RX8 replacement?
Discussion
So I have had a RX8 as a daily, which I bought after basically not having another option. I was concerned but I took the risk. Now it seems it is in its last legs. Sad because in many ways it is the perfect daily. It's a RWD manual sports car which not only has real back seats but even rear doors. But it's not a big 4 door saloon or a hot hatch, which is a good thing.
When I bought it I bought exactly because of that. There is basically no equal and no real competition. The only similar thing would be a Ferrari FF if it was RWD and had a manual. Or a GTC4Lusso if it had a manual. And of course cost considerably less.
Now the RX8 is in its last legs and I always knew this day could come. My thought was, if or when it comes I will just buy another one. They are affordable. But honestly, after everything, I'm not sure I want to do that any longer. I investigated the engine swap kits available but that would put the price of the car at around 10-15k and who knows what Pandora's box I would be opening with that.
So here I am again, where I was. No option that will do what the RX8 did. Yes, it lacks torque, even if the hp is more than fine for a daily. Yes it can get tiresome sometimes to have to rev the nuts out of it for any and everything when driving in traffic or overtaking. But despite all this, it is a lot of fun to drive, handles fantastically, and again, it's probably the only sports car which is as practical as a saloon for all effects and purpose.
I don't want a FWD hot hatch. I don't want a 4 door saloon. I can't use a 2 seats sports car. Any 2 door car that I can think of, even with a back seat, will just make me miss the RX8. But I also don't want to put up with the rotary annoyances anymore. I would gladly do it again if it at least had the torque and power to make it worth the high costs and maintenance and make it easier to swallow the V8 levels of fuel drinking. Or if it wouldn't drink like a maniac.
I'm in a dead end alley here. I guess this is more of a rant than a request really hoping for any suggestions of cars that could replace it. But who knows. Maybe I will see something I couldn't before. Desperation will do that sometimes.
When I bought it I bought exactly because of that. There is basically no equal and no real competition. The only similar thing would be a Ferrari FF if it was RWD and had a manual. Or a GTC4Lusso if it had a manual. And of course cost considerably less.
Now the RX8 is in its last legs and I always knew this day could come. My thought was, if or when it comes I will just buy another one. They are affordable. But honestly, after everything, I'm not sure I want to do that any longer. I investigated the engine swap kits available but that would put the price of the car at around 10-15k and who knows what Pandora's box I would be opening with that.
So here I am again, where I was. No option that will do what the RX8 did. Yes, it lacks torque, even if the hp is more than fine for a daily. Yes it can get tiresome sometimes to have to rev the nuts out of it for any and everything when driving in traffic or overtaking. But despite all this, it is a lot of fun to drive, handles fantastically, and again, it's probably the only sports car which is as practical as a saloon for all effects and purpose.
I don't want a FWD hot hatch. I don't want a 4 door saloon. I can't use a 2 seats sports car. Any 2 door car that I can think of, even with a back seat, will just make me miss the RX8. But I also don't want to put up with the rotary annoyances anymore. I would gladly do it again if it at least had the torque and power to make it worth the high costs and maintenance and make it easier to swallow the V8 levels of fuel drinking. Or if it wouldn't drink like a maniac.
I'm in a dead end alley here. I guess this is more of a rant than a request really hoping for any suggestions of cars that could replace it. But who knows. Maybe I will see something I couldn't before. Desperation will do that sometimes.
Edited by GTdrive on Wednesday 17th February 21:50
M135i.
Pros: faster, more torque, much more economical, more space, much more practical boot. Six cylinder snarl.
Cons: handling isn't a patch on an RX8, steering isn't as communicative, not as fun.
15k would get you a decent second hand model.
I'm glad I owned an RX8 but I consider it the worst car I have ever owned, flawed in so many stupid ways it infuriated me. Steering was great and I enjoyed the handling, which was what I was looking for when I purchased it.
Pros: faster, more torque, much more economical, more space, much more practical boot. Six cylinder snarl.
Cons: handling isn't a patch on an RX8, steering isn't as communicative, not as fun.
15k would get you a decent second hand model.
I'm glad I owned an RX8 but I consider it the worst car I have ever owned, flawed in so many stupid ways it infuriated me. Steering was great and I enjoyed the handling, which was what I was looking for when I purchased it.
hiccy18 said:
M135i.
Pros: faster, more torque, much more economical, more space, much more practical boot. Six cylinder snarl.
Cons: handling isn't a patch on an RX8, steering isn't as communicative, not as fun.
15k would get you a decent second hand model.
I'm glad I owned an RX8 but I consider it the worst car I have ever owned, flawed in so many stupid ways it infuriated me. Steering was great and I enjoyed the handling, which was what I was looking for when I purchased it.
Thanks for your input. But this is what I mean. The M135i is just a normal common car. A 4 doors hatchback. It is an alternative to a Golf. Not to a car like the Rx8. Your list of cons is exactly what disqualifies it in my opinion. Otherwise really any car could be a replacement for the RX8. Pros: faster, more torque, much more economical, more space, much more practical boot. Six cylinder snarl.
Cons: handling isn't a patch on an RX8, steering isn't as communicative, not as fun.
15k would get you a decent second hand model.
I'm glad I owned an RX8 but I consider it the worst car I have ever owned, flawed in so many stupid ways it infuriated me. Steering was great and I enjoyed the handling, which was what I was looking for when I purchased it.
This is what makes the RX8 such a hard act to follow. it is a true sports car in the sense of the word and looks exotic too. But it has rear seats and rear doors.
I did the 2 cars thing. Problem is you are never driving the car you really want to be driving. So I rather have a special car as a daily. My plans was to then get something really and properly special for weekend duties. Something faster, rear mid engine and even more exotic.
The GT86 is indeed the closest thing, But just on paper. I passed on it when I went for the RX8 because it basically has the same power, same low torque, but it's uglier, the rear seats are a joke and the RX8 on top of having real rear seats has also rear doors. My RX8 is the later looking facelift. I think it looks way better. But the deal breaker in the GT86 is that I need real rear seats. I have small children. In the RX8 it's basically no different than in most hatchbacks and smaller saloons. The seats work well.
Not to mention that the RX8 has a premium feeling compared to the GT86. GT86 feels cheap in comparison. So the only upgrade would be the reliability. The rest is the same or a downgrade. And no usable rear seats breaks the deal.
The GT86 is indeed the closest thing, But just on paper. I passed on it when I went for the RX8 because it basically has the same power, same low torque, but it's uglier, the rear seats are a joke and the RX8 on top of having real rear seats has also rear doors. My RX8 is the later looking facelift. I think it looks way better. But the deal breaker in the GT86 is that I need real rear seats. I have small children. In the RX8 it's basically no different than in most hatchbacks and smaller saloons. The seats work well.
Not to mention that the RX8 has a premium feeling compared to the GT86. GT86 feels cheap in comparison. So the only upgrade would be the reliability. The rest is the same or a downgrade. And no usable rear seats breaks the deal.
Edited by GTdrive on Thursday 18th February 06:40
If it has to be RWD, manual and useable rear seats then you are looking at BMW. With small kids who regularly travel in the back I'd be thinking 3 series. If you went for a 335i you lose the sports car look of the Mazda but gain in many other areas like performance and practicality. There has to be compromise so youay as well balance that in your favour.
Getting fixated about a certain make and model isn't helpful because in reality there are loads of great options out there that would work for you. I bought a BMW because it was RWD, manual and 6 cylinder but now I'm back in a FWD hot hatch I don't miss those attributes at all. Unless you do a lot of track days I think RWD is pretty useless on our roads, not once did I get anything like an opportunity to make full use of it in 3 years. Same with my old MR2 which was fun to drive but I didn't exactly go drifting around corners.
How about 4WD?
Audi TTS?
Or if you like old Mazda's there was always the 6mps if you can find a nice one.
Getting fixated about a certain make and model isn't helpful because in reality there are loads of great options out there that would work for you. I bought a BMW because it was RWD, manual and 6 cylinder but now I'm back in a FWD hot hatch I don't miss those attributes at all. Unless you do a lot of track days I think RWD is pretty useless on our roads, not once did I get anything like an opportunity to make full use of it in 3 years. Same with my old MR2 which was fun to drive but I didn't exactly go drifting around corners.
How about 4WD?
Audi TTS?
Or if you like old Mazda's there was always the 6mps if you can find a nice one.
I'm now looking to buy a RX8 for exactly the reason's the op stated. Rear seats affordable sports car. The only thing that comes close I think is the GT86, which I initially wanted, before realising this is probably my last chance of owning a rotary engine.
What's wrong with your rx8, it sounds like you have a r3, so we'll worth repairing?
Don't buy a BMW. A fairly mundane car with a big engine does not equal a sports car.
What's wrong with your rx8, it sounds like you have a r3, so we'll worth repairing?
Don't buy a BMW. A fairly mundane car with a big engine does not equal a sports car.
Is yours an R3? I'd agree that it is a tough car to replace, I loved mine and only sold it when I bought an Elise.
I couldn't stomach the fueling and tax costs in the end, but if I could afford it there probably wouldn't be any other reason to sell it, it's a beautiful looking cars, handles sublime and you won't find an engine that is smoother anywhere. Values look unlikely to drop much further either.
I couldn't stomach the fueling and tax costs in the end, but if I could afford it there probably wouldn't be any other reason to sell it, it's a beautiful looking cars, handles sublime and you won't find an engine that is smoother anywhere. Values look unlikely to drop much further either.
You want a car that feels like a sports car. Looks different from a saloon. Has good performance with room in the rear and is a good drivers car.
You don't want ruinous fuel bills or reliability issues but you'd take the cost if it meant you had a bit more torque/"oomph" at your right foot.
Its tough, as you said OP, the rx8 is pretty much in a class all of its own. Not because its brilliant at any one thing but because there aren't really any competitors that offer a 4-dr coupe style with a unique engine. Not to say its bad, far from it, i like the rx8 and they are a really good steer. Surprisingly big inside - will fit four adults albeit i wouldn't go on any long journeys but is doable.
Thinking a bit outside the box. The only thing i can think of would be a Porsche Panamera. It isn't what is classically a boxy saloon nor is it a coupe, but somewhere in the middle.
I think it provides you enough of the elements you are considering for a next car. Granted i wouldn't call any Porsche "cheap" to run. But then the rx8 is a ticking bomb waiting to happen. Whereas the Porsche, if you buy it at the right time it its service cycle could be fairly inexpensive to maintain as reliability is generally quite high. But of course there is a risk of big bills.
But for me. I think something like this would fit the bill fairly well -
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202102118...
Likewise the CLS55/63 AMG gives lovely sleek coupe esque lines but with the space and convenience of four doors -
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202101278...
Or at the cheaper end perhaps the VW CC with the v6 engine.
Again, each is a compromise and not exactly what you are after. I feel the Porsche is the pick of them, though still a compromise, but i think they all manage to walk the line between the likes of what you are after.
Alternatively, if you are fed up of v8 fuel costs in a spanked rotary - spend the money from a new car on an LS swap by someone like Craig at Dynotorque in the midlands and actually have the RXv8 - a much more reliable engine and a fair few conversions done now that prove its quite feasible and within your budget to do.
You don't want ruinous fuel bills or reliability issues but you'd take the cost if it meant you had a bit more torque/"oomph" at your right foot.
Its tough, as you said OP, the rx8 is pretty much in a class all of its own. Not because its brilliant at any one thing but because there aren't really any competitors that offer a 4-dr coupe style with a unique engine. Not to say its bad, far from it, i like the rx8 and they are a really good steer. Surprisingly big inside - will fit four adults albeit i wouldn't go on any long journeys but is doable.
Thinking a bit outside the box. The only thing i can think of would be a Porsche Panamera. It isn't what is classically a boxy saloon nor is it a coupe, but somewhere in the middle.
I think it provides you enough of the elements you are considering for a next car. Granted i wouldn't call any Porsche "cheap" to run. But then the rx8 is a ticking bomb waiting to happen. Whereas the Porsche, if you buy it at the right time it its service cycle could be fairly inexpensive to maintain as reliability is generally quite high. But of course there is a risk of big bills.
But for me. I think something like this would fit the bill fairly well -
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202102118...
Likewise the CLS55/63 AMG gives lovely sleek coupe esque lines but with the space and convenience of four doors -
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202101278...
Or at the cheaper end perhaps the VW CC with the v6 engine.
Again, each is a compromise and not exactly what you are after. I feel the Porsche is the pick of them, though still a compromise, but i think they all manage to walk the line between the likes of what you are after.
Alternatively, if you are fed up of v8 fuel costs in a spanked rotary - spend the money from a new car on an LS swap by someone like Craig at Dynotorque in the midlands and actually have the RXv8 - a much more reliable engine and a fair few conversions done now that prove its quite feasible and within your budget to do.
Yes, I'm aware it is basically impossible to replace the RX8, as I mentioned. 
I also know that I will need to compromise. But where I won't or can't compromise is on it being RWD, manual and having real back seats.
I know there is no way around compromising on the rear doors. As said, the RX8 is unique. There is no other sports car with rear doors. So I'm fine with that. Fine with the ideas of no rear doors. Prefer that than driving a 4 door saloon or any conventional 4 door, regardless of it being saloon, estate or hothatch. It can be without rear doors. But must be a coupe Reason also being weight. The RX8 barely weighs more than 1300kg. A Panamera, despite being among the ugliest car is a whale in comparison.
The problem is not really the fuel costs. I would be glad to pay for the fuel if it gave back a matching amount of power. So being economical is not the problem. I'm just tired of babying the engine. I don't care for rotaries. This is not the reason I bought it. I didn't buy it because I love wankles. I would first put up with babying a nice Alfa V6, or a V8, V10 and the like, because I like them, they sound nice and I'm a fan. I have no such feelings for rotaries. The only reason I bought a rotary is because it came in the RX8 and that is the perfect shell for my needs.
If at least it was reliable and gave power, the fuel would be fine. So the only problem is not just that my engine is going bad. The problem is the engine! I don't want to spend money replacing it as if it was a consumable.
As for the requirement for rear seats, I have children. They currently fit well in the RX8. Not different than in a hatchback really. Or even smaller 4 door saloons. It's actually easier to get them in the back of the RX8, because of the suicide doors. It's just a big large opening. Yes, they will grow but you can easily fit 3 adults in the RX8. 4 adults if one of the front ones is not so tall. It is really practical and even has a nice size boot. We have a second large car too. So the RX8 is for the eventual time I need it to be practical. I might need to carry the kids a few times a week. But it is not our only car. It is just my daily.
So it doesn't need to be a short term purchase. Adults are fine in the back seat for city driving and short country runs. I wouldn't drive to the south of France with 4 adults though. But also not impossible.
As far as having loads of options, not really. Yes, loads of options as long as it's a BMW it seems. That's not loads of options. I'm also not fixated at all in a brand. Its more about the unique features the RX8 offers.
I looked at swaps and found nothing that makes financial sense. This is even before looking into the legality of it. And I think a V8 would be a mistake. Much of the handling would be just ruined. It would need to be probably a V6. The shortest engine profile and closest to the rotary. Otherwise you have too much engine sticking out beyond the front axle and everything is ruined. Interestingly, I checked Dynotorque now and the reason the owner swap a RX8 is exactly because he needed a sports car which he can take his kids in as well.
I knew this would be difficult. There is a reason I bought a RX8 in the first place instead of a FWD hothatch or a BMW 3 or even a GT86. The only BMW that would come close is if there was a Z4 coupe with real rear seats. Otherwise I would feel better about an Alfa GT, if it was RWD, than any other 2 doors BMW I can think of. At least the Alfa looks nice and is more of a coupe than 2 door saloon. The space in the back of an Alfa GT is also more than enough. Although still heavier than the RX8. At least in V6 guise.
I also know that I will need to compromise. But where I won't or can't compromise is on it being RWD, manual and having real back seats.
I know there is no way around compromising on the rear doors. As said, the RX8 is unique. There is no other sports car with rear doors. So I'm fine with that. Fine with the ideas of no rear doors. Prefer that than driving a 4 door saloon or any conventional 4 door, regardless of it being saloon, estate or hothatch. It can be without rear doors. But must be a coupe
Reason also being weight. The RX8 barely weighs more than 1300kg. A Panamera, despite being among the ugliest car is a whale in comparison.The problem is not really the fuel costs. I would be glad to pay for the fuel if it gave back a matching amount of power. So being economical is not the problem. I'm just tired of babying the engine. I don't care for rotaries. This is not the reason I bought it. I didn't buy it because I love wankles. I would first put up with babying a nice Alfa V6, or a V8, V10 and the like, because I like them, they sound nice and I'm a fan. I have no such feelings for rotaries. The only reason I bought a rotary is because it came in the RX8 and that is the perfect shell for my needs.
If at least it was reliable and gave power, the fuel would be fine. So the only problem is not just that my engine is going bad. The problem is the engine!
I don't want to spend money replacing it as if it was a consumable. As for the requirement for rear seats, I have children. They currently fit well in the RX8. Not different than in a hatchback really. Or even smaller 4 door saloons. It's actually easier to get them in the back of the RX8, because of the suicide doors. It's just a big large opening. Yes, they will grow but you can easily fit 3 adults in the RX8. 4 adults if one of the front ones is not so tall. It is really practical and even has a nice size boot. We have a second large car too. So the RX8 is for the eventual time I need it to be practical. I might need to carry the kids a few times a week. But it is not our only car. It is just my daily.
So it doesn't need to be a short term purchase. Adults are fine in the back seat for city driving and short country runs. I wouldn't drive to the south of France with 4 adults though. But also not impossible.
As far as having loads of options, not really. Yes, loads of options as long as it's a BMW it seems.
That's not loads of options. I'm also not fixated at all in a brand. Its more about the unique features the RX8 offers. I looked at swaps and found nothing that makes financial sense. This is even before looking into the legality of it. And I think a V8 would be a mistake. Much of the handling would be just ruined. It would need to be probably a V6. The shortest engine profile and closest to the rotary. Otherwise you have too much engine sticking out beyond the front axle and everything is ruined. Interestingly, I checked Dynotorque now and the reason the owner swap a RX8 is exactly because he needed a sports car which he can take his kids in as well.
I knew this would be difficult. There is a reason I bought a RX8 in the first place instead of a FWD hothatch or a BMW 3 or even a GT86. The only BMW that would come close is if there was a Z4 coupe with real rear seats. Otherwise I would feel better about an Alfa GT, if it was RWD, than any other 2 doors BMW I can think of. At least the Alfa looks nice and is more of a coupe than 2 door saloon. The space in the back of an Alfa GT is also more than enough. Although still heavier than the RX8. At least in V6 guise.
Your thread is similar to mine, I even mention that I'm looking for something that gave me that same feeling at the RX8:
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
The only thing that could really come close to the RX8 is a manual BMW M2.
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
The only thing that could really come close to the RX8 is a manual BMW M2.
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