Base Tesla cheaper overall than a £5K barge ?

[Spunagain]

gangzoom said:

They have, the repair or even replacement of the MCU isn't the issue. Its the inconvenience of not been able to just drop the car off at the local garage for it to be sorted and turned round quickly.

If I got in my car today at 7am aiming to get to work for 745am and found the car/MCU dead what would I do??

For a single day or even a few days I can probably get around the problem of not having a car, but if its going to take 1 week to sort out, I have to arrange the MCU to be removed/sent to third party for repair/and or pay for the car to be towed etc to a dealer 60 miles away it becomes a major pain.

If you have access to a 2nd/3rd car having a dead Tesla on the driveway till its repaired is probably OK. But if its your only car, life will become a pain very quickly.

Buying an out of warranty Tesla isn't to be done without realising what you are potentially letting your self in for.

The MMC card is a non-volatile memory chip soldered onto the Media Control unit (MCU) – the computer behind the big screen. Everything the car did used to be logged on this, and as it filled up it was overwritten. The problem is that so much data was written that the maximum number of write cycles for the chip Tesla used can get exceeded and the data can then become corrupted causing problems. There are a few blogs and YouTube videos about this. Since it came to light last year Tesla have apparently pushed updates which has reduced the quantity of logged data, but for many that may be too late. The official Tesla solution is to replace with MCU with a new/refurbed one which can cost $2500 or so.

More Googling suggested that one of the symptoms of a failing MMC chip was the web browser not working, so I checked mine and sure enough it does not work even with the recent new browser SW update.

So I contacted the company that the guys on the Facebook group have used and rated highly. The company is EV Link Ltd in Buckingham and you can call them on 01280 830530 or email [e-mail].

I spoke to Gary who runs the company who have been doing these replacements for about 9 months now, and booked the car in for a new MMC chip – a new 12V battery and a check of the screen connections and if needed to re-flow the solder on the screen controller chip.

He quoted me £180 for the battery + half an hour fitting (it is buried quite deep in the car) and £500 for the MMC replacement, + whatever time was needed to fix the screen. He expected the whole lot to be around £700. For context I just got the Volvo XC90 serviced at the main dealer with new front brake pads and disks which costed over £800. The Volvo will be sold at easter and the Tesla will no be the main family car!

The whole process takes 2-3 days as the old MMC chip needs to be removed, the data extracted from the chip, the data uncorrupted – rebuilt, put on the new chip and then the chip put back on the MCU. The data extraction is semi-automated but the application which does it can take days if the data is badly corrupted and needs quite a lot of human intervention to make it work. Gary replaces the 8GB chip with a 64GB which also has a much higher rewrite specification so on those numbers this should be good for at least another 32 years! In reality at least 10 years is a good benchmark as most silicon chips are only really qualified for 10 years of active life.

EV Link are the only company in the UK so far that I am aware of who offer this service and Gary has his own model S which was his guinea pig. There is no website yet but there is a Facebook page which is in it’s infancy – Gary is too busy fixing Tesla MMCs to work on his web presence!

They are just over an hour away from me Newbury, and while Gary does not have a courtesy car, the pointed me to a hire car company round the corner called Rentamech hire car (01280 815680) and they do a Hyundai I10 for £26 per day or £27 for the auto (the only one available for when I booked it).

I am booked in on Wednesday and will report back on my readers car thread how I get on!

[jamoor]

This kind of stuff is all very normal for people who fix electronics, none of it is rocket science. The skills already exist in abundance.

[Heres Johnny]

The issue with the eMMC other than the hassle is that if the memory fails badly and a number of key files can not be read, the thing is dead.

And Tesla haven't fixed the issue, they've done two things, used more memory on the MCU2 and reduced the logging - both just extend the time to failure, they havent actually used decent memory.

gang talks about it like you might change the memory card in a camera - not so.

And while skills may exist, microelectronics repairers and auto repairers are usually not one and the same.

[gangzoom]

Heres Johnny said:

gang talks about it like you might change the memory card in a camera - not so.

Have I? I've said I don't find it a problem paying someone to fix/replace the MCU, but the hassle associated with having a car out of action for potentially weeks is massive.

If it was as easy as changing a memory card that would be fab, but its not, and its a guaranteed fail point for every Tesla made to date, including all Model 3s.

[superpp]

silentbrown said:

OP, your electricity costs seem to be based on charging at home. if you regularly have to use other chargers, costs will be much higher.

or less, just done a weekend trip Preston to Newcastle (and back) and had totally free charging (Ecotricity and PodPoint)

[audi321]

gangzoom said:

audi321 said:

Can you link to a tool that gives this information?

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.emon.canbus.tesla&hl=en_GB

This is the App, you need to source a suitable adaptor to plug into the car, I don't think its hard to make one and get a cheap OBD/Bluetooth transmitter off eBay, but am lazy so paid the £50 or so for someone else to do it for me.

https://e-mobility-driving-solutions.com/produkt-k...

Cheers. Doesn’t look like there’s an IOS version though

[RobDickinson]

audi321 said:

gangzoom said:

audi321 said:

Can you link to a tool that gives this information?

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.emon.canbus.tesla&hl=en_GB

This is the App, you need to source a suitable adaptor to plug into the car, I don't think its hard to make one and get a cheap OBD/Bluetooth transmitter off eBay, but am lazy so paid the £50 or so for someone else to do it for me.

https://e-mobility-driving-solutions.com/produkt-k...

Cheers. Doesn’t look like there’s an IOS version though

Any cheapo android phone should run it though

[PushedDover]

Heres Johnny said:

The issue with the eMMC other than the hassle is that if the memory fails badly and a number of key files can not be read, the thing is dead.

And Tesla haven't fixed the issue, they've done two things, used more memory on the MCU2 and reduced the logging - both just extend the time to failure, they havent actually used decent memory.

gang talks about it like you might change the memory card in a camera - not so.

And while skills may exist, microelectronics repairers and auto repairers are usually not one and the same.

Harsh.

Porsche had IMS and bore scoring, BMW Nikosil , tesla seems to have this.
All are 'bad luck' flaws.

[Heres Johnny]

PushedDover said:

Heres Johnny said:

The issue with the eMMC other than the hassle is that if the memory fails badly and a number of key files can not be read, the thing is dead.

And Tesla haven't fixed the issue, they've done two things, used more memory on the MCU2 and reduced the logging - both just extend the time to failure, they havent actually used decent memory.

gang talks about it like you might change the memory card in a camera - not so.

And while skills may exist, microelectronics repairers and auto repairers are usually not one and the same.

Harsh.

Porsche had IMS and bore scoring, BMW Nikosil , tesla seems to have this.
All are 'bad luck' flaws.

And what did BMW do? They did a recall, Tesla put just ignore your calls.

[jamoor]

Heres Johnny said:

PushedDover said:

Heres Johnny said:

The issue with the eMMC other than the hassle is that if the memory fails badly and a number of key files can not be read, the thing is dead.

And Tesla haven't fixed the issue, they've done two things, used more memory on the MCU2 and reduced the logging - both just extend the time to failure, they havent actually used decent memory.

gang talks about it like you might change the memory card in a camera - not so.

And while skills may exist, microelectronics repairers and auto repairers are usually not one and the same.

Harsh.

Porsche had IMS and bore scoring, BMW Nikosil , tesla seems to have this.
All are 'bad luck' flaws.

And what did BMW do? They did a recall, Tesla put just ignore your calls.

They should recall swirl flaps, did they recall the timing chain problem? I don’t actually know.
Oh and rod bearings on M engines.

[Heres Johnny]

jamoor said:

They should recall swirl flaps, did they recall the timing chain problem? I don’t actually know.
Oh and rod bearings on M engines.

Nothing like making a point and then admitting you have no idea what the story was.

The problem with Tesla isn't the issues, its the fact they refuse to accept they should address them and further, they have changed their warranty document to tell owners they want to be able to to do whatever they want in the future.

Imagine Apple changing the warranty on their phones to say "we can change the usable part of the screen through a software update and its outside warranty"

[anonymous-user]

I hope the older commentators shift their attention to model 3 sooner rather than later. SX is becoming more niche and presumably model 3 owners are the larger audience .

This thread is about the 'base' Tesla which presumably refers to SR+? It's a bit off putting when every thread gets derailed with stories about SX. As far as I'm concerned they are different cars so talk about MCU write issues presumably not that relavant to vast majority ofd readers thinking about buying a new 3?



I'm guessing.

[Heres Johnny]

Sambucket said:

I hope the older commentators shift their attention to model 3 sooner rather than later. SX is becoming more niche and presumably model 3 owners are the larger audience .

This thread is about the 'base' Tesla which presumably refers to SR+? It's a bit off putting when every thread gets derailed with stories about SX. As far as I'm concerned they are different cars so talk about MCU write issues presumably not that relavant to vast majority ofd readers thinking about buying a new 3?



I'm guessing.

The warranty points are about the Model 3 as much as any other model - and Tesla are already showing the same behaviours - there are reports of Tesla trying to avoid replacing the rear glass thats failed due to a stress fracture claiming a impact damage when none can be seen, the software issues are common across the range etc,

The MCU problem can also occur on the M3 as they are using the same cheap tat memory, the saving grace is they have reduced logging and have more memory to play with buy it will be interesting to see if the widespread use of sentry mode trtashes that memory instead of logging, memory cars only being used for liong term storage of events. We just don't know yet, but we do know its a poor choice of component.

[anonymous-user]

What evidence is there that Model 3 suffers same fault? A quick search on TMC suggests it's not the same memory?

How does Tesla's warranty claims compare with other low volume premium cars? Porsche, LR etc? Lots of noisy forum posts but I'd be interested to see the stats as my warranty experience has been pretty faultless so far.

It feels sometimes like SX (and AP1) owners are dismissive of the possibility that Tesla have improved their cars in past 3 years.

[gangzoom]

Sambucket said:

It feels sometimes like SX (and AP1) owners are dismissive of the possibility that Tesla have improved their cars in past 3 years.

I would say the opposite, S/X owners have seen Tesla go from an exciting company willing to put customers before profit to one that's increasing a clone of VAG, backed by the same morals which saw fake 'scientific' test of primates to try and produce a fake image of 'clean' diesel.

No one forced anyone to buy a Tesla, and S/X owners almost by default usually have enough capital to jump to any other brand.

If Tesla is essentially now the electric version of VAG, why would I buy a Roadster 2.0 when I can now get the same experience from Porsche but backed by a dealership 10 minute drive away from out house rather than having to go down the M6 or M1 when ever there is a problem with the car??

As much as I love our X, our next EV will almost certainly by a Lexus, and for me the Taycan ticks everybox once we don't need a car the size of the X.

[anonymous-user]

Just noticed this. You should have reposted your workings OP if you want relevant info.

You will spend at least double on tyres unless you drive in chill mode.

You are missing VED.

Maintance over 10 years is optimistic. You will save on pads etc, but there will likely be other unforeseen stuff come up. If not the MCU, there is bound to be other stuff unique to Tesla's. As mentioned, no extended warranty does suggest cost of ownershiup will shoot up after 4 years. So for 10 years, worth bumping this up.

My service experience of the 3 has been faultless so far, but I live close to a service centre so probably a factor is where you live vs nearest centre?

WHy omit MOT from the Tesla list?

I don't understand the resale figure?

I would be cautious of basing decision on company car savings. BIK might go up again. Simplified, you only write off the depreciation.

Edited by anonymous-user on Tuesday 25th February 09:50

[anonymous-user]

gangzoom said:

Sambucket said:

It feels sometimes like SX (and AP1) owners are dismissive of the possibility that Tesla have improved their cars in past 3 years.

I would say the opposite, S/X owners have seen Tesla go from an exciting company willing to put customers before profit to one that's increasing a clone of VAG, backed by the same morals which saw fake 'scientific' test of primates to try and produce a fake image of 'clean' diesel.

OP I'm not saying this is wrong exactly, buyt if you want honest objective advice about a new model 3, I would be a little careful with advice from ownders of pre-raven SX, because your experience of owning a 2020 model 3 will probably be very different (in good ways and bad).

Edited by anonymous-user on Tuesday 25th February 11:00

[gangzoom]

Sambucket said:

I would be a little careful with advice from ownders of pre-raven SX, because your experience of owning a 2020 model 3 will probably be very different (in good ways and bad).

Really, I see plenty of reports of Model 3s been left stranded at the side of road because Tesla didn't connect a cable properly.

The cars may be good, but as a company Tesla still haven't got a clue how to actually build cars. Oh post Raven Xs still suffer from the same drivetrain shudder as older cars, actually it seems worse, as least pre Raven cars now have a 'fix', though its not actually a 'fix' as you can still hear the front motor unit rattling like a rusty exhaust its just now they have isolated the associated vibration.

Tesla's attitude towards their customers have got markedly worse since the Model 3, I see little difference between how Tesla operates now versus likes of BMW/VAG etc.

Tesla share price might be doing great, but as a company their are losing their charm very quickly.

[jamoor]

Heres Johnny said:

The issue with the eMMC other than the hassle is that if the memory fails badly and a number of key files can not be read, the thing is dead.

And Tesla haven't fixed the issue, they've done two things, used more memory on the MCU2 and reduced the logging - both just extend the time to failure, they havent actually used decent memory.

gang talks about it like you might change the memory card in a camera - not so.

And while skills may exist, microelectronics repairers and auto repairers are usually not one and the same.

Why do you need an auto repairer to fix an electronics fault? It’s a new market for people that fix electronics.

[anonymous-user]

I think my point about SX owners derailing model 3 threads with their SX rage, is proved valid.

Too early to tell, but noticeable how few complaints there are from early 3 buyers on here.

I'd be angry too if I bought a lemon X and got the runaround.

Edited by anonymous-user on Tuesday 25th February 12:40