Easee seems to have a problem
Discussion
For clarity, I don't have inside knowledge about the alleged RCD problem, but going by publicly available information...
I have seen the response by Easee, and understand their position.
The device does have RCD protection, and can be demonstrated to operate correctly - hence not being spotted as a problem before.
However, the specs - to the letter - do define operation which is different to the way that the Easee EVSE has implemented it.
It would need a full circuit analysis to determine if it is truly compliant.
I am looking out for Elsälerhetverket's response.
Again sorry if it is off topic - I know the main focus of this forum is the useability of EVSE rather than technical design/analysis.
I have seen the response by Easee, and understand their position.
The device does have RCD protection, and can be demonstrated to operate correctly - hence not being spotted as a problem before.
However, the specs - to the letter - do define operation which is different to the way that the Easee EVSE has implemented it.
It would need a full circuit analysis to determine if it is truly compliant.
I am looking out for Elsälerhetverket's response.
Again sorry if it is off topic - I know the main focus of this forum is the useability of EVSE rather than technical design/analysis.
BTW: The name of the above mentioned Swedish institution is "Elsäkerhetsverket"
https://www.elsakerhetsverket.se/
https://www.elsakerhetsverket.se/
SAAB95Aero said:
BTW: The name of the above mentioned Swedish institution is "Elsäkerhetsverket"
https://www.elsakerhetsverket.se/
Ha ha! Now I look illiterate - at least in Swedish.https://www.elsakerhetsverket.se/
I couldn't spell it initially so cut and pasted from the originally linked electrive.com article - looks like they couldn't spell it either.
Edited by No ideas for a name on Friday 24th February 21:11
Raj28 said:
I have to say, I also don't like the idea of being dependant on a manufacturer cloud server to run an app layer!
I fully accept it is a Bee I have in my bonnet about this, but I really don't like it either.EVSE manufacturers should stick to building the EVSE hardware along with its 'local OS' and provide a documented interface for local and external control. In that way there is no dependancy on the manufacturer of the hardware.
If an open interface is used such as OCPP, then the world can offer management software and so called apps. If they go bump, the installed base can just move to another provider that uses that standard interface. Interestingly in the diagrams of the OCPP system, nohwere does it show the manufacturer's layer being necessary.
Easee were very open in my discussions with them and didn't try and hide anything. They gave me a link to their up-time https://status.easee.com but that isn't the issue.
The manufacturer could cease trading, or could decide not to support 'chargers' over say 5 years old - not saying they will, but it is an extra layer which isn't necessary. You could also have a local network outage (would have to be the built-in GSM and WiFi) and not be able to control the unit (I am told that it will function as a very dumb charger and supply power as soon as connected to the EV, if comms fail).
Oddly, though it will connect back via your local WiFi network, it does this to reach Easee servers - which then listen for commands from third party apps.
ETA: All I think is necessary is a local API that allows starting, stopping and setting a max rate. This then does away with all this proprietry nonsense of 'is it solar compatible' etc. In my case I would use home automation software to decide when to charge... it knows how much 'spare' solar generation there is, it can quite happily manage all this without manufacturer dependancy.
Edited by No ideas for a name on Friday 24th February 21:32
As far as I can see, there is no conclusion to this yet, but it isn't looking too good.
Link to an article with comment on Easee's position - though note it is effectively from a competitor.
https://www.electrive.com/2023/02/22/exclusive-iec...
I have to say I am a bit uneasy (no pun) about the implementation. The contact separation issue (if described accurately) would be a big problem.
It isn't to be confused with the lack of a separate DIN rail mounted RCD.
If that is the only critical issue, then it could possibly be solved by adding an upstream RCD, or better still changing the cable protection MCB to an RCBO. You may well then run in to issues with automatic testing and reconnection. Easee does a self test that may trip an upstream RCD?
For what it is worth, I used to design electronics for 'big' protection relays for transportation... 750VDC with fault currents around 20kA.
Following this issue with interest.
Link to an article with comment on Easee's position - though note it is effectively from a competitor.
https://www.electrive.com/2023/02/22/exclusive-iec...
I have to say I am a bit uneasy (no pun) about the implementation. The contact separation issue (if described accurately) would be a big problem.
It isn't to be confused with the lack of a separate DIN rail mounted RCD.
If that is the only critical issue, then it could possibly be solved by adding an upstream RCD, or better still changing the cable protection MCB to an RCBO. You may well then run in to issues with automatic testing and reconnection. Easee does a self test that may trip an upstream RCD?
For what it is worth, I used to design electronics for 'big' protection relays for transportation... 750VDC with fault currents around 20kA.
Following this issue with interest.
Elsäkerhetsverket banned the Easee Home and Easee Charge charging boxes for use in Sweden yesterday.
https://www-elsakerhetsverket-se.translate.goog/om...
https://www-elsakerhetsverket-se.translate.goog/om...
SAAB95Aero said:
Elsäkerhetsverket banned the Easee Home and Easee Charge charging boxes for use in Sweden yesterday.
https://www-elsakerhetsverket-se.translate.goog/om...
That is a (obviously) a really bad position for Easee.https://www-elsakerhetsverket-se.translate.goog/om...
I look forward to the full report to see the exact issues that they are not happy with - the press statement hasn't mentioned contact seperation for instance - which I know was one of their issues.
100k units installed in Sweden, which Easee will have to rectify.
I assume that since the rules are harmonised in the EU, then this ruling may also spread to other EU countries.
If it were to cost 'only' £100 to fix, then that is a £10M hit in Sweden alone.
I wish Easee no ills - I have spoken with people there and they seem a really great company - however, this sort of hit could easily finish an organisation off (absolutley no idea if Easee can absorb such a loss).
This goes back to the point that i keep making about ongoing dependance on manufacturer's servers. Even third-party control applications still use Easee's backend for connectivity - this makes the installed base vulnerable to manufacturer failure.
A quick scan read of the info shows that maybe a solution could be to swap the upstream cable protection MCB, for an RCBO with AC and DC protection. Some small software changes on the Easee unit to effectively disable the built in RCD and its regular testing may be a solution.
I have zero competence with electrical devices such as the Easee charging box, but I understand that the Norwegian Automobile Association (NAF), have for a long time questioned that Easee uses software instead of mechanical components for grounding protection. Even though there have been no accidents or failures, so far, with the Easee charging boxes, NAF (like Elsäkerhetsverket) questions the long term reliability of Easee’s software solutions.
If the Swedish ban on Easee charging boxes remains in place, after Easee’s legal response, the Easee charging box ban will also be implemented in the EU and also here in Norway. I doubt the Easee company will survive if the ban remains in place.
If the Swedish ban on Easee charging boxes remains in place, after Easee’s legal response, the Easee charging box ban will also be implemented in the EU and also here in Norway. I doubt the Easee company will survive if the ban remains in place.
Not looking much better for Easee.
Norway’s Nkom could follow sales ban on Easee wall boxes
<<Easee beholds, it relies on a specially developed software solution with sensors instead of an electromechanical RCD in a DIN housing. But, in the view of the Swedish authorities, there is still a risk “that the earth leakage circuit breaker does not always trip when and as it should”, and a sales stop was imposed on the ‘Ready’ and ‘Charge’ wall boxes of the Norwegian manufacturer in mid-March. There was “no solution with residual current circuit breaker and DC protection that meets the requirements of the standards for which the device is declared”, Elsälerhetverket said.>>
Easee are apparently developing a replacement.
https://kommunikasjon-ntb-no.translate.goog/presse...
Norway’s Nkom could follow sales ban on Easee wall boxes
<<Easee beholds, it relies on a specially developed software solution with sensors instead of an electromechanical RCD in a DIN housing. But, in the view of the Swedish authorities, there is still a risk “that the earth leakage circuit breaker does not always trip when and as it should”, and a sales stop was imposed on the ‘Ready’ and ‘Charge’ wall boxes of the Norwegian manufacturer in mid-March. There was “no solution with residual current circuit breaker and DC protection that meets the requirements of the standards for which the device is declared”, Elsälerhetverket said.>>
Easee are apparently developing a replacement.
https://kommunikasjon-ntb-no.translate.goog/presse...
Easee have a new model out.
https://kommunikasjon-ntb-no.translate.goog/presse...
https://kommunikasjon-ntb-no.translate.goog/presse...
NTB said:
External earth fault protection
A much-discussed point that led to the ban on the sale of Home and Charge in Sweden is Easee's integrated earth fault protection. The same solution is also in Lite, but this time Easee has declared compliance with the correct standard.
- We have seen that there is uncertainty around the application of the standard in some markets and are therefore taking that into account. Charge Lite therefore requires an external earth-fault circuit breaker type A, so that we meet the requirements as the authorities in, for example, Sweden interpret them, says Vorpenes.
Easee still maintains that it is still completely safe to use the chargers Home and Charge. No bans have been introduced in any countries and Easee will continue to fight in court.
The adaptation of the Charge Lite, requiring an external earth fault circuit breaker type A, does not change the company's view that the integrated earth fault protection is sufficient.
- We are going to continue the dialogue with the Swedish Safety Agency to reach an agreement on the already installed chargers Home and Charge in Sweden. We have accredited test houses that confirm that the solution is safe and will continue to build on documentation and do even more tests to meet the authorities' requirements, says Vorpenes.
Massively important (to me at least) is the statement that it has OCPP and doesn't depend on Easee's servers.A much-discussed point that led to the ban on the sale of Home and Charge in Sweden is Easee's integrated earth fault protection. The same solution is also in Lite, but this time Easee has declared compliance with the correct standard.
- We have seen that there is uncertainty around the application of the standard in some markets and are therefore taking that into account. Charge Lite therefore requires an external earth-fault circuit breaker type A, so that we meet the requirements as the authorities in, for example, Sweden interpret them, says Vorpenes.
Easee still maintains that it is still completely safe to use the chargers Home and Charge. No bans have been introduced in any countries and Easee will continue to fight in court.
The adaptation of the Charge Lite, requiring an external earth fault circuit breaker type A, does not change the company's view that the integrated earth fault protection is sufficient.
- We are going to continue the dialogue with the Swedish Safety Agency to reach an agreement on the already installed chargers Home and Charge in Sweden. We have accredited test houses that confirm that the solution is safe and will continue to build on documentation and do even more tests to meet the authorities' requirements, says Vorpenes.
NTB said:
New products - with local control
Local control of the charger has been high on the wish list of many Easee users. Charge Lite will get Bluetooth, which means that you can now, among other things, start and stop charging, check charging speed and lock/unlock the charging cable without being connected to the internet.
In addition, there will also be local OCPP, a well-known standard that allows direct control from third parties.
- This means that end customers are no longer dependent on Easee's cloud service to be able to use the charger, says Vorpenes.
Local control of the charger has been high on the wish list of many Easee users. Charge Lite will get Bluetooth, which means that you can now, among other things, start and stop charging, check charging speed and lock/unlock the charging cable without being connected to the internet.
In addition, there will also be local OCPP, a well-known standard that allows direct control from third parties.
- This means that end customers are no longer dependent on Easee's cloud service to be able to use the charger, says Vorpenes.
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