BMW iX3 launched
Discussion
cc3 said:
Made in China so no chance I would even consider it. Deliveries mid 2021 it’s a year behind the curve and nothing ground breaking. Performance looks average. No design flair it’s just an average effort that’s late to market
It's just an electric version of an existing mainstream SUV. It was never going to have any design flair. 
kambites said:
The specs look very well judged for a family car, but a near £20k price hike from the entry point into the conventional X3 range seems excessive.
Have you seen the price of JLR products used for taking Tarquin to school?Mummy can justify it because it's eco - innit (having already stunted lung growth)
Best part of £60k with a few options for the budget RWD model though?
I hope this bombs, it's just appears lazy and for me would be bottom of the list behind the Model Y, iPace, Polestar 2, EQC and Etron. And that's coming from someone who's owned multiple BMW's over the past 20 years.
I hope this bombs, it's just appears lazy and for me would be bottom of the list behind the Model Y, iPace, Polestar 2, EQC and Etron. And that's coming from someone who's owned multiple BMW's over the past 20 years.
I think the big question at the moment with these sorts of cars is when will a mainstream manufacturer commit to EVs properly and price them based on protected economies of scale matching a normal mainstream vehicle. Comparing this to the base petrol version of the same car, I suspect the fundemental difference in cost of production is no more than around £5k; the other £15k of the price difference is all down to BMW not thinking they'll sell enough of them to make up the devleopment costs but of course that's something of a self-fulfilling prophesy.
I think once one well established company takes that leap of faith, it'll open the flood gates. The obvious possibility in Europe is the ID3.
I think once one well established company takes that leap of faith, it'll open the flood gates. The obvious possibility in Europe is the ID3.
Edited by kambites on Tuesday 14th July 13:11
jjwilde said:
Has any manufacturer even come close to Tesla in terms of specs yet? This seems worse than the first ModelS.
Depends which specs you care about I suppose. I don't think anyone else is trying to beat Tesla in the rather arbitrary acceleration numbers. I can see why Tesla did what they did to break the general perception that EVs are slow and dull, but not I think the difference betwen 0-60 in 5 seconds and 2 seconds is utterly irrelevant to the market as a whole. What other specs are there? The Koreans have matched (or bettered) Tesla for real-world efficiency. Porsche have beaten them for charging speed given a suitable charger. Total range I think Tesla are still at or near the top, but again that's because no-one else thinks there is the commercial justification for going higher rather than because they can't...
Tesla are still there or there abouts for most EV-specific stuff but they're no longer a mile ahead of everyone else in any specific way I don't think. At least in terms of the cars themselves.
IMO the real game-changer now is going to be the first C-segment (family car) with a decent range from an established mainstream brand (ie not MG) which breaks under the £30k barrier in a spec someone actually wants to buy.
Edited by kambites on Tuesday 14th July 13:35
kambites said:
jjwilde said:
Has any manufacturer even come close to Tesla in terms of specs yet? This seems worse than the first ModelS.
Depends which specs you care about I suppose. I don't think anyone else is trying to beat Tesla in the rather arbitrary acceleration numbers. I can see why Tesla did what they did to break the general perception that EVs are slow and dull, but not I think the difference betwen 0-60 in 5 seconds and 2 seconds is utterly irrelevant to the market as a whole. What other specs are there? The Koreans have matched (or bettered) Tesla for real-world efficiency. Porsche have beaten them for charging speed given a suitable charger. Total range I think Tesla are still at or near the top, but again that's because no-one else thinks there is the commercial justification for going higher rather than because they can't...
Tesla are still there or there abouts for most EV-specific stuff but they're no longer a mile ahead of everyone else in any specific way I don't think. At least in terms of the cars themselves.
IMO the real game-changer now is going to be the first C-segment (family car) with a decent range from an established mainstream brand (ie not MG) which breaks under the £30k barrier in a spec someone actually wants to buy.
Edited by kambites on Tuesday 14th July 13:35
Getting there in 3 seconds is fun, it’s impressive, it’s also irrelevant for most people. Family cars do 0 to 60 in about 8 to 10 seconds. That isn’t because they’re feeble or can’t be made to go faster. It’s a well judged performance level for the vast majority of people, where they drive and how they use their cars. Knock it down to 7 for something with a bit more performance for the family man that still wants a bit of poke, maybe into the 5-6s for a hot version for the enthusiast. Much beyond that it’s super car territory and you’ll find you either don’t have the space or road to deploy that kind of power safely or you just won’t want to...plenty of Tesla owners say they have their car in chill mode because hitting the speed limit in <5 just isn’t necessary to day to day driving.
As for this thing, performance is fine, though I suspect maybe it was curtailed to save the graces of the new X3M which has a proper “S” designated straight six and is by all accounts a bit of a weapon. But the price? Far too much. It’s also an ICE car with EV bits which isn’t something I’m keen on given the flexibility afforded by not having to design for an engine, fuel tank, trans etc.
As you say, the real breakthrough in EVs will be whoever can make an EV that regular families can buy. That means b/c-segment hatchbacks with decent range (needs to be 150 solid miles), for the kind of £20-25k bracket. Before incentives. The Zoe is kinda there, but it’s a small car, if it was Megane sized for the money, it’d be major. MG ZS EV is probably the closest, but rightly or wrongly will suffer from “duff badge” syndrome.
They’re not going to get any kind of traction until the mass market can afford them. And for the mass market it doesn’t have to be the most advanced, most fastest thing ever. It only has to be good enough, cheap and easy. It’s VHS vs Betamax. The latter was technically superior, but it didn’t matter because VHS was cheaper, easier and though the quality was worse, it was good enough and the tapes recorded for longer so you could record movies easily.
Edited by Otispunkmeyer on Tuesday 14th July 16:34
RobDickinson said:
Forget Tesla, no one seriously considering a model Y would look at this.
But if I was in the market for a premium German electric SUV why would I look at this over an e-tron or even an EQC? I cant see any reason unless your company car list is made up of BMWs.
The only reason to choose this car is either company car tax breaks or BMW finance pushing these harder than Mercedes or Audi finance for thier productsBut if I was in the market for a premium German electric SUV why would I look at this over an e-tron or even an EQC? I cant see any reason unless your company car list is made up of BMWs.
REALIST123 said:
5 posts to turn it into yet another Tesla borefest.
Ironically its been people like 'REALIST123' telling us, for literal years on here, in every tesla related thread, that we need to wait for the German manufacturers to build EVs , they'll build great ones, TESLA KILLERS! Any day now!!Yet when they release this hot garbage and we point out its a little short on, well, basically everything, we are turning it into a borefest?
kambites said:
IMO the real game-changer now is going to be the first C-segment (family car) with a decent range from an established mainstream brand (ie not MG) which breaks under the £30k barrier in a spec someone actually wants to buy.
That'll be the ID3 then. Golf sized car with a passat size interior, starts under 30k and is from the most mainstream brand of all.Edited by kambites on Tuesday 14th July 13:35
If volkwagen market it properly and the lease/PCP deals are attractive, it should change the game. (but not 'crush' or 'beat' tesla, as dull car reviewers like to say in any ev review...)
George Smiley said:
Another car thats converted into EV with all the drawbacks that generates.
That said, I would consider a Mini-E but why are people wrapping new tech into old designs
Cos once you’ve invested in all that new tech having to develop a new model can make it quite a tall order for cash flow and investment compared to shoe horning into an existing platform as a bit of an experiment. That said, I would consider a Mini-E but why are people wrapping new tech into old designs
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