EVs... no one wants them!

[Still Mulling]

There are a few places cropping up who claim to replace only damaged cells/modules/portions (I've forgotten the correct terminology right now), thus making a myth out of the "whole battery needs replacing as the only fix". Much as any information on the internet can be trusted these days, they seem to be reasonably well reviewed.

[hiccy18]

Still Mulling said:

There are a few places cropping up who claim to replace only damaged cells/modules/portions (I've forgotten the correct terminology right now), thus making a myth out of the "whole battery needs replacing as the only fix". Much as any information on the internet can be trusted these days, they seem to be reasonably well reviewed.

That's car dependent though:

https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportat...

[raspy]

silent ninja said:

Switched to my first EV on Wednesday. BMW iX3 M Sport Pro. What a brilliant car.

Quiet, smooth and very refined. Fantastic to drive. Excellent fit and finish with soft touch materials everywhere and proper buttons.

The level of refinement compared to ICE is something else. I can't see any ICE of similar cost and class coming close with the overall experience. It really does feel like entering a new era of motoring.

I get this is a premium model, but cheaper electrics are coming.

On the negative side, there is a trade-off. EVs are too complicated for the regular public in my opinion where we are used to 'fill and go' simplicity. EVs are anything but that.

Average Joe needs to understand: charger port types, AC/DC, complicated EV energy tariffs, home charger market (it's quickly becoming a minefield), tethered Vs untethered, pre heating, kWh conversions and 'engine' size, charging subscriptions and apps, all the faff with public charging and extensive route planning.

I tried my first public charge on the weekend. Contactless wouldn't work. In the middle of nowhere I had to download an app, register my name, details and password, input payment details, find charger on map. Decipher which charger the app was referring to out of the 4 available (no signage)...then it took 3 attempts to get the charging session started. Has anyone mentioned how heavy hypercharge cables are? This one could do 150kW+ and my wife simply wouldn't be able to lift it up. It's heavy and awkward to manoeuvre.

Wonderful experience once it's working, but many teething issues - some quite serious - that need to be fixed.

Didn't you get the BMW charging card from the dealer when you bought it? That's one card for use with charging points across the UK and Europe.

[Soupdragon65]

With a KIA you get their charging card which gives you tap and go charging across multiple sites at an average of 45p/ kWh for DC fast chargers (150-200kW). You also get a consolidated bill in your app. It's as simple as paying for petrol.

My EV is saving me an average of £300 per month compared to what I used to pay fro petrol.

[Rich135]

J1990 said:

Whilst it's not the cheapest motoring, it is a very cheap way to get in to those vehicles for two years. The cheapest 2yr lease for the same Polestar model comes in at £995/month and the i-Pace at £1041/month so effectively £500/month more for either vehicle to lease new.

We took our larger dog to the showrooms last night (after calling ahead to check) and unfortunately the maximum boot height of 66cm in the i-Pace and 64cm in the Polestar means that the mrs told me to keep looking. Most likely outcome is the Tucson gets extended for a year and simply delay this decision for another day...

Those pesky wives and dogs always ruin decisions! Tucson is a nice car to have through.

[SWoll]

J1990 said:

Whilst it's not the cheapest motoring, it is a very cheap way to get in to those vehicles for two years. The cheapest 2yr lease for the same Polestar model comes in at £995/month and the i-Pace at £1041/month so effectively £500/month more for either vehicle to lease new.

We took our larger dog to the showrooms last night (after calling ahead to check) and unfortunately the maximum boot height of 66cm in the i-Pace and 64cm in the Polestar means that the mrs told me to keep looking. Most likely outcome is the Tucson gets extended for a year and simply delay this decision for another day...

Used cars are cheaper than new cars shocker!

Neither model are very practical due to swooping roof lines etc. You might want to consider a BMW iX3 as a far more traditional SUV from a practicality standpoint, better range than the iPace and 2021 cars with limited mileage are around the £40k mark so should offer similar finance numbers to those quoted above.

Edited by SWoll on Thursday 23 March 09:36

[westberks]

raspy said:

Didn't you get the BMW charging card from the dealer when you bought it? That's one card for use with charging points across the UK and Europe.

doesn't work with all charging points networks i found

[SWoll]

westberks said:

raspy said:

Didn't you get the BMW charging card from the dealer when you bought it? That's one card for use with charging points across the UK and Europe.

doesn't work with all charging points networks i found

Only Ionity I believe?

[westberks]

SWoll said:

J1990 said:

Whilst it's not the cheapest motoring, it is a very cheap way to get in to those vehicles for two years. The cheapest 2yr lease for the same Polestar model comes in at £995/month and the i-Pace at £1041/month so effectively £500/month more for either vehicle to lease new.

We took our larger dog to the showrooms last night (after calling ahead to check) and unfortunately the maximum boot height of 66cm in the i-Pace and 64cm in the Polestar means that the mrs told me to keep looking. Most likely outcome is the Tucson gets extended for a year and simply delay this decision for another day...

Used cars are cheaper than new cars shocker!

Neither model are very practical due to swooping roof lines etc. You might want to consider a BMW iX3 as a far more traditional SUV from a practicality standpoint, better range than the iPace and 2021 cars with limited mileage are around the £40k mark so should offer similar finance numbers to those quoted above.

Edited by SWoll on Thursday 23 March 09:36

I've had the ix3 for 18 months and my Weimaraner is pretty comfy in the boot. I think you lose a little height due to the battery but still big enough. Hatchback style SUVs are a particular bugbear of mine

[SWoll]

Not sure why I didn't suggest it above, as I have one, but 2020 Audi etrons are also down in the £30-40k range now and have a huge boot.

[silent ninja]

Muzzer79 said:

I got my EV 3 weeks ago.

So far, so good. It definitely takes some getting used to and you need to plan stuff, but for me the range thing isn’t an issue

I went from the Midlands to Southampton on Tuesday morning, charged up a bit at our office, then headed to Oxford and jumped on a public charger there for a couple of hours at a very reasonable rate and then went home with plenty of range to spare.

The car is smooth, super-refined and the performance is great. My only criticism that’s EV-related (possibly) are the slightly spongy brakes.

Brakes on my iX3 feel like normal brakes. I stick it in low regeneration and they feel like traditional brakes - the car actually regenerates when I hit the brakes, and only uses friction brakes when strong braking is required.

BMW have done a superb job to make the car feel like an ICE to drive, but have all the refinement and power of EVs.

[silent ninja]

raspy said:

Didn't you get the BMW charging card from the dealer when you bought it? That's one card for use with charging points across the UK and Europe.

Yes I've ordered the charging card. I had to sign up to it via the myBMW app.
Still, charging services should be accessible whether you are a member or not. It's overly complicated at the moment, but it is early days in EV world.

[SWoll]

silent ninja said:

BMW have done a superb job to make the car feel like an ICE to drive, but have all the refinement and power of EVs.

I'm not even sure what that means TBH. Other than brake calibration (and driven plenty of ICE cars with over servoed unnatural feeling pedals) what else about the ICE driving experience does it replicate?

[silent ninja]

SWoll said:

I'm not even sure what that means TBH. Other than brake calibration (and driven plenty of ICE cars with over servoed unnatural feeling pedals) what else about the ICE driving experience does it replicate?

Whole set-up I think. Steering is weighty, even though it's by wire, and has good feel unlike most EVs. Brakes. The cabin arrangement including gear stick is ICE-esque. External design isn't outlandish. The fake acceleration note gives nice external feedback. The fake engine braking and coasting on low regen is brilliant and familiar- means you can slow toward a junction like a regular ICE car if you so choose....or you can flick to B mode and do one pedal driving.

It feels like a better ICE car and the best version of the X3.

[robemcdonald]

FWIW said:

robemcdonald said:

It might be a tad of a high estimate.
I used the charger closest to my parents house in Hampshire. It was at a Costa coffee between new Milton and Christchurch. I charged from 50% to 100%. The charger was 50 kw, so not even that fast. It was a Friday night and cost £0.87 / kWh.
34 kWh @ £0.87 is £29.58.
The average efficiency for the 5 months I had the car was 2.9 mi/kW.
2.9 x 66 kWh = 191 miles range.
To charge from 0-100% would be £0.87 x 66 = £57.42
Cost per mile is £57.42 / 191 = £0.30 /mile

So actually £60 for the 200 miles.

Thanks. £70 wasn’t far off…

…for a very inefficient EV at the most expensive charger you could find.

It’s not very useful to give outlier examples like this. It would be equally relevant for me to give a similar example using my local (free) charger and claiming 0ppm…

It might be an outlier, but it’s a real world example.

[krisdelta]

I've not heard the usual JLR horror stories about the iPace - biggest issue (until recently) was entry point - which has dropped by £10k in 6 months along with much else on the EV market (relatively).

[akadk]

I got another crazy pcp quote on a Polestar 2. It’s real

[SpeckledJim]

krisdelta said:

I've not heard the usual JLR horror stories about the iPace - biggest issue (until recently) was entry point - which has dropped by £10k in 6 months along with much else on the EV market (relatively).

I'm keeping a keen ear to the ground (as I want one) and it seems that owners generally really do love them. But when they fail they really fail, and parts availability is awful, and warranty protection similarly disappointing.

How quickly the delighted owners are being converted to disgusted owners is the tough thing to ascertain.

They don't seem as dismal as the Taycan, if that's any consolation.

[dmsims]

In addition to the usual st show of known issues (we did look at one when the it first came out but my wife sometimes needs to get to a hospital in a hurry reliably)



and from a JLR employee:

New levels of Jag JLR incompetence.
Love the I-PACE but not worth the JLR hassle anymore.
3 times tried to get the gearbox fault wiring loom fix done but Jaguar Northampton didn’t have the time every time it’s been in.
It finally fails, 3 days to get it collected and courtesy car delivered. When it was collected they sent 2 AA flat beds??? Car delivered 3 hours after they said it would be, then waiting in for the deliverer to come back and get his stuff he left in the car.
Cars already booked into a rebooked apt inNorthampton on the 12th August but Northampton can’t take it as a a recovery so it goes to MK who can’t fix it till end of September and JLR have said they can’t move it to Northampton for its rebooked appointment because they don’t move repair cars once they get to a site. Apparently if I had told JLR all this they would have taken it somewhere else for repair, although it was JLR who phoned me to tell me all the details I apparently needed to tell them. (Some kind of JLR paradox I think)
I can complain to Jag Customer relations but they close at 3pm (obviously as being open at convenient times would be good customer relations)
Lease will be up before the car can be fixed.


1/2/21 UPDATE
So ive had an eventful morning so far.
Call the garage and they said I had to call Jaguar assistance.
I pressed the button in the car for that and nobody answered.
I called the dealer to tell them and they put me through to Jag assistance, who didn't answer!
So I called the local dealer where I keep taking it to say I was on my way down and to get the courtesy car sorted.
I've been here maybe an hour now.
They can't deal with me without speaking to Jaguar assistance. So they called them to explain the situation and asked them to call me, from being stood outside the dealers due to covid.
Somebody called me and asked me to bring them to speed. After that, she said I couldn't have a courtesy car until it had been diagnosed as the fault.
There are only certain technicians that can work on the Electric cars and they don't have one available, but can see the problem is there.
So at the minute, we are at a stand off... the dealer want to give me the courtesy car and take my car, but the system says they can't.
Now they are saying because I drove the car to the dealer.. if I call the Jaguar assistance button now, they won't come out because I drove it knowing there was a fault.
They suggested I got a taxi home and called from there.
Still waiting for something to be sorted.
I have a 2 week old baby at home! I do not need this car taking up so much of my time!!!

• ************

30/1/21 update.
Got the car back and it's still broken!!!

• **************

14/01/21
Little update on my car.
Briefly. It broke down 4 days from new. Lost charge. Cut out on the motorway late at night in fog with no hard shoulder! My 35 week pregnant Girlfriend had to jump over the barrier. It's was 0°.
Took 10 days for them to get the car into a garage.
They then had the car 4 weeks.
I also mentioned to them a noise from the suspension. The shock was leaking and was replaced.
So I get the car back after 4 weeks, being told its been fixed and tested and I'm good to go.
1 day I had the car!
It wouldn't charge.
They took the car (after some fun and games) and 5 days later I had an email saying the part was in and being fixed that day. Then they would run some tests to make sure its charging.
That was a week ago. Heard nothing since dispute me calling and emailing them.
So enough is enough. I've asked to hand the car back.
Arval is the lease company I got the car from. I work for JLR and the lease was a salary reduction scheme.
Arval say its nothing to do with them, I need to speak to JLR HR
Just had an email back from HR to say there is nothing they will do but fix my car in due course. If I want to hand it back, it will be subject to the fees associated with ending a lease early even if the car was perfect.
So now it looks like I'll have to take legal advice.
I have said I would be happy to have the car replaced with another I pace, but I'm not happy to keep that one.
Watch this space..

krisdelta said:

I've not heard the usual JLR horror stories about the iPace - biggest issue (until recently) was entry point - which has dropped by £10k in 6 months along with much else on the EV market (relatively).

[Macron]

akadk said:

I got another crazy pcp quote on a Polestar 2. It’s real

This is genuinely intriguing,

Currently EV prices are, what... volatile? In a consistent direction?

We've seen an E-Golf on here drop heap in a few weeks, for example.

Yet there is a funder happy to guarantee practically no movement at all over 2 years.

What do they know that no one else does, they've got both hands and legs wrapped around the falling knife!?!?