Best 4-cylinder diesel engine?...
Discussion
All things considered: reliability, refinement, performance, economy etc. I know that for some asking what is the best 4 cylinder diesel, is like asking what is your favourite "50 Shades of Grey" novel but I'm after a cheapish diesel for a longish commute. Doing it in a 1.4 TSI mk7 Golf auto at the moment, which is nice but I'm only getting low 30s on the commute at the moment, which is a little disappointing. Not an issue though, as my wife is due a new car and likes the Golf, so we'll keep it for family duties. Whereas a 5/6-pot Volvo/Mercedes/BMW/Audi diesel for the performance/extra refinement is tempting, you only get low 40s mpg in my experience and I'm really after 50mpg+ and lower RFL. Had a 3-pot Polo TDI back in the day and it did 60mpg on the commute no problem but was a little "rough", so don't want another 3-pot diesel.
Had a few mk4 Golf/B5 Passats as company cars in the past and the PD 130 engine was a highlight and seems to go on forever, so that's currently where I'm leaning. The turbocharged PSA XUD engines were also brilliant in their day but anything with one of those engines is going to be knocking on a bit now and I was never as impressed with the newer HDi engines. Haven't driven a post-PD VW diesel either, so don't know whether they're any good and they come with a bit of a stigma now, which is why I gave the TSI a go on my current car having been impressed by the fuel economy and performance of a 1.2 TSI Golf that I had as a hire car a few years ago. I haven't owned a diesel since 2013 and my only recent experience of diesel have been Ford Focus/Vauxhall Mokka hire cars, which I found pretty horrible to be honest (the cars were OK but the engines were horrid).
So is it just "rose-tinted glasses" with the old VW PD engines or were they really that good and all things considered, have they been bettered by anything since? Let's say 5k as a budget ceiling but 3-4k would be better (trying to reduce our outgoings on car payments and thinking about getting a bike for fun).
Had a few mk4 Golf/B5 Passats as company cars in the past and the PD 130 engine was a highlight and seems to go on forever, so that's currently where I'm leaning. The turbocharged PSA XUD engines were also brilliant in their day but anything with one of those engines is going to be knocking on a bit now and I was never as impressed with the newer HDi engines. Haven't driven a post-PD VW diesel either, so don't know whether they're any good and they come with a bit of a stigma now, which is why I gave the TSI a go on my current car having been impressed by the fuel economy and performance of a 1.2 TSI Golf that I had as a hire car a few years ago. I haven't owned a diesel since 2013 and my only recent experience of diesel have been Ford Focus/Vauxhall Mokka hire cars, which I found pretty horrible to be honest (the cars were OK but the engines were horrid).
So is it just "rose-tinted glasses" with the old VW PD engines or were they really that good and all things considered, have they been bettered by anything since? Let's say 5k as a budget ceiling but 3-4k would be better (trying to reduce our outgoings on car payments and thinking about getting a bike for fun).
white_goodman said:
So is it just "rose-tinted glasses" with the old VW PD engines or were they really that good and all things considered, have they been bettered by anything since? Let's say 5k as a budget ceiling but 3-4k would be better (trying to reduce our outgoings on car payments and thinking about getting a bike for fun).
Possibly a left-field suggestion - buy a PD-powered shed type car around £1500, and keep the same again in a savings account so you can buy a replacement should something catastrophic happen.This is assuming you're not commuting into an urban centre that's putting up a ULEZ of course.
I think the 1.9 VW diesel is the one that always seems to come up quite high in reliability for large mileage. No DPF to worry about either.
I reckon that this engine in a polo or ibiza of that generation is the most economical you're going to get without it being painfully slow. If you need a cruiser then passat or similar would work too.
The Honda 2.2 is meant to be very good too but I'm not sure about clutch life based on the internet and the automatic is a bit slow and too high revving for my liking (had it in a CRV).
Agree with the previous post of buy something for £1,500 and keep the change...
I reckon that this engine in a polo or ibiza of that generation is the most economical you're going to get without it being painfully slow. If you need a cruiser then passat or similar would work too.
The Honda 2.2 is meant to be very good too but I'm not sure about clutch life based on the internet and the automatic is a bit slow and too high revving for my liking (had it in a CRV).
Agree with the previous post of buy something for £1,500 and keep the change...
Krikkit said:
Possibly a left-field suggestion - buy a PD-powered shed type car around £1500, and keep the same again in a savings account so you can buy a replacement should something catastrophic happen.
This is assuming you're not commuting into an urban centre that's putting up a ULEZ of course.
ULEZ shouldn't be an issue for me right now. You make a good point and thanks for making it. I would be perfectly happy with spending less if I found the right car but even if it is just a "white goods" tool, I don't want to be driving around in a complete POS. I'll be spending more time in this car than the family car, so it has to be a pleasant place to be (comfortable, refined etc), presentable because I still take pride in my cars even if they're cheap, a decent drive and dependable because I need to get where I'm going reliably.This is assuming you're not commuting into an urban centre that's putting up a ULEZ of course.
Artsy said:
I think the 1.9 VW diesel is the one that always seems to come up quite high in reliability for large mileage. No DPF to worry about either.
I reckon that this engine in a polo or ibiza of that generation is the most economical you're going to get without it being painfully slow. If you need a cruiser then passat or similar would work too.
The Honda 2.2 is meant to be very good too but I'm not sure about clutch life based on the internet and the automatic is a bit slow and too high revving for my liking (had it in a CRV).
Agree with the previous post of buy something for £1,500 and keep the change...
Should have mentioned that I don't need an auto (in fact in an older car, auto is probably less efficient), it's just that my current car happens to be automatic. It was the spec that I was after (leather, pan roof, 18" wheels etc) and the right age and mileage and importantly price but just happened to be automatic rather than manual. I still like it and my wife prefers an automatic, so that's all fine but I'm good with and usually buy manual. Thanks for the other suggestions. A friend had a 1.9 TDI Polo and had a few gearbox issues with it. My Polo (2008) wasn't as comfortable as my mk4 Golf and although the mk4 Golf is hardly a beacon for handling, I think that it did feel a bit more surefooted than the Polo. Never tried an Ibiza though and they're certainly more attractive looking than the older Polos. Honda is also a good shout. Always liked the "spaceship" shape Civic, had a later 2013 Civic with the 1.8 petrol and was rather disappointed by it but I've never tried the diesel, so worth taking a look. MG ZT is also a guilty pleasure but quite rare now, not sure whether the manual or automatic would suit that car best with the 135bhp diesel engine? I reckon that this engine in a polo or ibiza of that generation is the most economical you're going to get without it being painfully slow. If you need a cruiser then passat or similar would work too.
The Honda 2.2 is meant to be very good too but I'm not sure about clutch life based on the internet and the automatic is a bit slow and too high revving for my liking (had it in a CRV).
Agree with the previous post of buy something for £1,500 and keep the change...
A1VDY said:
There's only one, VW 1.9 PD.
Various power outputs, 100, 115, 130&150hp. They're all good. Be aware though that the 6 speed gearbox can be trouble some in some variants..
Remind me which ones got the 6-speed? The 130/150 mk4 Golfs IIRC but maybe not the B5 Passats (apart from the Sport)? My spec of choice for the Passat was the Highline. More comfortable seats than the Sport and didn't ground out as easily, albeit a bit floatier...Various power outputs, 100, 115, 130&150hp. They're all good. Be aware though that the 6 speed gearbox can be trouble some in some variants..
manmaths said:
What about the Fabia vRS? My brother had 2 and they were pretty nippy from what I remember. I think they ran the PD130 engine. Looks like there are still a few in good nick for sale.
Thanks. Good shout. The seats might be a dealbreaker. I drove a lesser Fabia and found the seats very uncomfortable but the ones in the vRS might be better. Octavia/Superb might be worth a look though...white_goodman said:
The turbocharged PSA XUD engines were also brilliant in their day but anything with one of those engines is going to be knocking on a bit now
Even the latest ones are late nineties, so not many around now. I bought an N-reg 306 with that engine in 2014 for £50 as a stopgap. Ended up keeping it for nearly three years and put over 50k miles on it without any issues. Without modification it could be run on veg oil at 35-pence-per-litre. It cost just over £20 to fill the tank and that would last up to 700 miles if driven carefully. Sold it in 2017 and it's still showing as taxed and tested today! I regret selling that car...Modern diesels are undoubtedly more refined, more powerful, more economical, etc., but give me a clattering old XUD any day of the week.
The 2 litre diesel in the latest VW Caddies (plural 
) gets my vote. The 102hp has some urge for what it is, is refined compared
to the Transit Duratorq 1.5 (don't even bother with the 75hp Transit Long Wheel Base as it is unrefined and is a painful experience).
BMW's diesels have always sounded good, the latest 320d is refined.
) gets my vote. The 102hp has some urge for what it is, is refined comparedto the Transit Duratorq 1.5 (don't even bother with the 75hp Transit Long Wheel Base as it is unrefined and is a painful experience).
BMW's diesels have always sounded good, the latest 320d is refined.
Can't believe someone mentioned refinement and PD in the same sentence. C'mon guys, you got your bias glasses on top of your VW ones??
I can't comment on Merc engines, but the N47 is a bloody brilliant engine for (a while) 4 cylinder jobbie. Fast, powerful, eco. And it's really good for what, getting on 100k miles to.
D5 engine especially in 185 horse is brilliant, and very robust.
I personally think the later DV6 (Aghhhhhhh, did I really mention that), is pretty good now, but whatever you do, prior to 2010 is a nightmare. The injectors make a big difference in this engine, so roughness is usually poor injectors.
Best engine though, DW10 PSA unit? Questionable, but big miles from these with few issues it seems.
I've had very good service from the K9K 1.5 dci too.
Just for reference we run a small fleet of 20 - 30 cars, almost all diesel. Not a German among them, as I simply cannot afford to maintain them - or the cars they come is at any rate. (Oh, sorry, forgot about the 5 cylinder Merc engine in my Jeep). That's OK so far.
I can't comment on Merc engines, but the N47 is a bloody brilliant engine for (a while) 4 cylinder jobbie. Fast, powerful, eco. And it's really good for what, getting on 100k miles to.
D5 engine especially in 185 horse is brilliant, and very robust.
I personally think the later DV6 (Aghhhhhhh, did I really mention that), is pretty good now, but whatever you do, prior to 2010 is a nightmare. The injectors make a big difference in this engine, so roughness is usually poor injectors.
Best engine though, DW10 PSA unit? Questionable, but big miles from these with few issues it seems.
I've had very good service from the K9K 1.5 dci too.
Just for reference we run a small fleet of 20 - 30 cars, almost all diesel. Not a German among them, as I simply cannot afford to maintain them - or the cars they come is at any rate. (Oh, sorry, forgot about the 5 cylinder Merc engine in my Jeep). That's OK so far.
white_goodman said:
Don't think I've driven that one. The Mokka that I drove was a 1.6 CDTi I think. What did the 1.7 come in? The 1.9 CDTi of that era was problematic?
I had a Vectra with the 1.9 as a company car. It went back after 3 and a bit years with over 120k on the clock. I had no problems at all with it once they sorted out the fault it left the factory with - leaky inlet manifold that caused random limp home errors. Great engine, averaged a shade over 50mpgI've had several over the years as company cars.
Best engine was in my Volvo v60 D4. On paper very efficient, 99 g co2 so low tax but 179 bhp. It was also smooth and good to drive.
Next up was the VAG CR 2.0 diesel. Had 3 of these and liked it best in a Superb with 170bhp and an auto.
Didn't particularly like Vauxhall's diesel or Honda's, and it's a bit gruff on my ford that I have now.
Reliability wise, I've never had an issue with any diesel engine.
Best engine was in my Volvo v60 D4. On paper very efficient, 99 g co2 so low tax but 179 bhp. It was also smooth and good to drive.
Next up was the VAG CR 2.0 diesel. Had 3 of these and liked it best in a Superb with 170bhp and an auto.
Didn't particularly like Vauxhall's diesel or Honda's, and it's a bit gruff on my ford that I have now.
Reliability wise, I've never had an issue with any diesel engine.
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