Suzuka 1989, proof Prost took Senna out deliberately
Discussion
I was faily young at the time of Senna V Prost but it always struck me they hated each other. It was all you used to see on the TV them b
hing about one thing or the other, or it seemed that way.
Im a huge Senna fan but also think Prost was a great driver
What has baffled me over the years there has been lots of Documentarys about F1 ans Senna and obviously now the Film. Especially the film Prost was in it a lot and spoke highly of Senna sometimes comes over as almost being good friends - Whats all the about. ?
Anyone explain
hing about one thing or the other, or it seemed that way. Im a huge Senna fan but also think Prost was a great driver
What has baffled me over the years there has been lots of Documentarys about F1 ans Senna and obviously now the Film. Especially the film Prost was in it a lot and spoke highly of Senna sometimes comes over as almost being good friends - Whats all the about. ?
Anyone explain
They seemed to kiss and make up once Prost retired and Senna got his bum in a Williams (for the precious little time it lasted).
People have speculated why. Whether the pressure was lifted, or whether he was like the Moriarty to his Holmes and they struggled without the other one.
It hit something of an emotional pique at Imola, as Senna was getting gigantically maudlin (with some justification!)
People have speculated why. Whether the pressure was lifted, or whether he was like the Moriarty to his Holmes and they struggled without the other one.
It hit something of an emotional pique at Imola, as Senna was getting gigantically maudlin (with some justification!)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OOOgfsc5wc4
I've posted this link, not to prove anything between Prost and Senna, but just because it's great footage of IMO some of the best F1 cars in history. Every second of pace is totally earned by the drivers IMO, with these demanding cars. Brilliant.
Have to say I loved the engine note and the sound when Senna's car sprung back to life.
I've posted this link, not to prove anything between Prost and Senna, but just because it's great footage of IMO some of the best F1 cars in history. Every second of pace is totally earned by the drivers IMO, with these demanding cars. Brilliant.
Have to say I loved the engine note and the sound when Senna's car sprung back to life.
mattikake said:
https://vimeo.com/48685407
Catch it before FOM attempt to hide the truth (again).
Disclaimer: I made this vid ages ago and the it's a bit ropey - a couple of edits away from the final version, but doing the overlays and stills themselves took about a week. I was going to show comparison of Prost's line from Senna's perspective through 130R on a normal lap, and the lap where he was suckering him in. The difference was visual to the viewer and therefore, huge. But due to repeated blocks and attention from FOM, I lost interest.
Christ on a bike, who fCatch it before FOM attempt to hide the truth (again).
Disclaimer: I made this vid ages ago and the it's a bit ropey - a couple of edits away from the final version, but doing the overlays and stills themselves took about a week. I was going to show comparison of Prost's line from Senna's perspective through 130R on a normal lap, and the lap where he was suckering him in. The difference was visual to the viewer and therefore, huge. But due to repeated blocks and attention from FOM, I lost interest.
king cares? It's ancient history.This'll go the same way as so many other threads. People who knew Alain Prost (or LewisHamiltonFernandoAlonsoMichaelSchumacherorwhof
kingever) and what he was like will have their opinion of him. People who very rarely were in the same country or continent as him will have another one.I prefer the first hand opinions.
I've just bothered to look at the video. What a load of bks that is! "After decades of debate"??? It was widely known and totally accepted at the time what Prost did. I can recall Rosberg saying at the time that Prost was so unused to driving dirty that the one time time he did it he did it badly.
The video mentions Prost's racing line. Since when did a defending driver stay on the racing line? Er, since never?
I couldn't watch any more after that. The driver who some regarded as the dirtiest driver of all time got a taste of his own medicine, and at the time a great many were glad to see it.
ks that is! "After decades of debate"??? It was widely known and totally accepted at the time what Prost did. I can recall Rosberg saying at the time that Prost was so unused to driving dirty that the one time time he did it he did it badly.The video mentions Prost's racing line. Since when did a defending driver stay on the racing line? Er, since never?
I couldn't watch any more after that. The driver who some regarded as the dirtiest driver of all time got a taste of his own medicine, and at the time a great many were glad to see it.
Vocal Minority said:
I think the OP has taken the anti-senna conspiracy undertones of the Senna film (while Balestre didn't like him - I think they rather over did it for dramatic effect) and let their imagination run away with them.
Wrong on so many levels.Despite me making this vid before the Senna movie and the slight hint of quoting Prost's words from Senna versus Prost, this is about Prost still refusing to come clean whilst hypocritically acting as a race steward for racing incidents today.
The video proves early turn-in and early braking by Prost, implying either a deliberate take-out or that Prost momentarily forgot how to race.
There's more to the story than one crap Senna movie numbnuts. Just because it's all you know, doesn't mean that this is all some others know. I mean, consider the rather obvious fact that I have this race in full for a start... Could.. it .. be.. I.. have... ALL.. the... others.. too? Now's the time to make a simple assumption.
mattikake said:
Vocal Minority said:
I think the OP has taken the anti-senna conspiracy undertones of the Senna film (while Balestre didn't like him - I think they rather over did it for dramatic effect) and let their imagination run away with them.
Wrong on so many levels.Despite me making this vid before the Senna movie and the slight hint of quoting Prost's words from Senna versus Prost, this is about Prost still refusing to come clean whilst hypocritically acting as a race steward for racing incidents today.
The video proves early turn-in and early braking by Prost, implying either a deliberate take-out or that Prost momentarily forgot how to race.
There's more to the story than one crap Senna movie numbnuts. Just because it's all you know, doesn't mean that this is all some others know. I mean, consider the rather obvious fact that I have this race in full for a start... Could.. it .. be.. I.. have... ALL.. the... others.. too? Now's the time to make a simple assumption.
The reason I think the Senna movie is entertaining but a bit thin is because I do know more about the subject than that kiddo.
mattikake said:
Wrong on so many levels.
Despite me making this vid before the Senna movie and the slight hint of quoting Prost's words from Senna versus Prost, this is about Prost still refusing to come clean whilst hypocritically acting as a race steward for racing incidents today.
The video proves early turn-in and early braking by Prost, implying either a deliberate take-out or that Prost momentarily forgot how to race.
There's more to the story than one crap Senna movie numbnuts. Just because it's all you know, doesn't mean that this is all some others know. I mean, consider the rather obvious fact that I have this race in full for a start... Could.. it .. be.. I.. have... ALL.. the... others.. too? Now's the time to make a simple assumption.
Wow, so 'clean' drivers only as stewards..?Despite me making this vid before the Senna movie and the slight hint of quoting Prost's words from Senna versus Prost, this is about Prost still refusing to come clean whilst hypocritically acting as a race steward for racing incidents today.
The video proves early turn-in and early braking by Prost, implying either a deliberate take-out or that Prost momentarily forgot how to race.
There's more to the story than one crap Senna movie numbnuts. Just because it's all you know, doesn't mean that this is all some others know. I mean, consider the rather obvious fact that I have this race in full for a start... Could.. it .. be.. I.. have... ALL.. the... others.. too? Now's the time to make a simple assumption.
That's gonna be a short list.
^ Really?
Despite me making this vid before the Senna movie and the slight hint of quoting Prost's words from Senna versus Prost, this is about Prost still refusing to come clean whilst hypocritically acting as a race steward for racing incidents today.
The video proves early turn-in and early braking by Prost, implying either a deliberate take-out or that Prost momentarily forgot how to race.
There's more to the story than one crap Senna movie numbnuts. Just because it's all you know, doesn't mean that this is all some others know. I mean, consider the rather obvious fact that I have this race in full for a start... Could.. it .. be.. I.. have... ALL.. the... others.. too? Now's the time to make a simple assumption.No, you didn't say it was about Prost, you said it was all about FOM covering up and conspiracies - presenting it like some sort of revolutionary freedom fighter. It was something everyone knew already. You made a rod for your own back due to your presentation.
The reason I think the Senna movie is entertaining but a bit thin is because I do know more about the subject than that kiddo.I make no conspiracy.It's a fact FOM keep on removing it. An opening forum post on one site has no bearing on a video that can be seen from many. :s The video makes it's own statement and is it's own presentation... a bit like a certain crap Senna movie... And the way this movie is continually used to push it's opinion on people (or someone else's opinion) who have clearly had an opinion about Senna for 20 years, seems to be another reason not to like that movie. It was far too incomplete and one-sided to be worth anything. The races tell the only story that matters.
Vocal Minority said:
mattikake said:
Vocal Minority said:
I think the OP has taken the anti-senna conspiracy undertones of the Senna film (while Balestre didn't like him - I think they rather over did it for dramatic effect) and let their imagination run away with them.
Wrong on so many levels.Despite me making this vid before the Senna movie and the slight hint of quoting Prost's words from Senna versus Prost, this is about Prost still refusing to come clean whilst hypocritically acting as a race steward for racing incidents today.
The video proves early turn-in and early braking by Prost, implying either a deliberate take-out or that Prost momentarily forgot how to race.
There's more to the story than one crap Senna movie numbnuts. Just because it's all you know, doesn't mean that this is all some others know. I mean, consider the rather obvious fact that I have this race in full for a start... Could.. it .. be.. I.. have... ALL.. the... others.. too? Now's the time to make a simple assumption.
The reason I think the Senna movie is entertaining but a bit thin is because I do know more about the subject than that kiddo.
After three decades someone has leaked the footage from another camera angle
https://gfycat.com/electricjoyfulgodwit
Seems pretty conclusive imo.
https://gfycat.com/electricjoyfulgodwit
Seems pretty conclusive imo.
Do you know what amazes me about this?
Alain said beforehand he was not going to keep doors open for him, he told Ayrton, the press even his team.
And he didn't
Yet Senna fans always raise this as proof. Of course it is proof, he said he was going to do it all along if Senna tried it on.
If you need proof of anything I suggest you find the throttle trace for Suzuka 1990 and the fact this idiot took out a fellow human being deliberately at 150+mph in a strop about politics. Fair play to Ayrton even he admitted this years later, despite trying to suggest to the very clearly not convinced Jackie Stewart (or Stewart as he disrespectfully called him) that this was about being a racing driver gong for gaps.
Yes what Alain did was wrong, but Ayrton was a cretin for believing that Alain would not do it, he relied on Alain, as usual opening the door.
It was the only time in his career that Alain did anything like this, it was clumsy and he was awful at it, know why? it was totally not his way, but in this case he made a decision at the slowest part of the track to do it, knowing he was leaving and Honda were up Senna's arse since 88 anyway, that is how un natural to him, Ayrton though was a natural at taking people out, ask numerous drivers.
Alain said beforehand he was not going to keep doors open for him, he told Ayrton, the press even his team.
And he didn't
Yet Senna fans always raise this as proof. Of course it is proof, he said he was going to do it all along if Senna tried it on.
If you need proof of anything I suggest you find the throttle trace for Suzuka 1990 and the fact this idiot took out a fellow human being deliberately at 150+mph in a strop about politics. Fair play to Ayrton even he admitted this years later, despite trying to suggest to the very clearly not convinced Jackie Stewart (or Stewart as he disrespectfully called him) that this was about being a racing driver gong for gaps.
Yes what Alain did was wrong, but Ayrton was a cretin for believing that Alain would not do it, he relied on Alain, as usual opening the door.
It was the only time in his career that Alain did anything like this, it was clumsy and he was awful at it, know why? it was totally not his way, but in this case he made a decision at the slowest part of the track to do it, knowing he was leaving and Honda were up Senna's arse since 88 anyway, that is how un natural to him, Ayrton though was a natural at taking people out, ask numerous drivers.
Welshbeef said:
LaurasOtherHalf said:
That wasn't closing the door, so much as moving the door so he ran into the wall!
That new footage is conclusive in my opinion, Prost deliberately took Senna out.
So worse than Schumacher v Hill? And Schumacher Monaco qualifying track blocking?That new footage is conclusive in my opinion, Prost deliberately took Senna out.
I think the only way it can be seen as conclusive proof is to see Prost's line during qualifying or the previous laps of that race leading up to the incident.
I know I've looked at Senna's onboards before and during the initial braking phase he's a good two cars behind prost and still sends it up the inside. I still think it was Prost's corner and he was allowed take his normal racing line which at that moment was occupied by Senna, it was typical of Senna's "give me this place or we crash" tactics which Prost indulged in this case, a bit like Max and Hamilton at Silverstone.
I know I've looked at Senna's onboards before and during the initial braking phase he's a good two cars behind prost and still sends it up the inside. I still think it was Prost's corner and he was allowed take his normal racing line which at that moment was occupied by Senna, it was typical of Senna's "give me this place or we crash" tactics which Prost indulged in this case, a bit like Max and Hamilton at Silverstone.
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