4x4: five doors, low range, £1500. What?
Discussion
downstairs said:
Really? I used to do some off road playing years and years ago, in Jeeps - and always used low range then (still managing to get stuck often!)
I've no real experience of "soft roaders", but can't imagine they'd cope well at my local pay and play without low range.
Does anyone play off road in one? Does it manage alright?
I agree fully, a proper 4x4 is needed. And likely one with lives axles on both ends.I've no real experience of "soft roaders", but can't imagine they'd cope well at my local pay and play without low range.
Does anyone play off road in one? Does it manage alright?
I suspect the best bang for buck will be a Jeep. XJ's are great, but maybe a little more compact inside. So ZJ or WJ Grand Cherokee is probably going to offer the best overall.
Ideally both would want a lift kit as they ride a little low from the factory and Jeep UK never offered the Up Country versions which came with factory lifts. Look for 'budget boost' kits as a cheap and simple lift. I bought one for £80 for my XJ and took maybe two hours to fit.
I still think it's worth looking at Land Rover's too. In the UK it just makes sense to consider them. There are certainly Disco's, 1 & 2 likely to be in budget. And also some p38a Range Rover's. If you added £500-1000 to our budget it'd open the doors to loads of LR choice and you'd get a good vehicle at that budget.
The Nissan Terrano is ok, although the front suspension is a bit lacking for proper off road use and they have no additional traction aids. I think they can suffer some rust issues too. And there is no aftermarket for them at all if you are wanting some off roady bits.
The Nissan Terrano was also sold in the UK as the Ford Maverick. Identical cars apart from the rad grill and badges. But the Ford seems to sell for less money always.
Nanook said:
He's talking about spending £1500 on a 4x4 to tow a caravan, go to the skips, and occasionally do some 'recreational' green laning with his son.
Well the op actually says:downstairs said:
I want to buy a pocket money 4x4 ..... occasional recreational off? road (pay and plays, laning) fun with my son.
Nanook said:
Do you think that picture is really representative of this case?
Yes.And apart from maybe a Freelander I've never really seen any soft roaders or Forresters at pay and play sites.
And having done a good number of green lanes, I have seen plenty that have deep tram lines and no options to not drive in them. Deep enough that even to take a Freelander along you'd need suspension lift and taller tyres.
And deep enough that a friend of mine with a V8 80" Series 1 Land Rover on 7.50 x 16 MT tyres got beached and had to be pulled out.
Just sold a very well maintained Jeep Grand Cherokee 2000 WJ 4L for under a grand. Ideal tow car. And with low range & proper 4WD.
Most importantly over the other options being mentioned here it had ZERO rust on it. LR & a lot of the japs suffer horrific rusting.
According to the spreadsheet I keep including fuel it has cost 43pence per mile over 60K plus.
Most importantly over the other options being mentioned here it had ZERO rust on it. LR & a lot of the japs suffer horrific rusting.
According to the spreadsheet I keep including fuel it has cost 43pence per mile over 60K plus.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Mercedes-ML350-Auto-104-...
We sold my missus' one of these last year, it was excellent and never missed a beat in 3 years of ownership.
We sold my missus' one of these last year, it was excellent and never missed a beat in 3 years of ownership.
Thanks for all the ideas so far!
Just for clarification: by far most of the use for this car will be domestic duties, filling up with tent and sundries, with family bikes on the roof or on a tow bar carrier, and the opportunity to borrow my f-i-l's caravan. As well as rubbish to the tip and diy duties etc.
All of which could be achieved with a Honda crv or an XTrail or something.
But.
With my little bit of off road history, there's no way I'm going to have a 4x4 sitting on the drive that won't give me the chance to do some off road playing with my son from time to time. I'm liking a Jeep as the answer to my question, but don't want to overlook something i should consider, just because my own thoughts wander straight to Jeeps.
I don't mind what the car looks like really either. When i say Discoveries look ropey at my budget, i mean they look knackered. I don't mind if i but something shabby, but it does need to be something the family can go in a couple of times a year to safely drive a few hundred miles.
Just for clarification: by far most of the use for this car will be domestic duties, filling up with tent and sundries, with family bikes on the roof or on a tow bar carrier, and the opportunity to borrow my f-i-l's caravan. As well as rubbish to the tip and diy duties etc.
All of which could be achieved with a Honda crv or an XTrail or something.
But.
With my little bit of off road history, there's no way I'm going to have a 4x4 sitting on the drive that won't give me the chance to do some off road playing with my son from time to time. I'm liking a Jeep as the answer to my question, but don't want to overlook something i should consider, just because my own thoughts wander straight to Jeeps.
I don't mind what the car looks like really either. When i say Discoveries look ropey at my budget, i mean they look knackered. I don't mind if i but something shabby, but it does need to be something the family can go in a couple of times a year to safely drive a few hundred miles.
tr7v8 said:
Just sold a very well maintained Jeep Grand Cherokee 2000 WJ 4L for under a grand. Ideal tow car. And with low range & proper 4WD.
Most importantly over the other options being mentioned here it had ZERO rust on it. LR & a lot of the japs suffer horrific rusting.
According to the spreadsheet I keep including fuel it has cost 43pence per mile over 60K plus.
I think this is exactly the sort of thing i want.Most importantly over the other options being mentioned here it had ZERO rust on it. LR & a lot of the japs suffer horrific rusting.
According to the spreadsheet I keep including fuel it has cost 43pence per mile over 60K plus.
You've already mentioned the best option OP - Jeep Cherokee. Affordable, capable, much more reliable than people think.
Worth thinking about tyres, you want to do pay and play days, but also want to do hundreds of miles with the family. Even a set of All Terrains will buzz and drone a bit on the road, and a tyre capable of half decent mud will drive you nuts on the road for hundreds of miles. Second set of wheels will be required.
Worth thinking about tyres, you want to do pay and play days, but also want to do hundreds of miles with the family. Even a set of All Terrains will buzz and drone a bit on the road, and a tyre capable of half decent mud will drive you nuts on the road for hundreds of miles. Second set of wheels will be required.
300bhp/ton said:
Nanook said:
He's talking about spending £1500 on a 4x4 to tow a caravan, go to the skips, and occasionally do some 'recreational' green laning with his son.
Well the op actually says:downstairs said:
I want to buy a pocket money 4x4 ..... occasional recreational off? road (pay and plays, laning) fun with my son.
Nanook said:
Do you think that picture is really representative of this case?
Yes.And apart from maybe a Freelander I've never really seen any soft roaders or Forresters at pay and play sites.
And having done a good number of green lanes, I have seen plenty that have deep tram lines and no options to not drive in them. Deep enough that even to take a Freelander along you'd need suspension lift and taller tyres.
And deep enough that a friend of mine with a V8 80" Series 1 Land Rover on 7.50 x 16 MT tyres got beached and had to be pulled out.
So the key word for in the pursuit of 'recreational off road' is VERY occasional, perhaps more occasional (as he stated!) than the camping/cycling fill with junk...so perhaps-just perhaps- a lifted, fully kitted Defender with the ability to climb the north face of the Eiger isnt the best suited to his needs, especially when you consider-
'comfy enough for four for hundreds of miles at a time'.
Any single which way you look at it- completely irrelevant to your own view of what constitutes 'comfy', to a normal person a Defender with a lift kit and huge tyres really, really, REALLY isnt comfortable for hundreds of miles at a time.
Different strokes/different folks, but to suggest what you have-by your own lofty standards of absurd suggestions- is massively wide of the mark, before you even consider the budget.
If you're considering a Sorento, your budget will restrict you to pre-facelift 'Mark 1s". Be aware there are differences in the transmissions between the models: The XE has a driver selectable "2Hi, 4Hi, 4Lo" transfer box, the other models have an automatic selection system "Torque on Demand", which is, frankly, sh*t.
They will have had the fuse for the system removed, or the front driveshaft, to eliminate the problems caused by mismatched tyres.
All early models had a design fault which caused rear axle mountings to rust away. It should have been sorted in a mass recall, and modified to prevent rust, but is well worth checking first.
Diesel tanks on early models delaminated internally, clogging fuel filters and damaging pumps, another recall item.
They will have had the fuse for the system removed, or the front driveshaft, to eliminate the problems caused by mismatched tyres.
All early models had a design fault which caused rear axle mountings to rust away. It should have been sorted in a mass recall, and modified to prevent rust, but is well worth checking first.
Diesel tanks on early models delaminated internally, clogging fuel filters and damaging pumps, another recall item.
cbmotorsport said:
Even a set of All Terrains will buzz and drone a bit on the road, and a tyre capable of half decent mud will drive you nuts on the road for hundreds of miles. Second set of wheels will be required.
Normally I'd agree but I've been using Yokohama Geolandars for the first time on/off road recently and they are completely silent at 70 mph and very good off road (not p'n'p I'd hasten to add but muddy tracks and fields of a sheep farm). This is on a Jeep Grand Cherokee.Nanook said:
Right, but I doubt he's going to find a modofied V8 80" with big tyres for a grand and a half, so compromise, nor, I'd imagine, is he likely to buy an old Freelander and a lift kit.
So, i think you're possibly getting a bit carried away.
OP, at that budget, take a look at the Isuzu Trooper too? I can't remember if it's the 3.0 or the 3.1 that's the better engine, google, or Paddy_N_Murphy will be able to tell you.
Which is why I said Jeep Cherokee/G Cherokee or Disco/p38 :rolleys:So, i think you're possibly getting a bit carried away.
OP, at that budget, take a look at the Isuzu Trooper too? I can't remember if it's the 3.0 or the 3.1 that's the better engine, google, or Paddy_N_Murphy will be able to tell you.
Do keep up at the back
Dusty964 said:
The op actually states 'to fill with my family of four for camping/cycling trips, and to fill with junk as necessary for tip runs, and for very occasional recreational off? road (pay and plays, laning) fun with my son.'
So the key word for in the pursuit of 'recreational off road' is VERY occasional, perhaps more occasional (as he stated!) than the camping/cycling fill with junk...so perhaps-just perhaps- a lifted, fully kitted Defender with the ability to climb the north face of the Eiger isnt the best suited to his needs, especially when you consider-
'comfy enough for four for hundreds of miles at a time'.
Any single which way you look at it- completely irrelevant to your own view of what constitutes 'comfy', to a normal person a Defender with a lift kit and huge tyres really, really, REALLY isnt comfortable for hundreds of miles at a time.
Different strokes/different folks, but to suggest what you have-by your own lofty standards of absurd suggestions- is massively wide of the mark, before you even consider the budget.
You won't buy a Defender close to this budget, let alone a lifted one on big wheels. The picture was more to illustrate the terrain. Image found via google searching for 4x4 pay and play site. Funnily enough, I didn't see any Forresters or soft roaders turn up in the search results. But regardless, it was an example of the terrain I was looking for.So the key word for in the pursuit of 'recreational off road' is VERY occasional, perhaps more occasional (as he stated!) than the camping/cycling fill with junk...so perhaps-just perhaps- a lifted, fully kitted Defender with the ability to climb the north face of the Eiger isnt the best suited to his needs, especially when you consider-
'comfy enough for four for hundreds of miles at a time'.
Any single which way you look at it- completely irrelevant to your own view of what constitutes 'comfy', to a normal person a Defender with a lift kit and huge tyres really, really, REALLY isnt comfortable for hundreds of miles at a time.
Different strokes/different folks, but to suggest what you have-by your own lofty standards of absurd suggestions- is massively wide of the mark, before you even consider the budget.
My personal opinion on the whole "on road/offroad" balance of 4x4's is that you are best off with a small, cheap, dedicated and modified off road 4x4 for playing, and a dedicated road vehicle for other duties.
Something like this selection of Suzukis to play with :
http://www.totaloffroad.co.uk/vehicles/suzuki/
Then ripping off the bumpers, fitting skid plates, lift kits, snorkels and proper tyres is not an excercise in making it horrible to drive on the road, and when you roll it over/scrape it along a tree you can laugh and it just adds to the character.
Something like this selection of Suzukis to play with :
http://www.totaloffroad.co.uk/vehicles/suzuki/
Then ripping off the bumpers, fitting skid plates, lift kits, snorkels and proper tyres is not an excercise in making it horrible to drive on the road, and when you roll it over/scrape it along a tree you can laugh and it just adds to the character.
Last time I went to a Pay and Play site there was a chap there in a Kia Sorrento.
He was just driving it through the mud for most of the day whilst my mates and I in our convoy of 2x Discovery and 1x Cherokee went for the rough stuff.
Definitely consider a Cherokee though. The only downside for me is that whilst they have good clearance, they are not as tall as a Discovery and so the headroom is a lot less than you might have - whether this is important or not I don't know. a Grand Cherokee might well solve this issue.
He was just driving it through the mud for most of the day whilst my mates and I in our convoy of 2x Discovery and 1x Cherokee went for the rough stuff.
Definitely consider a Cherokee though. The only downside for me is that whilst they have good clearance, they are not as tall as a Discovery and so the headroom is a lot less than you might have - whether this is important or not I don't know. a Grand Cherokee might well solve this issue.
ExPat2B said:
My personal opinion on the whole "on road/offroad" balance of 4x4's is that you are best off with a small, cheap, dedicated and modified off road 4x4 for playing, and a dedicated road vehicle for other duties.
I do agree, but that's not what I'm looking for. I've got a dedicated car to be an actual car, but i want a 4x4 for other duties. And if I'm buying a 4x4 i want it to be capable for a bit of fun from time to time as well.I don't expect to be doing lots of mods and trialling it or anything. Years ago when i last had a Jeep (a Cherokee) it had to be my actual car too, and i bought a spare set of steels to put remould muds on for occasional playing.
This time, the 4x4 doesn't need to be an everyday car, but does need to be used as one now and then.
A compromise, if you will.
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