for this and pledge to root this out"simple
Flumpo said:
Do you genuinely believe the party chose a neutral stance on brexit?[\quote]
Labour? They have take positions throughout the whole process, whipping MPs to vote one way or another. It's only Corbyn who says he will be neutral if there is a 2nd referendum.
[quote]Everything borris says is a lie or his spin on the truth. Corbyn was supposed to be whiter than white, a saviour and he can’t even be honest that he’s always supported brexit. He even wanted it before Farage had retired from the city and needed a hobby.
Corbyn's scepticism is well documented and I don't think he or Labour in general ever tried to paint him as "whiter than white", especially not on Brexit. I'm not happy with his position either but at the moment Labour are the best hope for getting it resolved one way or another.Labour? They have take positions throughout the whole process, whipping MPs to vote one way or another. It's only Corbyn who says he will be neutral if there is a 2nd referendum.
[quote]Everything borris says is a lie or his spin on the truth. Corbyn was supposed to be whiter than white, a saviour and he can’t even be honest that he’s always supported brexit. He even wanted it before Farage had retired from the city and needed a hobby.
cc3 said:
Listening to Jewish people phoning in tonight to radio stations after the Andrew Neil interview in genuine fear is an extremely sad thing to witness. Your comments show a complete lack of understanding of the issues or you are just a paid up member of Momentum
I don't know why he didn't apologise. I guess his spin doctors told him not to, which is why I said he reminds me of Cameron.He should apologise. Same as Boris should. But neither of them will because the strategists have decided that apologising is a bad idea. Nick Clegg famously apologised and it didn't do him much good, so maybe they are right.
I'm not a member of any party. I'm a floating voter, I don't have loyalty to anyone. This time around the best thing is to vote tactically, which for me means Labour. The worst possible outcome is a Boris majority or Boris/Farage supervillain team-up. More than anything I just detest the way so much BS is spread around about everyone and important decisions that will take years, maybe decades to undo get made in this way.
kuro68k said:
cc3 said:
Listening to Jewish people phoning in tonight to radio stations after the Andrew Neil interview in genuine fear is an extremely sad thing to witness. Your comments show a complete lack of understanding of the issues or you are just a paid up member of Momentum
I don't know why he didn't apologise. I guess his spin doctors told him not to, which is why I said he reminds me of Cameron.He should apologise. Same as Boris should. But neither of them will because the strategists have decided that apologising is a bad idea. Nick Clegg famously apologised and it didn't do him much good, so maybe they are right.
I'm not a member of any party. I'm a floating voter, I don't have loyalty to anyone. This time around the best thing is to vote tactically, which for me means Labour. The worst possible outcome is a Boris majority or Boris/Farage supervillain team-up. More than anything I just detest the way so much BS is spread around about everyone and important decisions that will take years, maybe decades to undo get made in this way.
If labour win it will be by a slim majority. The Lib Dem’s won’t join with him (I don’t think) as they are fundamentally opposed to his ideology. The reason they joined with the conservatives is that we all know, the Lib Dem’s are just the soft wing of the Conservative party. The ones who didn’t want to be seen as right wing nasty tory, while looking down on the working class labour voter.
So, Corbyn does a deal with snp. They get a referendum, they vote out. What does that do to the overall brexit result if the Scottish votes are removed? = bigger majority brexit.
The best outcome is vote for what you want. If you want out vote for the only party who are doing out. Lib Dem’s. Let labour implode and split back into new labour and a momentum party.
The new, new, labour might offer some reasonable opposition and will likely win the next election. They will likely also be prob remai and can offer closer ties to the Eu. Let’s face it, borris is offering Eu membership in all but name.
That’s your tactical voting if you want remain.
Edited by Flumpo on Wednesday 27th November 14:33
otolith said:
Lib Dems are the people left homeless when the two main parties go mad.
I don’t know. There was that stage where they had that leader who believed homosexuals burnt in hell for eternity.Well, until he back tracked, did he apologise? I can’t remember.
Even the greens tend to be total hypocrites.
Flumpo said:
Are you sure you’ve got your tactics right? A labour government t will result in brexit.
I don't think so. The SNP are saying indyref2 late next year, after Labour would have have the 2nd brexit vote. So chances are brexit will be cancelled.I think you should vote tactically for whoever can beat the Tories where you are. For me that's Labour, for you it might be Lib Dems or SNP or Plaid or Greens. The one certainty is that if Boris wins we get an awful, hard brexit and then probably crash out in December 2020 when they fail to agree a trade deal.
Flumpo said:
otolith said:
Lib Dems are the people left homeless when the two main parties go mad.
I don’t know. There was that stage where they had that leader who believed homosexuals burnt in hell for eternity.Well, until he back tracked, did he apologise? I can’t remember.
Even the greens tend to be total hypocrites.
https://www.politicshome.com/news/uk/political-par...
They need to keep them to themselves, and vote with their party on areas where the party and their faith diverge.
I was talking more about not being drooling Brexiteers or raving Marxists in this case.
otolith said:
Flumpo said:
otolith said:
Lib Dems are the people left homeless when the two main parties go mad.
I don’t know. There was that stage where they had that leader who believed homosexuals burnt in hell for eternity.Well, until he back tracked, did he apologise? I can’t remember.
Even the greens tend to be total hypocrites.
https://www.politicshome.com/news/uk/political-par...
They need to keep them to themselves, and vote with their party on areas where the party and their faith diverge.
I was talking more about not being drooling Brexiteers or raving Marxists in this case.
kuro68k said:
Flumpo said:
Are you sure you’ve got your tactics right? A labour government t will result in brexit.
I don't think so. The SNP are saying indyref2 late next year, after Labour would have have the 2nd brexit vote. So chances are brexit will be cancelled.I think you should vote tactically for whoever can beat the Tories where you are. For me that's Labour, for you it might be Lib Dems or SNP or Plaid or Greens. The one certainty is that if Boris wins we get an awful, hard brexit and then probably crash out in December 2020 when they fail to agree a trade deal.
Don’t forget Corbyn wants brexit.
Flumpo said:
Do you think if there is a brexit vote and the result is marginally remain with Scotland’s votes, then Scotland vote for independence, there won’t need to be another brexit vote?!
Don’t forget Corbyn wants brexit.
I don't think there will be the will to have another brexit vote. People just want it to be over, they are fed up with it. Problem is a lot of them seem to think that voting for another decade of it is somehow going to deliver that.Don’t forget Corbyn wants brexit.
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