Trying to think up a sub 1250kg track car option....

[HedgeyGedgey]

Scobblelotcher said:

I think there’s little chance a 300bhp mx5 could take on a 500bhp Impreza classic. The classic is only a small amount heavier and having done a track day in a 517bhp Impreza I know how ballastic they are. The performance which it can make the most of thanks to AWD and a good suspension setup is breathtaking.

A 500bhp+ classic is also a well trodden path and I would guess be far more reliable than a 300 mx5. The Impreza just needs a ej207, 6 speed and the usual supporting mods.

If it was a 500bhp newage vs a 300bhp it would be much closer.

My point exactly, a 500bhp evo or scoob really isnt to be sniffed at, we've pushed m3's and AMG's out the way at 140+. Iirc Madmac motorsport and his mental twincharged evo holds the records for the majority of the hillclimbs up Scotland way i believe. Steve Peele holds the records for a few of the Isle of man hillclimbs inna 480bhp evo. If Andy Forrest ever hill climbs his scoob I'd imagine records will broken. To say an Mx5 with a turbo bolted to the side will beat a 500bhp RA is borederline funny.

[Scobblelotcher]

HedgeyGedgey said:

My point exactly, a 500bhp evo or scoob really isnt to be sniffed at, we've pushed m3's and AMG's out the way at 140+. Iirc Madmac motorsport and his mental twincharged evo holds the records for the majority of the hillclimbs up Scotland way i believe. Steve Peele holds the records for a few of the Isle of man hillclimbs inna 480bhp evo. If Andy Forrest ever hill climbs his scoob I'd imagine records will broken. To say an Mx5 with a turbo bolted to the side will beat a 500bhp RA is borederline funny.

A bit of inspiration for you, the mighty Gobstopper that destroyed nearly everything at time attack.

https://youtu.be/YiQ6FcyiPag

[HedgeyGedgey]

Scobblelotcher said:

A bit of inspiration for you, the mighty Gobstopper that destroyed nearly everything at time attack.

https://youtu.be/YiQ6FcyiPag

I love watching him drive, Phil Reed in the Paceward evo is a bit like that. Just an animal and 100% attack mode the both of them are loons lol

[m1dg3]

C70R said:

Indeed.
Looking at the Shelsley Walsh class records, you can see that a 2.3 stroker Evo 5 (500+bhp) is over a second slower than a sub-200bhp Caterham 7 Hayabusa up a 30sec run.

And Shelsley is a 'power hill'. Take that pair to Prescott or Loton and the difference would be even greater.

Size seems to be a significant factor. Hillclimb tracks are typically really narrow so something small can actually run a racing line. Sticking with the 4WD theme, would a Pulsar be significantly smaller or lighter than a classic Impreza? I seem to remember a chap called Phil Oram competing successfully in one a few years ago so you could look up his times for comparison.

[TroubledSoul]

m1dg3 said:

And Shelsley is a 'power hill'. Take that pair to Prescott or Loton and the difference would be even greater.

Size seems to be a significant factor. Hillclimb tracks are typically really narrow so something small can actually run a racing line. Sticking with the 4WD theme, would a Pulsar be significantly smaller or lighter than a classic Impreza? I seem to remember a chap called Phil Oram competing successfully in one a few years ago so you could look up his times for comparison.

Pulsars are actually quite similar to a classic Impreza in weight but far more fragile unfortunately. The wheelbase of it suggests it could be an absolutely awesome hillclimber but I'm not sure it would last long. I have looked into them before.

[C70R]

m1dg3 said:

C70R said:

Indeed.
Looking at the Shelsley Walsh class records, you can see that a 2.3 stroker Evo 5 (500+bhp) is over a second slower than a sub-200bhp Caterham 7 Hayabusa up a 30sec run.

And Shelsley is a 'power hill'. Take that pair to Prescott or Loton and the difference would be even greater.

Size seems to be a significant factor. Hillclimb tracks are typically really narrow so something small can actually run a racing line. Sticking with the 4WD theme, would a Pulsar be significantly smaller or lighter than a classic Impreza? I seem to remember a chap called Phil Oram competing successfully in one a few years ago so you could look up his times for comparison.

But no. That bloke up there has destroyed fast cars on tracks, so the Impreza would obviously be quicker up a hillclimb. It's almost like people are wilfully ignoring the question and the facts...

[C70R]

Scobblelotcher said:

I think there’s little chance a 300bhp mx5 could take on a 500bhp Impreza classic. The classic is only a small amount heavier and having done a track day in a 517bhp Impreza I know how ballastic they are. The performance which it can make the most of thanks to AWD and a good suspension setup is breathtaking.

A 500bhp+ classic is also a well trodden path and I would guess be far more reliable than a 300 mx5. The Impreza just needs a ej207, 6 speed and the usual supporting mods.

If it was a 500bhp newage vs a 300bhp it would be much closer.

So, you mean you were quicker than other cars on a nice, wide track? How did you fare against the kit cars et al? Were you quicker around the corners? Could you brake later?

[Scobblelotcher]

C70R said:

So, you mean you were quicker than other cars on a nice, wide track? How did you fare against the kit cars et al? Were you quicker around the corners? Could you brake later?

We were faster than most of the kit cars although this proves nothing, buying a kit car doesn’t make you a track god in the same way as I own a very fast motorbike and my talent level is moderate at best.

This takes nothing away from what a well setup 500bhp classic is capable of.

Edit: typos

Edited by Scobblelotcher on Friday 24th November 19:31

[james_gt3rs]

Scobblelotcher said:

This takes nothing away from what a well setup 500bhp classic is capable of though.

For example a WRC car is not exactly slow on tarmac..

[C70R]

james_gt3rs said:

Scobblelotcher said:

This takes nothing away from what a well setup 500bhp classic is capable of though.

For example a WRC car is not exactly slow on tarmac..

Absolutely - but they don't excel at hillclimbs (as the records I posted demonstrate), which is what the topic was about, even if the title was worded poorly.

[TroubledSoul]

C70R said:

Absolutely - but they don't excel at hillclimbs (as the records I posted demonstrate), which is what the topic was about, even if the title was worded poorly.

It's not really worded poorly. I do track days as well.

[Henry Fiddleton]

Hi,

Not had a chance to read the full thread, but if you can manage (learn) to drive a fwd quickly, my 99 Civic type-r (EK9) comes in with a full cage, striped and half a tank of fuel is 930kgs. It has a stock blue printed engine which makes 188bhp.

Its a 1.6 n/a so is usually very well placed in class racing.

They can be had from £5k to £9k.

All the best.

[Scobblelotcher]

C70R said:

james_gt3rs said:

Scobblelotcher said:

This takes nothing away from what a well setup 500bhp classic is capable of though.

For example a WRC car is not exactly slow on tarmac..

Absolutely - but they don't excel at hillclimbs (as the records I posted demonstrate), which is what the topic was about, even if the title was worded poorly.

Which hill climbs are you talking about? I know some of the events like Goodwood where the Impreza was faster than everything which includes race cars.

Footage of the sprint
https://youtu.be/ViDP0ZH3mm0

Gobstopper has won various hill climbs and time attack events although to be fair this car is exceptional and not your ordinary entrant.

[C70R]

Scobblelotcher said:

C70R said:

james_gt3rs said:

Scobblelotcher said:

This takes nothing away from what a well setup 500bhp classic is capable of though.

For example a WRC car is not exactly slow on tarmac..

Absolutely - but they don't excel at hillclimbs (as the records I posted demonstrate), which is what the topic was about, even if the title was worded poorly.

Which hill climbs are you talking about? I know some of the events like Goodwood where the Impreza was faster than everything which includes race cars.

Footage of the sprint
https://youtu.be/ViDP0ZH3mm0

Gobstopper has won various hill climbs and time attack events although to be fair this car is exceptional and not your ordinary entrant.

We were discussing the Prescott records by class, linked on the previous page. Your 800bhp example, while impressive, is as relevant as a Group B rally car to this discussion...

[Scobblelotcher]

Is it just that one track? I’m sure they aren’t the fastest on every course especially over such a short run. Certain tracks will suit some cars better than others for sure.

I guess much of it also comes down to preference. The MX5 is a fine driving machine but a modified Impreza is a sledgehammer.

https://youtu.be/LRJmkohPCAs