Planning a 17 day Euro trip... Leaving this Thursday!

Planning a 17 day Euro trip... Leaving this Thursday!

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logit

Original Poster:

78 posts

205 months

Monday 19th June 2017
quotequote all
Hi chaps, I'm looking to plan a 17 day trip to Europe with my wife leaving on Thursday! We were meant to be doing a driving tour of Australia during this time but we found out yesterday that due to an unexpected illness in my wife's family we need to stay within Europe in case my wife needs to get back at short notice. So we've decided to take my recently acquired C63 Coupe on an impromptu European adventure instead driving

The thought of this is proving quite troublesome given my normal ocd tendencies to plan type but if nothing else, recent events have taught me that life is very short and sometimes you just need to get up and do rather than think too much... smile

This would be my first time doing a trip like this, but I had planned to do a euro trip next year but hadn't really got round to doing any planning, just had a few ideas rolling around. As I'll be with the wife, the focus is probably 80% on destinations and 20% on driving. We're hoping to keep the accommodation costs (B&Bs, hotels, apartments) to an average of £100/night (not easy given the awful pound!) as the fuel costs are frankly going to be horrendous biggrin

We're looking to visit three broad areas:

Swiss Alps and main passes (3 days)
Tuscany, Florence to around Orvieto (4 days)
Italian lakes, Como, Maggiore (3 days)

Given the last minute nature of this trip I'd be extremely grateful for any tips on the route and hotel/b&b recommendations you guys may have. I want to get is down to Tuscany asap so the start of the trip has two long travel days (views on whether that is realistic would be appreciated). Given that I've never done something like this before I don't really know how tiring things are going to be and what is a realistic daily mileage to aim for. I've tried to include the mileages below so you can see what I'm planning.

I'm still trying to get to grips with Tyretotravel in order to plan the exact route, but the rough plan is as follows:

  • 22 June: Calais to near Annecy via Reims, A26/A39 (520 miles): I picked near Annecy as thought it was a good stopover. This would just be an overnight stop to recharge for the next day. Could I go further on the first day? Would be happy to stay in a motorway hotel (Ibis etc) to ease the journey on the next day.
  • 23 June: Near Annecy to Siena, via Mont Blanc tunnel, Milan (442 miles, 7.5hrs)
  • 24 - 27 June: Florence, San Quirico d'Orcia, Pienza, Motepulciano, Orvieto. Would it be best to base in once place and drive around, or move from place to place? Any accommodation recommendations appreciated.
  • 28 June: Tuscany to Lake Como (possibly Bellagio). 280 miles, 5hrs): Is it worth stopping off in Lake Garda as well? Is it massively different to Como? Tips on where to base and accommodation most appreciated.
  • 29 - 1 July: Lake Como/Maggiore: Is Lake Maggiore worth a visit?
  • 2 July: Lake Como to Swiss Alps (possibly Andermatt, Obergoms? Advice on where to base/stay appreciated). Plan is to drive the Furka, Susten, Grimsel pass loop. Maybe heard NE from Maggiore to Simplon pass? Would like to get a cable car up a mountain or a similar activity. Is the cable car up the Matterhorn from Zermatt worth doing?
  • 3-5 July: Swiss Alps
  • 6 July: Swiss Alps to somewhere in Black Forest (is Baden-Baden nice?)
  • 7 July: Black forest to Cochem (Adenau)
  • 8 July: Cochem to Calais
I know this seems like a scarily undetailed draft given that we're leaving in a few days... eek so I would really appreciate any tips, insight, recommendations you guys may have.

Many thanks chaps,

beer



mr pg

1,947 posts

204 months

Monday 19th June 2017
quotequote all
I've added a few comments to yours below if it helps. I use motogoloco for routes as it's very easy to use.
Paul.

logit said:
Hi chaps, I'm looking to plan a 17 day trip to Europe with my wife leaving on Thursday! We were meant to be doing a driving tour of Australia during this time but we found out yesterday that due to an unexpected illness in my wife's family we need to stay within Europe in case my wife needs to get back at short notice. So we've decided to take my recently acquired C63 Coupe on an impromptu European adventure instead driving

The thought of this is proving quite troublesome given my normal ocd tendencies to plan type but if nothing else, recent events have taught me that life is very short and sometimes you just need to get up and do rather than think too much... smile

This would be my first time doing a trip like this, but I had planned to do a euro trip next year but hadn't really got round to doing any planning, just had a few ideas rolling around. As I'll be with the wife, the focus is probably 80% on destinations and 20% on driving. We're hoping to keep the accommodation costs (B&Bs, hotels, apartments) to an average of £100/night (not easy given the awful pound!) as the fuel costs are frankly going to be horrendous biggrin

We're looking to visit three broad areas:

Swiss Alps and main passes (3 days)
Tuscany, Florence to around Orvieto (4 days)
Italian lakes, Como, Maggiore (3 days)

Given the last minute nature of this trip I'd be extremely grateful for any tips on the route and hotel/b&b recommendations you guys may have. I want to get is down to Tuscany asap so the start of the trip has two long travel days (views on whether that is realistic would be appreciated). Given that I've never done something like this before I don't really know how tiring things are going to be and what is a realistic daily mileage to aim for. I've tried to include the mileages below so you can see what I'm planning.
I try to keep to 200-230 miles in the twisty bits to give time for stops and lunch.

I'm still trying to get to grips with Tyretotravel in order to plan the exact route, but the rough plan is as follows:

  • 22 June: Calais to near Annecy via Reims, A26/A39 (520 miles): I picked near Annecy as thought it was a good stopover. This would just be an overnight stop to recharge for the next day. Could I go further on the first day? Would be happy to stay in a motorway hotel (Ibis etc) to ease the journey on the next day.
  • 23 June: Near Annecy to Siena, via Mont Blanc tunnel, Milan (442 miles, 7.5hrs)
If you had time the petite st bernard pass from near bourg st maurice would be a much nicer option to mt blanc tunnel.

  • 24 - 27 June: Florence, San Quirico d'Orcia, Pienza, Motepulciano, Orvieto. Would it be best to base in once place and drive around, or move from place to place? Any accommodation recommendations appreciated.
  • 28 June: Tuscany to Lake Como (possibly Bellagio). 280 miles, 5hrs): Is it worth stopping off in Lake Garda as well? Is it massively different to Como? Tips on where to base and accommodation most appreciated.
  • 29 - 1 July: Lake Como/Maggiore: Is Lake Maggiore worth a visit?
We stayed at Como at casa del portico which is a fantastic b&b near mezzegra. You can drive round Maggiore on the way from Como to Andermatt.

  • 2 July: Lake Como to Swiss Alps (possibly Andermatt, Obergoms? Advice on where to base/stay appreciated). Plan is to drive the Furka, Susten, Grimsel pass loop. Maybe heard NE from Maggiore to Simplon pass? Would like to get a cable car up a mountain or a similar activity. Is the cable car up the Matterhorn from Zermatt worth doing?
Andermatt was quite short on accommodation and where we stayed quite basic (Gasthaus skiklub) but it was only one night. Simplon pass is nice, and the Nufenen pass also near Andermatt is well worth considering

  • 3-5 July: Swiss Alps
  • 6 July: Swiss Alps to somewhere in Black Forest (is Baden-Baden nice?)
We stayed here last year Best Western Hotel Hofgut Sternen which was picturesque, but we were generally disappointed with the black forest in general.

  • 7 July: Black forest to Cochem (Adenau)
  • 8 July: Cochem to Calais
I know this seems like a scarily undetailed draft given that we're leaving in a few days... eek so I would really appreciate any tips, insight, recommendations you guys may have.

Many thanks chaps,

beer

numtumfutunch

4,705 posts

137 months

Tuesday 20th June 2017
quotequote all

Ive stayed here when in Annecy:

http://hotelbeausejour-menthon.com/wp/

90EU per double room, breakfast extra
Nice spot, no stress parking a nice car overnight and decent food next door in the tennis club too
(Plus several other walkable options)

If you're planning on arriving after 7pm then I wouldnt bother though
Part of the appeal for me was sitting in he garden taking in the vibe or going for a walk along the lakeside
Similarly sitting in the garden having a leisurely breakfast is a treat too, but not if you're racing off at 6AM

Annecy downtown is lovely especially around the canals but Im afraid I cant recommend any hotels from personal experience let alone ones with safe parking

Cheers - sounds like a top trip

mon the fish

1,412 posts

147 months

Tuesday 20th June 2017
quotequote all
Garda is more touristy and a bit busier, Sirmione probably the best place to be with the most restaurants etc. Lake Como a bit quieter. Overall we preferred Como but both lovely places to watch the world go by.

Bellagio is lovely, and where I would stay on Lake Como as it's central for getting the ferry to places. The roads up the peninsula to Bellagio are very narrow - if I was going back I'd get the car ferry from Menaggio across, also it's a cool way to arrive by driving off the ferry.

We stayed at the Hotel Bellagio, which has secure underground parking (individual garage per car) at a separate location at the top of the peninsula

logit

Original Poster:

78 posts

205 months

Tuesday 20th June 2017
quotequote all
Thanks so much for the thoughts guys. I've now booked our first night stop and Italian Lakes accommodation based on suggestions in this thread. Now need to book Tuscany accommodation and decide where to stay/what to do in the Swiss Alps. Please keep any suggestions coming beer

I'll update the thread as I get the route pinned down.

Cheers

DuraAce

4,240 posts

159 months

Tuesday 20th June 2017
quotequote all
To much planning IMHO.

If you prebook everything then you have to keep on schedule every day. You can end up feeling like you're against the clock and don't have the opportunity to stop en route if you find somewhere you like that you hadn't planned for.

I use paper Michelin maps in conjunction with my sat nav to plan a rough route of major towns/passes/attractions I want to see. Book the first night accommodation before your go and then do everything else as you go. You'll never struggle to get accommodation, use the Internet on your phone as you go - booking.com and Airbnb etc.

mon the fish

1,412 posts

147 months

Tuesday 20th June 2017
quotequote all
As above, but I pre-book cancellable hotels on booking.com - as long as you can cancel up to 2pm or whatever on day of arrival.

Does give you that bit of flexibility

logit

Original Poster:

78 posts

205 months

Tuesday 20th June 2017
quotequote all
That's actually sensible advice as I'm finding it hard to envisage how the trip will pan out having never done something like this before.

Has anyone got any thoughts on what we can do in the Swiss Alps?
I'm going to do the main passes but I quite liked the thought of getting the cable car up Matterhorn from Zermatt. Has anyone done this or similar activities they can recommend in the area?

feef

5,206 posts

182 months

Tuesday 20th June 2017
quotequote all
If you find yourself in the Interlaken/Grindelwald area then there's always the Eigerbahn taking you up to the glacier. Very touristy but worth a visit if only to marvel at the north face and wonder what drove various lunatics to climb it

lucido grigio

44,044 posts

162 months

Tuesday 20th June 2017
quotequote all
On your trip down ,if you're not visiting Milan itself,I'd avoid and bypass it if possible.

The Milan ring road is M25esque with added tolls.

lucido grigio

44,044 posts

162 months

Tuesday 20th June 2017
quotequote all
Add to above,maybe head down to Genoa and head south beside the Med and through tunnel after tunnel,there's loads on that section down to La Spezia etc.

logit

Original Poster:

78 posts

205 months

Tuesday 20th June 2017
quotequote all
lucido grigio said:
Add to above,maybe head down to Genoa and head south beside the Med and through tunnel after tunnel,there's loads on that section down to La Spezia etc.
Thanks. Do I need to take the ss1 road to La Spezia from genoa or does the E80 motorway which runs parallel also take in those sights?

lucido grigio

44,044 posts

162 months

Tuesday 20th June 2017
quotequote all
logit said:
lucido grigio said:
Add to above,maybe head down to Genoa and head south beside the Med and through tunnel after tunnel,there's loads on that section down to La Spezia etc.
Thanks. Do I need to take the ss1 road to La Spezia from genoa or does the E80 motorway which runs parallel also take in those sights?
No ,just stay on the motorway all the way down to Lucca.

Then east to Florence and south for Siena......presumably....smile

ETA......Coming off the motorway at that point could be a handy stopoff for a break.

When I was doing that journey I was nearing my exit at Lucca and usually bit knackered by then and I would've just wanted to press on

to the end.


Edited by lucido grigio on Tuesday 20th June 15:16

Highway Star

3,573 posts

230 months

Thursday 22nd June 2017
quotequote all
lucido grigio said:
No ,just stay on the motorway all the way down to Lucca.

Then east to Florence and south for Siena......presumably....smile

ETA......Coming off the motorway at that point could be a handy stopoff for a break.

When I was doing that journey I was nearing my exit at Lucca and usually bit knackered by then and I would've just wanted to press on

to the end.


Edited by lucido grigio on Tuesday 20th June 15:16
From La Spezia, just take the motorway further down to Pisa, the SS (FI-PI-LI) towards Florence, come off near Ancona and go down to Siena.

OP, I arrived back last Saturday from two weeks in Tuscany, staying in the Chiana, about an hour north of Orvieto and 40 minutes east of Siena. Montepulciano and Pienza were about 30 minutes away. I drove (my wife and son flew). Two day drive was eminently doable, though I went a different way, ostensibly to save money and also so I could go a different way than before when I'd gone down through France.

Day 1 I left home at 7, got a Eurotunnel at 10.30am, then Lille, Belgium, Luxembourg (huge queues, bloody stupid closure of the main motorway junction), Metz, Strasbourg, over the Rhine and down south of Freiburg (slow on a Friday evening on the autobahn) by 8.30pm to stay in the Black Forest overnight.

Day 2, 9.30 start, autobahn to Basel, St Gotthard (went over the pass rather than through the tunnel, but still got stuck in a massive queue), Como (big queues getting through the border crossing between Chiasso and Como), Milan, Parma, La Spezia, Pisa airport by 6.30 to pick up the family, then onto where we stayed.

On the way back I took the St Bernardino Pass and went around Zurich way, but still slow. Think next time, I'll spend about £30 more each way and just autoroute it through France as I have done before.




Yipper

5,964 posts

89 months

Thursday 22nd June 2017
quotequote all
Forget Switzerland. Overrated scenery and hates the car. Do the Italian Dolomites (Alps), instead. Bolzano to Cortina.

lucido grigio

44,044 posts

162 months

Friday 23rd June 2017
quotequote all
Highway Star said:
From La Spezia, just take the motorway further down to Pisa, the SS (FI-PI-LI) towards Florence, come off near Ancona and go down to Siena
My Italian geography isn't perfect but Ancona is on the East coast ,Adriatic, so there's something quite wrong with the above.

I did double check in my big map book.....smile

Also after Pisa I'd stay on thee coast to Livorno ,which has a nice harbour and then head across country to Volterra which is very nice before

heading to Siena.

It's too late anyhoo ,he's already started the trip....smile

Highway Star

3,573 posts

230 months

Friday 23rd June 2017
quotequote all
lucido grigio said:
My Italian geography isn't perfect but Ancona is on the East coast ,Adriatic, so there's something quite wrong with the above.

I did double check in my big map book.....smile

Also after Pisa I'd stay on thee coast to Livorno ,which has a nice harbour and then head across country to Volterra which is very nice before

heading to Siena.

It's too late anyhoo ,he's already started the trip....smile
Arse. Meant Empoli!

Zed 44

1,242 posts

155 months

Saturday 24th June 2017
quotequote all
AVOID, AVOID, AVOID. I don't know why anyone gave this peace of st airtime believing that it was a decent road. It's not.







In case you didn't recognize it, it is the highly recommend Stelvio pass.

jock mcsporran

5,001 posts

272 months

Saturday 24th June 2017
quotequote all
Or, alternatively, get up earlier and have it all to yourself




Zed 44

1,242 posts

155 months

Saturday 24th June 2017
quotequote all
Or alternatively, just don't go. If you have to plan doing the pass to fit into such a narrow time slot it is definitely not worth it. Plus the side coming up from Merano, the road surface really is ste and in a biggish car, you practically have to do a 3 point turn to get around some of the bends.

There are so many good passes in Europe that it astonishes me that the Stelvio has the reputation it does. It's almost been taken over by bikers and cyclists. Soon the only cars allowed will be electric ones.