Unibody Triumph Spitfire 6 (and friends!)

Unibody Triumph Spitfire 6 (and friends!)

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Discussion

joshleb

1,544 posts

143 months

Sunday 26th August 2018
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Round of applause. Great cars, great trips great stories!

You have so much skill I am in awe, I'm chuffed when I change pads and disks!

Reckon you would have been awesome on Scrapheap challenge (not saying anything about your cars here!)

Do you work in the motor trade as your day job? How do you know everything!

BiTurbo228

Original Poster:

55 posts

172 months

Sunday 26th August 2018
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Thanks man smile

It's all just practice and getting stuck in. Wasn't too long ago I was chuffed at brake jobs as well (still am really).

Not motor trade, I just muck about in my spare time. My dad's always been into cars so I had a good start and decent facilities/tools. Once you work out that 9 times out of 10 everything goes back together the opposite of how it came off it's pretty straight forwards smile

Oh and I'd have loved to go on scrapheap challenge smile right up my street!

BiTurbo228

Original Poster:

55 posts

172 months

Tuesday 25th September 2018
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Well, there has been progress with the exxy. Turns out I wasn't quite as nearly done as I'd hoped.

Couldn't get the brakes to bleed properly, but managed to find a set of Montecarlo 38mm calipers. Same design including the handbrake, just a bigger piston. Rebuilt them, fitted and still won't bleed. Read somewhere you might need to have the handbrake cables loose for them to bleed properly. I'll try that next.

While it was outside I thought I'd have a go at fixing the alternator. Replaced the junky old wire from alternator to starter, and thought I'd take a positive feed to make a relay for the starter solenoid as about about half the time it wouldn't engage (not enough juice unless the battery was freshly charged).

Old and busted/new hotness:



Original solenoid wire now triggers a relay which takes power straight from the positive post on the starter rather than potting power straight through the ignition switch (terrible idea).

Worked beautifully! Starter engages every time, and spins quicker too. Perfect...except that it wouldn't start now.

Oh.

Bit of troubleshooting and it would seem that the ignition ECU and coil weren't getting power. After lots of chasing the loom around and trying to puzzle out gow the PO had spliced together the X1/9 and Uno Turbo looms we discovered that he'd powered both the ignition coil and ECU through the old dinky ignition coil wire. Really didn't like the idea of having the power for an old and expensive Italian ECU come directly from a noisy coil.

The answer? Fusebox and more relays!



So we've got a positive feed from the starter going to a fusebox, with separate relays for the coil, ignition ECU and fuel system tachometric relay triggered by the old ignition coil wire, and the aforementioned starter relay.

Works a treat!

Now I've just got the same thing to do with the headlights which have started blowing fuses and have a similarly confusing wiring setup...

At this rate I might get an MoT this month!

BiTurbo228

Original Poster:

55 posts

172 months

Wednesday 26th September 2018
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Hum. Discovered one or two interesting developments with the headlight wiring.

First off, the PO had wired in a relay to the headlight position switch which in effect changed the function so that the sidelights didn't come on when the ignition was off. Presumably so you can have the headlights up and the rest of the car off. Fair enough, but it dangles around and hits my knees so that came out.

Second, we discovered that the positive for the dip beam had burnt out previously. No wonder seeing as it's not relayed at all and the direct power goes through both the headlight switch on the stalk and the position switch. The PO had replaced that with various relays tapped off various wires so that the lights came on with the position switch. Again, fair enough, but we'll redo it as some of the wire gauges are teeny-tiny for the load they'll be carrying.

Lastly, we discovered that this relay assortment had been spliced into two relays in the fusebox which don't appear on any of the wiring diagrams we can find...but are in a photo in the Haynes manual. What the what?! Oh, and half of the wires running to/from this relay appear to have melted. One of these goes to the fog lamp switch. The second output is plugged directly into the trigger feed so once activated it triggers itself. The next one shares a couple of wires (hopefully earths) and seems to go to the wiper switch.

These three revelations took all day to discover. Why? This is why:



Why so many wires? There's only a dozen or so electrical systems in the whole car. Why the world's supply of wiring? At least they've got a good array of colours so it's not a monotone nightmare to trace.

Oh, and if anyone wants to see a narrowly avoided vehicle fire, this is what one looks like:





Melted insulation all up the length of wire to the fog lamp switch which runs through big looms and adjacent to carpet. Also melted insulation on that weird triggers-itself-positive-feed. Current thinking is that the fog lamp system doesn't have a fuse as standard and there's a short somewhere further down the line. We'll see tomorrow I suppose!

Oh, and also nearly managed to brick an £100 fusebox when we went to disconnect the main power in and the spade terminal came out with it! Pulled out of the circuit board within the sealed-ish box. Luckily we were able to carefully pry it open and solder it back on, but that was a tense half-hour or so :S

Isn't wiring fun? wink

BiTurbo228

Original Poster:

55 posts

172 months

Monday 1st October 2018
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Let there be light!



Managed to suss it out. Apparently on later UK X1/9s Fiat added a fog light system using two relays that don't appear on any other wiring diagrams. These relays fit inbetween the headlight popup switch and the column switch with wires that traipse all the way from one side of the car to the other and back again. The first relay is just used to trigger the second and power the foglight switch (through some dinky little wires which is why they were melted). The second relay powers the headlights through a resistor (again, on the opposite side of the car and back again) so you get dim bulbs for your foglights when the lights aren't on.

Here's the wiring diagram that doesn't appear anywhere else on the web:


High res

That did mean that we had two free relay sockets and a fuse holder within the factory fusebox to repurpose to allow a relayed feed for the dip beams and a relayed feed for the foglight (you only need the rear one and a warning light for the MoT).

A bit of cutting and crimping and here's what we came up with:


High res

Oh, and here's the wiring diagram for the starting and ECUs:


High res

Now if only the clutch slave hadn't just let go we'd be getting somewhere!

BiTurbo228

Original Poster:

55 posts

172 months

Tuesday 2nd October 2018
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Well, the clutch wouldn’t bleed on the Fiat so I switched jobs. Fiat out, Spitfire in...



...and masked ready for paint!



It’s only taken 9 months of filling and sanding. 9. Months.

If it’s not flat I’ll cry.

Usget

5,426 posts

210 months

Tuesday 2nd October 2018
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BiTurbo228 said:
I recognise that cafe, it's in Llandidloes. We were there on bikes in June. That part of Wales definitely needs ironing!

300bhp/ton

41,030 posts

189 months

Tuesday 2nd October 2018
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Some cool projects going on here and some interesting work on the Triumph. smile

Have you given thought to IVA though? Looks like you'll need one based on the mods you've done.

BiTurbo228

Original Poster:

55 posts

172 months

Tuesday 2nd October 2018
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@Usget You're right! Small world smile it is a gorgeous place, but having been through it I'm sure you can appreciate how relieved I was that the land was flat the other side of the hedge...

@ Thanks man smile

I expect you're right about the IVA. I've done some reading through the regs and while it is pretty in depth, a lot of it is stuff that's a damn good idea from a safety perspective anyway.

I do wonder how they'd ever find out it needed one though, but that's a question for a less law abiding citizen wink

PhillipM

6,515 posts

188 months

Tuesday 2nd October 2018
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You'd be surprised how many they pick up from online builds - I know of at least 3 cars, one of which was siezed and crushed...

BiTurbo228

Original Poster:

55 posts

172 months

Wednesday 3rd October 2018
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Well, having read through the IVA regulations there are a couple of things I'll need to sort. I'll need to rethink my fuel tank placement as it's within the crumple zone at the back (was slightly leery of that anyway, but Triumph did it on the GT6). I'll also need to make sure my planned lexan windows have little 'e' marks on them and sort out a foglight at the rear.

Loads of little things I'll need to pay attention to, but a lot of it seems good practice to me anyway.

lufbramatt

5,318 posts

133 months

Wednesday 3rd October 2018
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If you're on Retro Rides have a look at Blackpopracing's ford Popular build, he got that through an IVA (IIRC he had to after someone read his thread online and reported it). Loads of invaluable info in there.

BiTurbo228

Original Poster:

55 posts

172 months

Wednesday 3rd October 2018
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Ah brill thanks smile I am and I shall.

Also, who the hell reads retro rides and then reports people to the DVSA?

PhillipM

6,515 posts

188 months

Wednesday 3rd October 2018
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People that work there biggrin

B'stard Child

28,321 posts

245 months

Wednesday 3rd October 2018
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BiTurbo228 said:
Ah brill thanks smile I am and I shall.

Also, who the hell reads retro rides and then reports people to the DVSA?
Blackpop posts on more than just RR - Rods and Sods for one I'm sure

BiTurbo228

Original Poster:

55 posts

172 months

Thursday 4th October 2018
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I suppose I should be grateful we even have the IVA process. I've got friends in France and they have to have their modifications agreed by the original manufacturer of the vehicle! Would be a little tricky on a Triumph...

BiTurbo228

Original Poster:

55 posts

172 months

Friday 5th October 2018
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B'stard Child said:
Blackpop posts on more than just RR - Rods and Sods for one I'm sure
Thanks, found him on RR. Currently halfway through his mammoth 148-page thread! IVA stuff starts around page 70ish smile

Google [bot]

6,682 posts

180 months

Friday 5th October 2018
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Just stumbled upon this thread, absolutely brilliant OP, thanks! Keep ‘em coming, there aren’t enough brilliant/st old car and even better adventure threads. Kudos to your skills too.

BiTurbo228

Original Poster:

55 posts

172 months

Friday 5th October 2018
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Thanks man! Glad you're enjoying it smile hopefully get to do some more adventuring soon. Was hoping to get to the Nurburgring last week with the same bunch of people I went to Wales with but I spent all the money getting the Fiat fixed :S

Still, meant I had some time off for painting smile

Managed to get the first two coats of primer on and...

...it's flat!



All my filling and sanding wasn’t for nothing smile I have learnt I was mixing the filler too rigarously, introducing bubbles which cause little pinholes, but I'm hoping to fix that with a little stopping. Went ok apart from that smile

BiTurbo228

Original Poster:

55 posts

172 months

Sunday 7th October 2018
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And we have paint!



To try and avoid orange peel I put the paint on a little thicker than with the primer. Worked beautifully on most areas as it's glass smooth. Worked terribly on areas where I had overspray from other panels. Runs galore there. Looks like I've got more sanding to do. Currently weighing up whether to try and sand them out and back up to gloss, or sand them out and do one final coat of paint.

Oh, and oddly this pic is nothing like the actual colour. This is closer to what it actually looks like in the sun: