Engine finally ready for Dyno test

[R0162]

Ye Mike...lol..they use different oils so you really dont want to be mixing them..i think i may have misunderstood your question.

They have to be separate but i think a laminova oil/water like what kevin and craig use are best for the gearbox, oil/air for the engine oil as it helps with coolant temps due to the turbos being oil and water cooled.

[Gadgeroonie]

i meant water radiators

[sundance002]

andygtt said:

is that a statement?.... as knowone else has suggested that.

all that adrian has questioned is the Knock detection techniques... seeing as he actually supplies ecu electronics to manufacturers i'm guessing he understands it a lot better than the rest of us.

lets be clear, what has been done to sundances car is awsome and it WILL be way better than the MBE... maybe it wont make more power than the MBE is capable of, but it will be a lot safer IMO.

Looks like it will be hitting the roads soon... will it stay in essex long enough for us to get a test ride?????

Hi Andy, lets.not forget there are aftermarket ecu on the shelf from all manufactures for sale, mine cannot be bought off the shelf false stop,

The MBE could make no more power than 633bhp 553ftlb, we have already shown this system has produced 10% more power with no change to the car so not only safer but a lot more power with the Life.

I know Adrian deals with ECU software, how many LMP cars use his system,? it seems that some people seem to think they fit aftermarket Ecus to LMP cars and 50 million pound budgeted racing cars, I don't think so, so until people understand that this is no ordanary ecu and not one available to the public anywhere then we might actuly make some progress in understanding what's been done. There is no point in comparing it with anything else cause its not like anything else.

Yep it will be in Essex til next April so loads of time for test ride and drive.

[sundance002]

swankBaton said:

Craig - With all the work to keep it cooler in the back, did you decide it wasnt worth using a bigger mesh on the side pods?

Hi Alistair, yes we will be using a wider mesh on the rear and the side pods , don't think Skip has got round to fitting them yet.

[sundance002]

Gadgeroonie said:

i meant water radiators

.

Don't think so.

[Hollowpockets]

Craig/Terry,

You don't need to justify the system to people, it's clearly very good. Its something I would consider as money well spent, next year I might chase you for info on how the car has performed following some use and give Terry a shout to get similar treatment on my one.

Cheers for the updates though.

Graham

[andygtt]

Hollowpockets said:

Craig/Terry,

You don't need to justify the system to people, it's clearly very good. Its something I would consider as money well spent, next year I might chase you for info on how the car has performed following some use and give Terry a shout to get similar treatment on my one.

Cheers for the updates though.

Graham

+1... im already sold, i spent a lot of money doing pretty much the same thing on my own... if this system had been available I would almost certainly have gone for it.

All very well making huge power on the standard ecu... but when it blows up your engine every time you have a minor issue with another component, its time to upgrade to something a little cleverer.

Im looking forward to the open day... and a test ride

[sundance002]

here's a few more pics of the engine cooler and the plumping work that Skip is finishing, should be ready for Wed to fire up.
[url]

|http://thumbsnap.com/S44LBDOp[/url][url]

|http://thumbsnap.com/4YBoaNx8[/url][url]

|http://thumbsnap.com/uqJSTf12[/url]

Edited by sundance002 on Thursday 11th October 11:13

[mgbond]

Can I ask what this cooler is:

Is this a water/oil cooler. Water is used to help warm the oil up quicker and also (along with the main rad and Fans) tries to keep the temp down.

To top it off, it also has air to help cool the rad and does it need a pump?

Would you have the same thing in the other pod for just gear box oil or just use that one as a std rad to be cooled by air flow? I assume this one needs a pump.

Bondy

[sundance002]

The oil cooler is water cooled, it's a Laminova type and doesn't need to have a rad.


www.speedflowshop.co.uk/laminova-oil-to-water-cool...

Edited by sundance002 on Thursday 11th October 14:13

[chuntington101]

Is there any concers that the added stress on the water radiator will result in over heating? its deffinately a much neater solution than having radiators in the side pods.

Chris.

[mgbond]

sundance002 said:

The oil cooler is water cooled, it's a Laminova type and doesn't need to have a rad.


www.speedflowshop.co.uk/laminova-oil-to-water-cool...

Edited by sundance002 on Thursday 11th October 14:13

But you've put it in the pod I assume as there is space and air flow (well, a bit).

Where have you plumbed it from the water side and did I here that Pro alloy are going to do a kit?

I've always liked this idea and as I don't track mine that much it seems ideal as it does take a while to get the oil up to temp.

And I suppose you could have one in the other pod for the gearbox right? Or even better that pro alloy do a twin core so you can have box and engine in the same system?


Bondy

Edited by mgbond on Thursday 11th October 19:55

[Juno]

sundance002 said:

Hi Andy, lets.not forget there are aftermarket ecu on the shelf from all manufactures for sale, mine cannot be bought off the shelf false stop,

The MBE could make no more power than 633bhp 553ftlb, we have already shown this system has produced 10% more power with no change to the car so not only safer but a lot more power with the Life.

I know Adrian deals with ECU software, how many LMP cars use his system,? it seems that some people seem to think they fit aftermarket Ecus to LMP cars and 50 million pound budgeted racing cars, I don't think so, so until people understand that this is no ordanary ecu and not one available to the public anywhere then we might actuly make some progress in understanding what's been done. There is no point in comparing it with anything else cause its not like anything else.

Yep it will be in Essex til next April so loads of time for test ride and drive.

OMG

At fking last, someone understands the Difference between race car and road car engineering

Simples

I feel my work is done

[R0162]

Barry,lmao,

Craig has just built a perfect example of a road car that will keep up with race cars if not trach the majority, your point is not made, its the opposite way round you muppet..stop thinking you have taught anybody anything seriously..lol..

Lets just please keep this thread about Craigs car please without you hijacking it and starting up that old arguement again about owing a dedicated race car, i'm liking reading this thread but everynow and then you keep on putting in these condecending comments, your entitled to your opinions but stop making out everybody else should copy you..

[Juno]

Sundance is the King

Long Live Sundance

Long Live His Engine

Long Live His & Terry's 's

Leave The Muppets To Hacksaw Technology

[R0162]

I will be interested to see how the water temps handle cooling the engine oil aswell with the laminova, the water is cooling the turbos and engine and then also having to cool the oil from the turbos and engine, it was a problem on the 340bhp 3r,s never mind a 700bhp rocket...:-) .. yes it will help oil get to temp faster, but will it keep temps low under heavy useage is what is more important, if coolant temps rise then it will struggle to cool oil and oil gets hotter adding more heat to coolant and temps spiral up...in theory of course..:-) ..if you have any problems you can fit a 20 bar cooler in there with thermostat sandwich plate, it will take a lot of stress off the coolant system..

[chuntington101]

R0162 said:

I will be interested to see how the water temps handle cooling the engine oil aswell with the laminova, the water is cooling the turbos and engine and then also having to cool the oil from the turbos and engine, it was a problem on the 340bhp 3r,s never mind a 700bhp rocket...:-) .. yes it will help oil get to temp faster, but will it keep temps low under heavy useage is what is more important, if coolant temps rise then it will struggle to cool oil and oil gets hotter adding more heat to coolant and temps spiral up...in theory of course..:-) ..if you have any problems you can fit a 20 bar cooler in there with thermostat sandwich plate, it will take a lot of stress off the coolant system..

Thats what i was thinking. However remvoing the one (or two) small heat exchangers from the fornt of the car is also going to help in getting cold air to the radiator. Still be intresting to see how the radiator can hold up with the extra load.

[sundance002]

chuntington101 said:

R0162 said:

I will be interested to see how the water temps handle cooling the engine oil aswell with the laminova, the water is cooling the turbos and engine and then also having to cool the oil from the turbos and engine, it was a problem on the 340bhp 3r,s never mind a 700bhp rocket...:-) .. yes it will help oil get to temp faster, but will it keep temps low under heavy useage is what is more important, if coolant temps rise then it will struggle to cool oil and oil gets hotter adding more heat to coolant and temps spiral up...in theory of course..:-) ..if you have any problems you can fit a 20 bar cooler in there with thermostat sandwich plate, it will take a lot of stress off the coolant system..

Thats what i was thinking. However remvoing the one (or two) small heat exchangers from the fornt of the car is also going to help in getting cold air to the radiator. Still be intresting to see how the radiator can hold up with the extra load.

That was my first thought, The car has never had a problem with water temps on track, has always been good, it has the pro alloy rad which helps a fair bit. The Laminova we are using is the largest size, they are super efficient .
We have made some other changes to help airflow to this area by cutting vents below on either side, so now will create more air in the side scoops. The Cunnards will help divert some air too,
The biggest change to body and rear clam is very simple, at the back of the little side windows there is a opening that leads to the engine, only thing is its so narrow it does nothing, so we are enlarging on both sides of rear clam to act as extra side scoops, keeping them small but having around a 4inch larger opening , should look like it was always there, being done in fibreglass so naturally blends back into clam.

[R0162]

sundance002 said:

That was my first thought, The car has never had a problem with water temps on track, has always been good, it has the pro alloy rad which helps a fair bit. The Laminova we are using is the largest size, they are super efficient .
We have made some other changes to help airflow to this area by cutting vents below on either side, so now will create more air in the side scoops. The Cunnards will help divert some air too,
The biggest change to body and rear clam is very simple, at the back of the little side windows there is a opening that leads to the engine, only thing is its so narrow it does nothing, so we are enlarging on both sides of rear clam to act as extra side scoops, keeping them small but having around a 4inch larger opening , should look like it was always there, being done in fibreglass so naturally blends back into clam.

Those scoops behind windows offer massive airflow into the engine bay, more than the side pods, its the age old topic again, dop not try to force more air in, you just need to allow the air to get out the back, the rear clam is a parachute as it is, if you want to improve airflow then open up and vent the whale tail, it will also improve IC airflow, you will see what i mean when you look through the vents, the IC and whale tail are connected and engine bay airflow can stall the IC airflow..

btw the water temps are an unknown on track unless you bypass the ECU with a separate sender, only time you will know they are not ok is when the needle starts to jump to 120.

[sundance002]

R0162 said:

sundance002 said:

That was my first thought, The car has never had a problem with water temps on track, has always been good, it has the pro alloy rad which helps a fair bit. The Laminova we are using is the largest size, they are super efficient .
We have made some other changes to help airflow to this area by cutting vents below on either side, so now will create more air in the side scoops. The Cunnards will help divert some air too,
The biggest change to body and rear clam is very simple, at the back of the little side windows there is a opening that leads to the engine, only thing is its so narrow it does nothing, so we are enlarging on both sides of rear clam to act as extra side scoops, keeping them small but having around a 4inch larger opening , should look like it was always there, being done in fibreglass so naturally blends back into clam.

Those scoops behind windows offer massive airflow into the engine bay, more than the side pods, its the age old topic again, dop not try to force more air in, you just need to allow the air to get out the back, the rear clam is a parachute as it is, if you want to improve airflow then open up and vent the whale tail, it will also improve IC airflow, you will see what i mean when you look through the vents, the IC and whale tail are connected and engine bay airflow can stall the IC airflow..

btw the water temps are an unknown on track unless you bypass the ECU with a separate sender, only time you will know they are not ok is when the needle starts to jump to 120.

The good thing now is that we have heat temp sensors in 3 positions, so can monitor for hot spots.

I believe that the flow will be good, there are enough exit points in the clam on top and behind and the exit where the IC sits, providing there is pressure it will push through any exit. I will be keeping my eye on temps, as the ecu now records everything, and the temp sensors should give us an idea of how it's performing, we can then fine tune airflow from the info we get in where its needed if at all .
My water temps at the highest before this work were 90 .