Buying a 3 year old upmarket estate
Discussion
pb8g09 said:
Poppiecock said:
Very much this - the difference in price between a 3 series and 5 series when you match the specs. is very small indeed. Lots of stuff that's an option on a 3 comes as standard even on the 'poverty' 5-series SE.
330 is bit faster than the 530 
If you stretch your budget and go newer, be very careful, because after April 1st 2017 (I think), any car that listed over £40k when new including extras is hit by the premium car tax, which is a few hundred every year for the first 5 years. If you go for a Merc/BMW etc you could be in this territory. It's a hateful tax imho
lornemalvo said:
Is it really? Is that at the Nurburgring or the real world in which we live? On most journeys a 520d will be equally fast (in terms of time taken to complete a journey)
What?!A 520 will take longer to reach 70mph than a 330, therefore it will get there in more time than the 330. Don’t talk drivel.
A Nissan Micra will hit 70mph which means it’s fast enough ‘in the real world’. Shall we all sell our cars and drive Micras. Cretin.
pb8g09 said:
lornemalvo said:
Is it really? Is that at the Nurburgring or the real world in which we live? On most journeys a 520d will be equally fast (in terms of time taken to complete a journey)
What?!A 520 will take longer to reach 70mph than a 330, therefore it will get there in more time than the 330. Don’t talk drivel.
A Nissan Micra will hit 70mph which means it’s fast enough ‘in the real world’. Shall we all sell our cars and drive Micras. Cretin.
pb8g09 said:
lornemalvo said:
Is it really? Is that at the Nurburgring or the real world in which we live? On most journeys a 520d will be equally fast (in terms of time taken to complete a journey)
What?!A 520 will take longer to reach 70mph than a 330, therefore it will get there in more time than the 330. Don’t talk drivel.
A Nissan Micra will hit 70mph which means it’s fast enough ‘in the real world’. Shall we all sell our cars and drive Micras. Cretin.
Firstly, if you disagree with me, that's fine, I'm a big boy and I can live with it, but there's no need to get personal and call my opinion drivel. Just put a cogent argument forward with your point of view, that's what we adults do.. Secondly, please read my post again. Of course the 330d is quicker than the 520d, I've owned both so I know that to be true. It's quicker to 70 mph by what, 2 seconds? This is assuming, of course, that you always accelerate with your foot to the floor and, judging by your tone, I suppose this is likely. However, as my last sentence suggests, how much difference do you think it makes over a typical journey? The answer is - very little. In the 1970s, with less traffic and no speed cameras, a 330d would have slaughtered a 520d over any journey, but now you can only go as fast as the bloke with a trilby in the Honda Jazz in front of you, or as fast as the speed cameras will let you, or on dual carriageways as fast as the artic in front of you, taking 20 minutes to overtake another artic in Lane 1. Taking it to your extremes and using your quite idiotic example, the average trip length by car is around 7 miles, so you're absolutely right. For most people, for most of the time, a Nissan Micra will do the same job and get there in around the same time. Now, look at that Oxford Children's Dictionary I'm sure you've got tucked away somewhere, and look up the word cretin and reconsider who it really applies to. Then, before engaging with the grown ups again, have a little think about what you're going to say. And remember, don't run with scissors, even if they are those little plastic ones your mum gave you.
lornemalvo said:
I genuinely think people should take an intelligence test before being allowed to post online, and preferably a personality test.
Firstly, if you disagree with me, that's fine, I'm a big boy and I can live with it, but there's no need to get personal and call my opinion drivel. Just put a cogent argument forward with your point of view, that's what we adults do.. Secondly, please read my post again. Of course the 330d is quicker than the 520d, I've owned both so I know that to be true. It's quicker to 70 mph by what, 2 seconds? This is assuming, of course, that you always accelerate with your foot to the floor and, judging by your tone, I suppose this is likely. However, as my last sentence suggests, how much difference do you think it makes over a typical journey? The answer is - very little. In the 1970s, with less traffic and no speed cameras, a 330d would have slaughtered a 520d over any journey, but now you can only go as fast as the bloke with a trilby in the Honda Jazz in front of you, or as fast as the speed cameras will let you, or on dual carriageways as fast as the artic in front of you, taking 20 minutes to overtake another artic in Lane 1. Taking it to your extremes and using your quite idiotic example, the average trip length by car is around 7 miles, so you're absolutely right. For most people, for most of the time, a Nissan Micra will do the same job and get there in around the same time. Now, look at that Oxford Children's Dictionary I'm sure you've got tucked away somewhere, and look up the word cretin and reconsider who it really applies to. Then, before engaging with the grown ups again, have a little think about what you're going to say. And remember, don't run with scissors, even if they are those little plastic ones your mum gave you.
Apologies, I wrote my post following a grumbly meeting at work so I was overly aggressive. I retract my tone as it was unnecessary.Firstly, if you disagree with me, that's fine, I'm a big boy and I can live with it, but there's no need to get personal and call my opinion drivel. Just put a cogent argument forward with your point of view, that's what we adults do.. Secondly, please read my post again. Of course the 330d is quicker than the 520d, I've owned both so I know that to be true. It's quicker to 70 mph by what, 2 seconds? This is assuming, of course, that you always accelerate with your foot to the floor and, judging by your tone, I suppose this is likely. However, as my last sentence suggests, how much difference do you think it makes over a typical journey? The answer is - very little. In the 1970s, with less traffic and no speed cameras, a 330d would have slaughtered a 520d over any journey, but now you can only go as fast as the bloke with a trilby in the Honda Jazz in front of you, or as fast as the speed cameras will let you, or on dual carriageways as fast as the artic in front of you, taking 20 minutes to overtake another artic in Lane 1. Taking it to your extremes and using your quite idiotic example, the average trip length by car is around 7 miles, so you're absolutely right. For most people, for most of the time, a Nissan Micra will do the same job and get there in around the same time. Now, look at that Oxford Children's Dictionary I'm sure you've got tucked away somewhere, and look up the word cretin and reconsider who it really applies to. Then, before engaging with the grown ups again, have a little think about what you're going to say. And remember, don't run with scissors, even if they are those little plastic ones your mum gave you.
Though I still disagree that in terms of feel and speed of a car, they’re not similar and taking an average diesel journey (I.e. further than 7 miles, more like ten times that), a 330 will be considerably faster than a 520 to get to a destination. The number of times you will be reduced down to 50mph etc - over taking the arctic in your example- and then building back up to speed, junctions and so forth, the 330d will easily be quicker to the destination. Hence why they’re so popular. Commenting on how firmly someone puts their foot on an accelerator pedal when they’re trying to accelerate seems like a bizarre approach to personally insulting someone mind you?
I don’t think that viewpoint is actually unintelligent at all.
I don’t want to continue to hi-jack this thread, I’m disappointed that you weren’t able to pick up the tongue-in-cheek remark I made when I said the 330d is faster than the 530d- I’d have thought the emoticon might have given that away, but alas, back to upmarket estate recommendations...
pb8g09 said:
lornemalvo said:
I genuinely think people should take an intelligence test before being allowed to post online, and preferably a personality test.
Firstly, if you disagree with me, that's fine, I'm a big boy and I can live with it, but there's no need to get personal and call my opinion drivel. Just put a cogent argument forward with your point of view, that's what we adults do.. Secondly, please read my post again. Of course the 330d is quicker than the 520d, I've owned both so I know that to be true. It's quicker to 70 mph by what, 2 seconds? This is assuming, of course, that you always accelerate with your foot to the floor and, judging by your tone, I suppose this is likely. However, as my last sentence suggests, how much difference do you think it makes over a typical journey? The answer is - very little. In the 1970s, with less traffic and no speed cameras, a 330d would have slaughtered a 520d over any journey, but now you can only go as fast as the bloke with a trilby in the Honda Jazz in front of you, or as fast as the speed cameras will let you, or on dual carriageways as fast as the artic in front of you, taking 20 minutes to overtake another artic in Lane 1. Taking it to your extremes and using your quite idiotic example, the average trip length by car is around 7 miles, so you're absolutely right. For most people, for most of the time, a Nissan Micra will do the same job and get there in around the same time. Now, look at that Oxford Children's Dictionary I'm sure you've got tucked away somewhere, and look up the word cretin and reconsider who it really applies to. Then, before engaging with the grown ups again, have a little think about what you're going to say. And remember, don't run with scissors, even if they are those little plastic ones your mum gave you.
Though I still disagree that in terms of feel and speed of a car, they’re not similar and taking an average diesel journey (I.e. further than 7 miles, more like ten times that), a 330 will be considerably faster than a 520 to get to a destination. The number of times you will be reduced down to 50mph etc - over taking the arctic in your example- and then building back up to speed, junctions and so forth, the 330d will easily be quicker to the destination. Firstly, if you disagree with me, that's fine, I'm a big boy and I can live with it, but there's no need to get personal and call my opinion drivel. Just put a cogent argument forward with your point of view, that's what we adults do.. Secondly, please read my post again. Of course the 330d is quicker than the 520d, I've owned both so I know that to be true. It's quicker to 70 mph by what, 2 seconds? This is assuming, of course, that you always accelerate with your foot to the floor and, judging by your tone, I suppose this is likely. However, as my last sentence suggests, how much difference do you think it makes over a typical journey? The answer is - very little. In the 1970s, with less traffic and no speed cameras, a 330d would have slaughtered a 520d over any journey, but now you can only go as fast as the bloke with a trilby in the Honda Jazz in front of you, or as fast as the speed cameras will let you, or on dual carriageways as fast as the artic in front of you, taking 20 minutes to overtake another artic in Lane 1. Taking it to your extremes and using your quite idiotic example, the average trip length by car is around 7 miles, so you're absolutely right. For most people, for most of the time, a Nissan Micra will do the same job and get there in around the same time. Now, look at that Oxford Children's Dictionary I'm sure you've got tucked away somewhere, and look up the word cretin and reconsider who it really applies to. Then, before engaging with the grown ups again, have a little think about what you're going to say. And remember, don't run with scissors, even if they are those little plastic ones your mum gave you.
Now if I was travelling huge distances in the dead of the night on empty roads you might have a point, but as the man said, for the majority of everyday driving the difference between a 20/30 is negligible, they might make YOU FEEL different but they will have a negligible effect on normal journey times.
I infer from your post you either haven't been driving that long or don't do many miles, or both.
NewUsername said:
I commute 70 miles to my office in busy traffic, mixed motorways, a roads and a city centre, and it doesn't matter what car I drive it alwats takes the same time, i've used my wifes 1 litre fabia to a CLS350d Mercedes and it takes the same.
Now if I was travelling huge distances in the dead of the night on empty roads you might have a point, but as the man said, for the majority of everyday driving the difference between a 20/30 is negligible, they might make YOU FEEL different but they will have a negligible effect on normal journey times.
I infer from your post you either haven't been driving that long or don't do many miles, or both.
Zzzz.. your posts are always so negative/unnecessarily aggressive. Now if I was travelling huge distances in the dead of the night on empty roads you might have a point, but as the man said, for the majority of everyday driving the difference between a 20/30 is negligible, they might make YOU FEEL different but they will have a negligible effect on normal journey times.
I infer from your post you either haven't been driving that long or don't do many miles, or both.
You’ve said before you drive a 320d, now you’re saying you drive a 350d, but that you also use a train a lot, which is it? You’ll be saying that your RS6 is better than the new one on yesterday’s RS6 announcement next... anything to fit your rhetoric of everyone who disagrees with you being stupid right?....
Re fast cars. Journey time is almost entirely dictated by how long you spend at zero mph . So if you need to make more mortorway stops cos your car is not comfy, then regardless of the 0-60, it's a slow car.
I drive mostly quiet rural roads, so the journey feels much quicker in car with sub 6 sec acceleration. Because it's fun. And I spend much less time at lower speeds.
I drive mostly quiet rural roads, so the journey feels much quicker in car with sub 6 sec acceleration. Because it's fun. And I spend much less time at lower speeds.
pb8g09 said:
NewUsername said:
I commute 70 miles to my office in busy traffic, mixed motorways, a roads and a city centre, and it doesn't matter what car I drive it alwats takes the same time, i've used my wifes 1 litre fabia to a CLS350d Mercedes and it takes the same.
Now if I was travelling huge distances in the dead of the night on empty roads you might have a point, but as the man said, for the majority of everyday driving the difference between a 20/30 is negligible, they might make YOU FEEL different but they will have a negligible effect on normal journey times.
I infer from your post you either haven't been driving that long or don't do many miles, or both.
Zzzz.. your posts are always so negative/unnecessarily aggressive. Now if I was travelling huge distances in the dead of the night on empty roads you might have a point, but as the man said, for the majority of everyday driving the difference between a 20/30 is negligible, they might make YOU FEEL different but they will have a negligible effect on normal journey times.
I infer from your post you either haven't been driving that long or don't do many miles, or both.
You’ve said before you drive a 320d, now you’re saying you drive a 350d, but that you also use a train a lot, which is it? You’ll be saying that your RS6 is better than the new one on yesterday’s RS6 announcement next... anything to fit your rhetoric of everyone who disagrees with you being stupid right?....
Edited by NewUsername on Friday 23 August 11:10
Edited by NewUsername on Friday 23 August 11:12
NewUsername said:
I commute 70 miles to my office in busy traffic, mixed motorways, a roads and a city centre, and it doesn't matter what car I drive it alwats takes the same time, i've used my wifes 1 litre fabia to a CLS350d Mercedes and it takes the same.
Now if I was travelling huge distances in the dead of the night on empty roads you might have a point, but as the man said, for the majority of everyday driving the difference between a 20/30 is negligible, they might make YOU FEEL different but they will have a negligible effect on normal journey times.
I infer from your post you either haven't been driving that long or don't do many miles, or both.
Apology accepted, thank you for that and I can relate, I also get grumpy days. My comment about accelerating with the foot flat down was because for the 330d to make that much difference on a journey over the 520d, which is no slouch, I would imagine fairly aggressive acceleration would be needed. I tend to accelerate at pretty much the same rate whether I'm in my Octavia, or my old Lexus LS 400, unless I'm in a hurry for some reason. I'd probably accelerate harder in the Lexus just to listen to the V8, but the damn thing is so quiet, it's pretty pointless. As regards journey times, when I did my blue light fast car training course, I was surprised to find out how little difference it made to a journey time when driving on blues and twos. It was quicker, of course, but the different was less than I would have thought. On my trips from Yorkshire to see family in Wales , I decided to try a different tack and instead of driving as fast as I could wherever I could, hoping to spot the many speed cameras and slow down in time I tried a different approach. I drove to the speed limit, chilled out, further increased the distance between me and the car in front etc i found that the difference in journey times really is insignificant and I arrived much more relaxed. I couldn't do the 50 mph I see some drivers, especially elderly drivers, do on the motorway but just kicking back a little makes a big difference to stress levels. My last BMW was a 330d (albeit in 2008) and I would never have considered a 2 litre at that time. As much as I like the effortless nature of the Lexus, I'd be quite happy to get a 2 litre for my next car (I'm also after an estate). Whether it'll be a BMW is doubtful, because reliability seems to have gone through the floor.Now if I was travelling huge distances in the dead of the night on empty roads you might have a point, but as the man said, for the majority of everyday driving the difference between a 20/30 is negligible, they might make YOU FEEL different but they will have a negligible effect on normal journey times.
I infer from your post you either haven't been driving that long or don't do many miles, or both.
I've had a 3 series estate and found it a bit tight on space however at the time with no kids it was great and a good drive.
Although a 5 series poses good value the F11 was a shocking design and doesn't look great even in msport guise, the G31 is much better but won't come cheap and at barely 2 years old maybe out of budget?
I've got plenty of experience with Mondeo's and although a good driving car and better that Insignia's in my opinion they are of crap build quality, shockingly poor material standard.
E-Class circa 2013 on after the facelift are very good value and if you see the mileages on auto trader they are pretty resilient, can't say I've heard of many horror stories. Manuals tend to be scarce but often cheaper if found as they are less desirable to the target audience!
I am a big Audi / Vw fan and although pricey the A6 Avant may be worth a look or possibly a new shape Passat in GT or R line spec.
Although a 5 series poses good value the F11 was a shocking design and doesn't look great even in msport guise, the G31 is much better but won't come cheap and at barely 2 years old maybe out of budget?
I've got plenty of experience with Mondeo's and although a good driving car and better that Insignia's in my opinion they are of crap build quality, shockingly poor material standard.
E-Class circa 2013 on after the facelift are very good value and if you see the mileages on auto trader they are pretty resilient, can't say I've heard of many horror stories. Manuals tend to be scarce but often cheaper if found as they are less desirable to the target audience!
I am a big Audi / Vw fan and although pricey the A6 Avant may be worth a look or possibly a new shape Passat in GT or R line spec.
strath44 said:
I've had a 3 series estate and found it a bit tight on space however at the time with no kids it was great and a good drive.
Although a 5 series poses good value the F11 was a shocking design and doesn't look great even in msport guise, the G31 is much better but won't come cheap and at barely 2 years old maybe out of budget?
I've got plenty of experience with Mondeo's and although a good driving car and better that Insignia's in my opinion they are of crap build quality, shockingly poor material standard.
E-Class circa 2013 on after the facelift are very good value and if you see the mileages on auto trader they are pretty resilient, can't say I've heard of many horror stories. Manuals tend to be scarce but often cheaper if found as they are less desirable to the target audience!
I am a big Audi / Vw fan and although pricey the A6 Avant may be worth a look or possibly a new shape Passat in GT or R line spec.
Agree re the 3 series, get over the looks and the 5 is a decent car. On the Mondeo front, see bold, perceived poor cabin materials isnt build quality, if it breaks down and doesn't perform to spec is build quality issues. On the whole as an owner and looking after a fleet at work i've found Mondeos over th years to be excellent workhorses and dead reliableAlthough a 5 series poses good value the F11 was a shocking design and doesn't look great even in msport guise, the G31 is much better but won't come cheap and at barely 2 years old maybe out of budget?
I've got plenty of experience with Mondeo's and although a good driving car and better that Insignia's in my opinion they are of crap build quality, shockingly poor material standard.
E-Class circa 2013 on after the facelift are very good value and if you see the mileages on auto trader they are pretty resilient, can't say I've heard of many horror stories. Manuals tend to be scarce but often cheaper if found as they are less desirable to the target audience!
I am a big Audi / Vw fan and although pricey the A6 Avant may be worth a look or possibly a new shape Passat in GT or R line spec.
NewUsername said:
strath44 said:
I've had a 3 series estate and found it a bit tight on space however at the time with no kids it was great and a good drive.
Although a 5 series poses good value the F11 was a shocking design and doesn't look great even in msport guise, the G31 is much better but won't come cheap and at barely 2 years old maybe out of budget?
I've got plenty of experience with Mondeo's and although a good driving car and better that Insignia's in my opinion they are of crap build quality, shockingly poor material standard.
E-Class circa 2013 on after the facelift are very good value and if you see the mileages on auto trader they are pretty resilient, can't say I've heard of many horror stories. Manuals tend to be scarce but often cheaper if found as they are less desirable to the target audience!
I am a big Audi / Vw fan and although pricey the A6 Avant may be worth a look or possibly a new shape Passat in GT or R line spec.
Agree re the 3 series, get over the looks and the 5 is a decent car. On the Mondeo front, see bold, perceived poor cabin materials isnt build quality, if it breaks down and doesn't perform to spec is build quality issues. On the whole as an owner and looking after a fleet at work i've found Mondeos over th years to be excellent workhorses and dead reliableAlthough a 5 series poses good value the F11 was a shocking design and doesn't look great even in msport guise, the G31 is much better but won't come cheap and at barely 2 years old maybe out of budget?
I've got plenty of experience with Mondeo's and although a good driving car and better that Insignia's in my opinion they are of crap build quality, shockingly poor material standard.
E-Class circa 2013 on after the facelift are very good value and if you see the mileages on auto trader they are pretty resilient, can't say I've heard of many horror stories. Manuals tend to be scarce but often cheaper if found as they are less desirable to the target audience!
I am a big Audi / Vw fan and although pricey the A6 Avant may be worth a look or possibly a new shape Passat in GT or R line spec.
You are dealing with the cars as new if its fleet related (I assume) ironically I tend to deal with exfleet 3 year old cars and can assure you the amount of bits cars need flung at them, Mondeos are high up there. I've just put 2 genuine front wheel bearings on the same corner one after the other a Mondeo thats done 6k miles between them. Exhausts seem to be an issue as well as boot leaks. the list goes on!
The OP is likely to be buying at 3 years old plus (possibly) you need to compare apples and apples!
strath44 said:
NewUsername said:
strath44 said:
I've had a 3 series estate and found it a bit tight on space however at the time with no kids it was great and a good drive.
Although a 5 series poses good value the F11 was a shocking design and doesn't look great even in msport guise, the G31 is much better but won't come cheap and at barely 2 years old maybe out of budget?
I've got plenty of experience with Mondeo's and although a good driving car and better that Insignia's in my opinion they are of crap build quality, shockingly poor material standard.
E-Class circa 2013 on after the facelift are very good value and if you see the mileages on auto trader they are pretty resilient, can't say I've heard of many horror stories. Manuals tend to be scarce but often cheaper if found as they are less desirable to the target audience!
I am a big Audi / Vw fan and although pricey the A6 Avant may be worth a look or possibly a new shape Passat in GT or R line spec.
Agree re the 3 series, get over the looks and the 5 is a decent car. On the Mondeo front, see bold, perceived poor cabin materials isnt build quality, if it breaks down and doesn't perform to spec is build quality issues. On the whole as an owner and looking after a fleet at work i've found Mondeos over th years to be excellent workhorses and dead reliableAlthough a 5 series poses good value the F11 was a shocking design and doesn't look great even in msport guise, the G31 is much better but won't come cheap and at barely 2 years old maybe out of budget?
I've got plenty of experience with Mondeo's and although a good driving car and better that Insignia's in my opinion they are of crap build quality, shockingly poor material standard.
E-Class circa 2013 on after the facelift are very good value and if you see the mileages on auto trader they are pretty resilient, can't say I've heard of many horror stories. Manuals tend to be scarce but often cheaper if found as they are less desirable to the target audience!
I am a big Audi / Vw fan and although pricey the A6 Avant may be worth a look or possibly a new shape Passat in GT or R line spec.
You are dealing with the cars as new if its fleet related (I assume) ironically I tend to deal with exfleet 3 year old cars and can assure you the amount of bits cars need flung at them, Mondeos are high up there. I've just put 2 genuine front wheel bearings on the same corner one after the other a Mondeo thats done 6k miles between them. Exhausts seem to be an issue as well as boot leaks. the list goes on!
The OP is likely to be buying at 3 years old plus (possibly) you need to compare apples and apples!
Given most of ours have done 100k plus when they go back I reckon apples are apples here and I see a decent volume. Plus i've owned a few myself.
Happy to agree to disagree but i dont buy Mondeos being of poor build quality, build quality to me is the way components are assembled not the components themselves which is where we may be at odds? I agree the weak spot on most fords for me is transmission related, cv joints, lower arms, wheel bearings etc, none feel as robust/high quality as they might, but they don't fail out of spec much either and prove a great high mile fleet car.
Thanks for all the comments and suggestions: particular re the E350, Q50 and 330d
Also thanks for the comment about the continuing tax on cars of list price over £40K.
I’m re-considering a diesel: though my annual mileage is low, most weekends I do 60 mile round trip which can be done via motorway….would this be enough to keep a DPF in a good state?:
On my question in the OP on reliability of the more complex cars from 3 years old it and. possibility of big bills at the car ages.......seems the consensus it that there isn’t too much to worry about, if I the judge the tone of the thread correctly?
Also thanks for the comment about the continuing tax on cars of list price over £40K.
I’m re-considering a diesel: though my annual mileage is low, most weekends I do 60 mile round trip which can be done via motorway….would this be enough to keep a DPF in a good state?:
On my question in the OP on reliability of the more complex cars from 3 years old it and. possibility of big bills at the car ages.......seems the consensus it that there isn’t too much to worry about, if I the judge the tone of the thread correctly?
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