Discussion
Olivera said:
So the price on the VW motorsport site for the Golf TCR with sequential gearbox is £110k euros + VAT. Note this is the basic car, various other packs and options are mentioned.
Yep but still a lot cheaper than approaching a manufacturer who doesn't have a TCR car already built, lets say somebody like Dacia for example. 100k + a few extras is pocketmoney compared to developing one from scratch.
You have:
SEAT, VW and Audi
Pug
Alfa
Hyundai
Ford
Honda
Kia
Opel
Subaru
So just a little choice.
andy97 said:
MG CHRIS said:
From a fb group the owner of brisky motorsport stated too team charging 180k for a drive that's not far of btcc budgets for only half the races and no to little tv coverage.
I thought a BTCC budget started at £300k?Sebring440 said:
This series is not going to happen in the UK for 2018. Let's open a book.
No doubt it's dead. Nobody is going to believe or invest in it happening in 2019 or beyond either.What happened to their big statements they were overcome with all the interest?
https://www.touringcartimes.com/2017/08/21/tcr-uk-...
Given the success of TCR in the rest of the world I've no doubt they have had massive interest. At the end of the day though the bulk of the drivers who could afford it in the UK are already doing something else and I think some teams are being more than a little greedy with the money they want.
All the team principals I know drive much nicer road cars than their drivers do...
All the team principals I know drive much nicer road cars than their drivers do...
I personally dont think there is any real gap in the market for TCR UK.
In terms of the 'ladder' and as budgets go in the UK you have the following (budgets are estimates based off inside knowledge):
Ford Fiestas (25k)
Michelin Clio Cup (40k)
Renault UK Clio Cup/VW Cup (60k)
Ginetta Supercup/GT4/Britcar GT4 (100k)
BTCC (200k+)
GT3 (500k+)
Not sure where an unknown series like TCR could fit in based on budgets being talked about.
In terms of the 'ladder' and as budgets go in the UK you have the following (budgets are estimates based off inside knowledge):
Ford Fiestas (25k)
Michelin Clio Cup (40k)
Renault UK Clio Cup/VW Cup (60k)
Ginetta Supercup/GT4/Britcar GT4 (100k)
BTCC (200k+)
GT3 (500k+)
Not sure where an unknown series like TCR could fit in based on budgets being talked about.
99dndd said:
Would it not make more sense for BTCC to adopt TCR rules?
why on earth would they? the BTCC is going through a huge boom period with full grids, manufacturer supported teams, big spectator numbers and great ITV live coverage.
so what exactly would be the point in changing all that for something that has shown that it isn't even wanted or needed in the UK?!
Gonzo0 said:
I personally dont think there is any real gap in the market for TCR UK.
In terms of the 'ladder' and as budgets go in the UK you have the following (budgets are estimates based off inside knowledge):
Ford Fiestas (25k)
Michelin Clio Cup (40k)
Renault UK Clio Cup/VW Cup (60k)
Ginetta Supercup/GT4/Britcar GT4 (100k)
BTCC (200k+)
GT3 (500k+)
Not sure where an unknown series like TCR could fit in based on budgets being talked about.
Looking more like 400k plus for a drive in a top BTCC seat. Dynamics were charging Andy Neate 600k or so for the 3rd seat last season before he couldn’t actually pay itIn terms of the 'ladder' and as budgets go in the UK you have the following (budgets are estimates based off inside knowledge):
Ford Fiestas (25k)
Michelin Clio Cup (40k)
Renault UK Clio Cup/VW Cup (60k)
Ginetta Supercup/GT4/Britcar GT4 (100k)
BTCC (200k+)
GT3 (500k+)
Not sure where an unknown series like TCR could fit in based on budgets being talked about.
That’s for top drive in top team. BTCC budgets go from around £200k upwards, depending if the team already has some sponsors.
And with TCR UK teams wanting to charge nearly that price for half the amount of races at a virtually club level race meeting, with no TV or spectators, then no wonder TCR UK has died.
And with TCR UK teams wanting to charge nearly that price for half the amount of races at a virtually club level race meeting, with no TV or spectators, then no wonder TCR UK has died.
Edited by knowitall on Monday 8th January 12:09
knowitall said:
99dndd said:
Would it not make more sense for BTCC to adopt TCR rules?
why on earth would they? the BTCC is going through a huge boom period with full grids, manufacturer supported teams, big spectator numbers and great ITV live coverage.
so what exactly would be the point in changing all that for something that has shown that it isn't even wanted or needed in the UK?!
Manufacturer backed doesn't mean anything like it used to for most of those teams.
knowitall said:
why on earth would they?
the BTCC is going through a huge boom period with full grids, manufacturer supported teams, big spectator numbers and great ITV live coverage.
so what exactly would be the point in changing all that for something that has shown that it isn't even wanted or needed in the UK?!
/Devil's advocatethe BTCC is going through a huge boom period with full grids, manufacturer supported teams, big spectator numbers and great ITV live coverage.
so what exactly would be the point in changing all that for something that has shown that it isn't even wanted or needed in the UK?!
If the cost of running in BTCC was brought down then it might allow drivers to be paid and attract higher talent to the championship as it was in the Supertouring era.
One could argue that having an FIA homologated car would stop the teams developing the cars to extract that extra 0.1%. Currently the teams have some freedom of maneuver with non-control items from TOCA/RML to develop the cars. A switch would also be damaging to a number of businesses who for a good number of years have moulded themselves around supporting the championship.
/normal mode
Yes, the championship is full to bursting at the moment with more cars than accepted entries and the media/following is very well developed and watched/read/listened. What's not broken doesn't need fixing...
I too fail to see where the gap in the market is for TCR UK. It seems to me like it's being launched to directly compete with the BTCC which at the moment there's no contest.
Having arranged the funding for some TCR cars (I run Moorgate Motorsport Finance) I can say that the series will be happening. There's quite a lot of interest, especially as the cars are so much cheaper to buy and run.
They don't have a mandatory £45k suspension kit fitted. They don't have a mandatory £38k Cosworth data logging and ECU and they don't have to lease the engines from the likes of Swindon. Also you are buying a car with a world wide market if you wish to sell - or buy.
I don't think the grids will be full this year, but it will expand.
It's getting TV coverage, it's on a reasonable weekend package and visits some different tracks like Combe.
On the other hand the BRSCC are involved, but with new top man Peter Daly involved instead of Bernard Cottrell, things will progress I hope as Peter is a racer himself and doesn't own a blazer or a bus pass...
They don't have a mandatory £45k suspension kit fitted. They don't have a mandatory £38k Cosworth data logging and ECU and they don't have to lease the engines from the likes of Swindon. Also you are buying a car with a world wide market if you wish to sell - or buy.
I don't think the grids will be full this year, but it will expand.
It's getting TV coverage, it's on a reasonable weekend package and visits some different tracks like Combe.
On the other hand the BRSCC are involved, but with new top man Peter Daly involved instead of Bernard Cottrell, things will progress I hope as Peter is a racer himself and doesn't own a blazer or a bus pass...
andygo said:
Having arranged the funding for some TCR cars (I run Moorgate Motorsport Finance) I can say that the series will be happening. There's quite a lot of interest, especially as the cars are so much cheaper to buy and run.
They don't have a mandatory £45k suspension kit fitted. They don't have a mandatory £38k Cosworth data logging and ECU and they don't have to lease the engines from the likes of Swindon. Also you are buying a car with a world wide market if you wish to sell - or buy.
I don't think the grids will be full this year, but it will expand.
It's getting TV coverage, it's on a reasonable weekend package and visits some different tracks like Combe.
On the other hand the BRSCC are involved, but with new top man Peter Daly involved instead of Bernard Cottrell, things will progress I hope as Peter is a racer himself and doesn't own a blazer or a bus pass...
..... Bernard Cottrell couldn't organise a dog walk!!! They don't have a mandatory £45k suspension kit fitted. They don't have a mandatory £38k Cosworth data logging and ECU and they don't have to lease the engines from the likes of Swindon. Also you are buying a car with a world wide market if you wish to sell - or buy.
I don't think the grids will be full this year, but it will expand.
It's getting TV coverage, it's on a reasonable weekend package and visits some different tracks like Combe.
On the other hand the BRSCC are involved, but with new top man Peter Daly involved instead of Bernard Cottrell, things will progress I hope as Peter is a racer himself and doesn't own a blazer or a bus pass...
Sebring440 said:
andygo said:
I can say that the series will be happening. .
It's not happening though, is it?(or at least nowhere near in the way it was meant to be. maybe they will just have a TCR class buried within Britcar or similar to save utter humiliation).
We’ve just gone through the biggest launchpad of the year (Autosport show) and there was not one new driver or team announcement or confirmation. the silence has been defeaning before, during and after the show. apparently there are less than a handful of cars to have paid their entry.
knowitall said:
Sebring440 said:
andygo said:
I can say that the series will be happening. .
It's not happening though, is it?(or at least nowhere near in the way it was meant to be. maybe they will just have a TCR class buried within Britcar or similar to save utter humiliation).
We’ve just gone through the biggest launchpad of the year (Autosport show) and there was not one new driver or team announcement or confirmation. the silence has been defeaning before, during and after the show. apparently there are less than a handful of cars to have paid their entry.
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