Stratos or GT40
Discussion
Finally decided that my mid life crisis needs sorting!!!
Looking for a part built / unstarted Stratos or GT40 kit.
Which are the ones to avoid?
Why should they be avoided?
And...
Where do you look for them (apart from the KVA Mk.1 GT40 that's been around for a while)?
Would love to build a Southern GT or a Lister Bell Stratos but Mrs Tacchino would notice the sudden demise of the bank account so can't stretch that far at the moment!!
All advice appreciated.
NB. Divorce is not a preferred option.
Looking for a part built / unstarted Stratos or GT40 kit.
Which are the ones to avoid?
Why should they be avoided?
And...
Where do you look for them (apart from the KVA Mk.1 GT40 that's been around for a while)?
Would love to build a Southern GT or a Lister Bell Stratos but Mrs Tacchino would notice the sudden demise of the bank account so can't stretch that far at the moment!!
All advice appreciated.
NB. Divorce is not a preferred option.
Hoonigan said:
Agreed.It's also in Poland, has only been completed once and offers little or zero support for a potential builder.
With all the inevitable unknowns and "not available from the manufacturer" items then I could see this being a more expensive and time consuming proposition than a Southern GT.
Having done the rounds of what's out there as a new kit then I'd be going for a Southern GT. The kit is proven, is supported by the manufacturer and almost on my doorstep. Only down side is that currently it's too much cost to complete.
Hoonigan said:
And that’s why I own a Southern GT....
How much are you anticipating spending all in?
I know the final figure will be in the £30K and upwards region when fully complete and sorted - can't see that's possible with a Southern GT.How much are you anticipating spending all in?
Intention is to use a mild specification 302 to begin with - possible later upgrade to a tuned version with the more appropriate carbs added.
The biggest issue is more the negative feedback from the other half during the process.
The build will be very visible to her and the initial phase of works needs to be noticeable progression. This is far easier done with a part build than a new kit as not all bits need to arrive immediately - I'm sure you guys know what I mean her.
Once over the first stages with the car having been around for a few months I'll be safe to complete.
To spend over £10K on a Southern GT chassis and suspension only and then have to explain it's another £5K for the body shell would be a tough one. I've been married to her for 22 years and I know how deep in the mire I'd be!
I might be trying to achieve the impossible but until I've proved it's impossible I'll keep trying.
You could always sell me yours for £20K ...... honest it's a great deal. I'll even throw in a MGB to sweeten the deal.
Tacchino said:
Hoonigan said:
And that’s why I own a Southern GT....
How much are you anticipating spending all in?
I know the final figure will be in the £30K and upwards region when fully complete and sorted - can't see that's possible with a Southern GT.How much are you anticipating spending all in?
Intention is to use a mild specification 302 to begin with - possible later upgrade to a tuned version with the more appropriate carbs added.
The biggest issue is more the negative feedback from the other half during the process.
The build will be very visible to her and the initial phase of works needs to be noticeable progression. This is far easier done with a part build than a new kit as not all bits need to arrive immediately - I'm sure you guys know what I mean her.
Once over the first stages with the car having been around for a few months I'll be safe to complete.
To spend over £10K on a Southern GT chassis and suspension only and then have to explain it's another £5K for the body shell would be a tough one. I've been married to her for 22 years and I know how deep in the mire I'd be!
I might be trying to achieve the impossible but until I've proved it's impossible I'll keep trying.
You could always sell me yours for £20K ...... honest it's a great deal. I'll even throw in a MGB to sweeten the deal.
To be honest I’m not sure you’ll find much within budget, I reckon £40k and you’ve half a chance but even then I suspect you’ll spend more sorting out a lot of crap that someone else has give up on or neglected.
For £30k I reckon the Polish one is your best bet tbh, and at least they have a finished one to look at, it’s certainly value for money...
With respect to making decent visible progression to start with I would suggest getting as many of the non kit supplied components/units sourced and prepared before the kit arrives. I did this when building a Westfield and made good initial progress, though I appreciate this is significantly simpler than a Stratos or GT40.
When I collected the kit from the factory I had already rebuilt the engine and had all the suspension components that didn't come from Westfield refurbished and ready to fit. The kit was the most unfinished state you could get, nothing fitted to the chassis. I took a week and a half off work and had a rolling chassis ready with engine installed by the time I went back to work. Mind you I was 23 and could go all day on mugs of coffee and jaffa cakes.
Anyway, that sort of progress should keep her happy.
FWIW, I'd go for the Stratos, always had a soft spot for those.
When I collected the kit from the factory I had already rebuilt the engine and had all the suspension components that didn't come from Westfield refurbished and ready to fit. The kit was the most unfinished state you could get, nothing fitted to the chassis. I took a week and a half off work and had a rolling chassis ready with engine installed by the time I went back to work. Mind you I was 23 and could go all day on mugs of coffee and jaffa cakes.
Anyway, that sort of progress should keep her happy.
FWIW, I'd go for the Stratos, always had a soft spot for those.
I suppose it's pertinent. I lusted after a Cobra for a long time then finally decided to go for it. Trouble is, I made a fundamental error. I though I could build a good one cheap by starting with a cheap kit and using good parts elsewhere. What I ended up with was a cheap car with good bits on it. Huge surprise really.... Sadly, the result was not what I had dreamt of and it had to go as I simply hated it. Not its fault as such, it just didn't live up to my unrealistic expectations.
I did an almost similar thing with a Stratos copy. The end result was actually pretty good according to many who saw it but it was such a long and painful experience trying to do it on the cheap that when domestic circumstances got a bit awkward, I sold it. Had it been less painful to get to its final state, I might have fought to keep it, but by that time, I was done so took the easy way out.
I get this is as much about me as the cars I built, but just saying, be careful trying to build on the cheap, as really, it can't actually work I don't think.
I did an almost similar thing with a Stratos copy. The end result was actually pretty good according to many who saw it but it was such a long and painful experience trying to do it on the cheap that when domestic circumstances got a bit awkward, I sold it. Had it been less painful to get to its final state, I might have fought to keep it, but by that time, I was done so took the easy way out.
I get this is as much about me as the cars I built, but just saying, be careful trying to build on the cheap, as really, it can't actually work I don't think.
If you have exceptionl 'HANDS ON' technical ability. have built a few easier kits previously, and own ALL the required tools [Welder - bench drill - compressor etc etc] AND Sufficient space for the build then the cheapy option may be viable, I've built several kits they are always more difficullt than you expect. If you expect the worst and can overcome these problems when they arise in your own garage, then go for it - Don't expect the manufacturers to make the build easy, even high priced kits have some difficult problems to overcome. The Polish kit seems cheap but it's made in Poland - not exactly down the road to go check up on the factory demonstrator.
GT40's were notoriously difficult to build eg KVA most of these never made it to the road, 2 mates bouhgt one of these each one never cured the overheating problems. the other never got built
I always wanted a GT40 but never took the plunge after I heard & saw several local build failures.
If there's any doubt then buy the best Kit you can afford - but still be prepared for problems - for sure you're gonna have some.
Hope this helps
GT40's were notoriously difficult to build eg KVA most of these never made it to the road, 2 mates bouhgt one of these each one never cured the overheating problems. the other never got built
I always wanted a GT40 but never took the plunge after I heard & saw several local build failures.
If there's any doubt then buy the best Kit you can afford - but still be prepared for problems - for sure you're gonna have some.
Hope this helps
Edited by rene7 on Monday 2nd October 11:04
It all depends what you want.
imo, if you want a car to keep then its better to build an excellent cheaper car, than a cheaper excellent car, if you know what I mean.
Eg, most gt40s and stratos etc seem to be around the £50k mark to build a good one. You could probably do it for less, but why? You'd only be cutting corners here and there and once finished you'd kick yourself as you know its not what it could be, and that will always annoy you. (It would certainly annoy me)
You'd be better off building something like a Cobra to a very nice standard, which could be easily done for the £30k mark.
Like I said, it depends what you want. If you want to build to sell, you're probably best building on the cheap and aiming for the bottom of any market, as there will be more potential buyers. If you're at the top of the price band for any particular model, the buyers well be more discerning. If you want a keeper that you're truly proud of, build the best you can.
imo, if you want a car to keep then its better to build an excellent cheaper car, than a cheaper excellent car, if you know what I mean.
Eg, most gt40s and stratos etc seem to be around the £50k mark to build a good one. You could probably do it for less, but why? You'd only be cutting corners here and there and once finished you'd kick yourself as you know its not what it could be, and that will always annoy you. (It would certainly annoy me)
You'd be better off building something like a Cobra to a very nice standard, which could be easily done for the £30k mark.
Like I said, it depends what you want. If you want to build to sell, you're probably best building on the cheap and aiming for the bottom of any market, as there will be more potential buyers. If you're at the top of the price band for any particular model, the buyers well be more discerning. If you want a keeper that you're truly proud of, build the best you can.
Looks like a solution has been found.
Stratos has been ruled out ...... as a V8 lover as well there's no way to merge both sensibly.
Cobra's are just too common (sorry all those Cobra owners) highlighted by seeing two on one day!!
Leaves just a GT40.
The few unfinished kits out there seem to be KVA's. All of which need considerable work to get close to completion and a significant amount of further investment. By my estimation if I bought the best option I'd need to invest another £35K into it to bring up to a good level.
To build a fresh car would be a comparison between Tornado and Southern GT.
Having seen a Tornado up close I was impressed and have no specific reason not to go with it. Although I have seen on TS40 with unimpressive rippling in the fibreglass (a few years ago though).
Southern GT is also significantly impressive with a host of components used that have been developed following years of abuse.
One of the key points is their accessibility during the build. Many comments on the forum about build help from Southern GT but very little about Tornado's technical support of a builder. This may be because Tornado have a full build manual and Southern GT don't though.
I'll be going with a Southern GT as IMO building a Tornado would be like putting an IKEA wardrobe together! At the end of the job you have a very nice finished item but don't actually realise why you did each of the stages in the order you did them!
The Southern GT may end up being mentally more taxing but also more rewarding as, if you don't think your way through and understand first, you'll soon get cheesed off removing something to fit the part that should have gone on first.
All I need to do now if offload all the classic cars, bikes and stuff that's cluttering up the garage and get that deposit down.
The clearance task should take me a while so I can spend that conjuring up excuses and reasons to the wife of what I want her to think I'm doing ..... when I suggested building a GT40 recently it wasn't received positively!!
Next port of call is getting in touch with other Southern GT builders near the Southern GT factory for a chat about building these things.
I'm just a PM away ..... it will be appreciated
Stratos has been ruled out ...... as a V8 lover as well there's no way to merge both sensibly.
Cobra's are just too common (sorry all those Cobra owners) highlighted by seeing two on one day!!
Leaves just a GT40.
The few unfinished kits out there seem to be KVA's. All of which need considerable work to get close to completion and a significant amount of further investment. By my estimation if I bought the best option I'd need to invest another £35K into it to bring up to a good level.
To build a fresh car would be a comparison between Tornado and Southern GT.
Having seen a Tornado up close I was impressed and have no specific reason not to go with it. Although I have seen on TS40 with unimpressive rippling in the fibreglass (a few years ago though).
Southern GT is also significantly impressive with a host of components used that have been developed following years of abuse.
One of the key points is their accessibility during the build. Many comments on the forum about build help from Southern GT but very little about Tornado's technical support of a builder. This may be because Tornado have a full build manual and Southern GT don't though.
I'll be going with a Southern GT as IMO building a Tornado would be like putting an IKEA wardrobe together! At the end of the job you have a very nice finished item but don't actually realise why you did each of the stages in the order you did them!
The Southern GT may end up being mentally more taxing but also more rewarding as, if you don't think your way through and understand first, you'll soon get cheesed off removing something to fit the part that should have gone on first.
All I need to do now if offload all the classic cars, bikes and stuff that's cluttering up the garage and get that deposit down.
The clearance task should take me a while so I can spend that conjuring up excuses and reasons to the wife of what I want her to think I'm doing ..... when I suggested building a GT40 recently it wasn't received positively!!
Next port of call is getting in touch with other Southern GT builders near the Southern GT factory for a chat about building these things.
I'm just a PM away ..... it will be appreciated
Yes, the GT40 is the one to go for. I considered making one up which would be a great project, but as long as you understand the time, effort, required to actually finish one, the reward will be great. Possibly a car to keep for the rest of you life, and me admired by everyone who likes cars.
So many people, as with all kits misunderstand what the challenges are to get them completed, and the car sits in a garage nowhere near the end goal.
Always be prepared to spend at least a third more than you were quoted to finish it.
All the companies are salesman at the end of the day, and they will want to get you started.
The longer the build goes on, the more the price will rise, but if you are properly prepared for what you are going to do, and are comfortable with the outlay, you will have a wonderful car.
Good luck....
Can't wait for the first pictures...
Gadgit.
So many people, as with all kits misunderstand what the challenges are to get them completed, and the car sits in a garage nowhere near the end goal.
Always be prepared to spend at least a third more than you were quoted to finish it.
All the companies are salesman at the end of the day, and they will want to get you started.
The longer the build goes on, the more the price will rise, but if you are properly prepared for what you are going to do, and are comfortable with the outlay, you will have a wonderful car.
Good luck....
Can't wait for the first pictures...
Gadgit.
Excellent choice and the right decision in my opinion. If you haven't already done so check out www.gt40s.com lots of advice and build threads on there if you need it.
Nick
Southern GT 006
Nick
Southern GT 006
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