Discussion
I posted this on a 911 forum as I felt it worthy of some debate. I'm interested as to what PH thinks:
I've had 3 Boxsters in total. Sold my last one, a 987S, in 2005 when it was about 6 months old. The 986 I had prior to that was bought in Luxembourg, pre the euro, when there was still serious money to be saved by buying a C16 car abroad.
I lost less than £1k on that 986 over 2 years and 10k miles. I thought the 987 would possess equally powerful residuals and command a waiting list. Alas, it didn't and when I sold the 987 I was lucky to escape with a £4K loss in less than a year.
Anyway, I've always liked Boxsters. I've had a nice 993 for 6 years now with no real plans to sell it. It's not particularly fast, the handling isn't the best and it is thirstier than a footballer in a nightclub. However, to my eyes it's a fantastic looking car, it sounds great and on the rare occasions I'm alone in it on the right road, it's pretty nice to drive to boot.
Last year it was having some work done at the OPC and they loaned me a 981S. I found it a fantastic thing. Unapologetically fast and the PSE combined with pdk were addictive and compelling.
Im currently borrowing a 981 black edition. On paper this is broadly the same bhp as my 993. It has PDK, BOSE, nav, heated seats, extended leather and nice looking 20" alloys. It feels similar performance wise to my 993. Not markedly faster like the S did. I've done about 300 miles in it now. I'm massively impressed. It's amazing how a car with frankly enormous wheels, liquorice profile tyres and a relatively short wheel base can ride so well. As with the S I drove this car has PSE. Why you would order any Boxster without this option is a mystery, it sounds fantastic and the best of it is, you can mute it if you want to.
I'm a big fan of a manual gearbox but the PDK is now so good it really does beggar the question why would you spec manual over this ?
You can engage neutral whilst on the move, you can change down as quick as you like and when you're in traffic, you have all the benefits of a conventional automatic without feeling like you're constantly giving your left leg workout you didn't want to do.
The Bose stereo seems far too bass heavy on factory settings, more so than it ever was in a 986 or 987. I'm sure the heated seats in the earlier cars got up to a toastier level as well. Other than that I'm struggling to find any criticism at all. I'm impressed with the economy as well.
As with most new cars, the more options you can have seems to factor significantly into how nice they are to own. Personally I'd want an S. I'd spec PDK, those heated seats, PSE ,20 inch wheels and bucket seats (if you can get them with heating) I've tried those seats in a 991 GTS and they feel special.
Anyway other than to to tell you lucky 981 owners just how great your cars are it struck me that the 993 is now sought after as numbers are limited and it's seen as a classic. In time the same is going to be said for the 981 Boxster. It's the last of the line, just as the 993 Was for air cooled and direct lineage to the early 911's. The new 718 cars will be fantastic to drive I'm sure. However they are losing the six cylinder engine and with it a little history and so
me soul.
i can see the 981 being more highly prized in years to come over the 718. It's happened before with Porsche cars. I'm as impressed with this base Boxster as I was with a 991 GTS, albeit for different reasons. Exposure has really had me questioning why I'm not cashing out of the 993 and into a more modern car.
Whilst the 993 retains a sense of occasion it's more one dimensional than a modern product in many ways. You have the weight of the controls, the steering and the sound. These are compelling factors. The modern Boxster counters with superior economy, a smoother ride and the ability to bimble along in traffic quietly, easily and comfortably. When opportunity presents you can drop the roof in seconds, change the map and change gear effectively with the paddles. You get two big useful boots, though the 993 counters by offering kid seating.
Lots said on here about pdk. As it is outselling manuals by a huge margin I think manuals may be more desirable in future. Doesn't diminish the achievement made with this box though.
The only other factor putting me off a 981 is the depreciation still to come. I'm not willing to suffer £4K a year as a loss which I think a 2014 981 S will be carrying. Great cars though. I know the Cayman gets more love but I've always preferred a convertible thus the Boxster would be my choice. Anyone else owning a classic tempted by the new stuff??
I've had 3 Boxsters in total. Sold my last one, a 987S, in 2005 when it was about 6 months old. The 986 I had prior to that was bought in Luxembourg, pre the euro, when there was still serious money to be saved by buying a C16 car abroad.
I lost less than £1k on that 986 over 2 years and 10k miles. I thought the 987 would possess equally powerful residuals and command a waiting list. Alas, it didn't and when I sold the 987 I was lucky to escape with a £4K loss in less than a year.
Anyway, I've always liked Boxsters. I've had a nice 993 for 6 years now with no real plans to sell it. It's not particularly fast, the handling isn't the best and it is thirstier than a footballer in a nightclub. However, to my eyes it's a fantastic looking car, it sounds great and on the rare occasions I'm alone in it on the right road, it's pretty nice to drive to boot.
Last year it was having some work done at the OPC and they loaned me a 981S. I found it a fantastic thing. Unapologetically fast and the PSE combined with pdk were addictive and compelling.
Im currently borrowing a 981 black edition. On paper this is broadly the same bhp as my 993. It has PDK, BOSE, nav, heated seats, extended leather and nice looking 20" alloys. It feels similar performance wise to my 993. Not markedly faster like the S did. I've done about 300 miles in it now. I'm massively impressed. It's amazing how a car with frankly enormous wheels, liquorice profile tyres and a relatively short wheel base can ride so well. As with the S I drove this car has PSE. Why you would order any Boxster without this option is a mystery, it sounds fantastic and the best of it is, you can mute it if you want to.
I'm a big fan of a manual gearbox but the PDK is now so good it really does beggar the question why would you spec manual over this ?
You can engage neutral whilst on the move, you can change down as quick as you like and when you're in traffic, you have all the benefits of a conventional automatic without feeling like you're constantly giving your left leg workout you didn't want to do.
The Bose stereo seems far too bass heavy on factory settings, more so than it ever was in a 986 or 987. I'm sure the heated seats in the earlier cars got up to a toastier level as well. Other than that I'm struggling to find any criticism at all. I'm impressed with the economy as well.
As with most new cars, the more options you can have seems to factor significantly into how nice they are to own. Personally I'd want an S. I'd spec PDK, those heated seats, PSE ,20 inch wheels and bucket seats (if you can get them with heating) I've tried those seats in a 991 GTS and they feel special.
Anyway other than to to tell you lucky 981 owners just how great your cars are it struck me that the 993 is now sought after as numbers are limited and it's seen as a classic. In time the same is going to be said for the 981 Boxster. It's the last of the line, just as the 993 Was for air cooled and direct lineage to the early 911's. The new 718 cars will be fantastic to drive I'm sure. However they are losing the six cylinder engine and with it a little history and so
me soul.
i can see the 981 being more highly prized in years to come over the 718. It's happened before with Porsche cars. I'm as impressed with this base Boxster as I was with a 991 GTS, albeit for different reasons. Exposure has really had me questioning why I'm not cashing out of the 993 and into a more modern car.
Whilst the 993 retains a sense of occasion it's more one dimensional than a modern product in many ways. You have the weight of the controls, the steering and the sound. These are compelling factors. The modern Boxster counters with superior economy, a smoother ride and the ability to bimble along in traffic quietly, easily and comfortably. When opportunity presents you can drop the roof in seconds, change the map and change gear effectively with the paddles. You get two big useful boots, though the 993 counters by offering kid seating.
Lots said on here about pdk. As it is outselling manuals by a huge margin I think manuals may be more desirable in future. Doesn't diminish the achievement made with this box though.
The only other factor putting me off a 981 is the depreciation still to come. I'm not willing to suffer £4K a year as a loss which I think a 2014 981 S will be carrying. Great cars though. I know the Cayman gets more love but I've always preferred a convertible thus the Boxster would be my choice. Anyone else owning a classic tempted by the new stuff??
So you are impressed with a modern Boxster, but you could easily write all those observations about any of the current Porsche range, and therein lies the problem. Apart from the shape there is an identity crisis. All are fuel efficient, all easy to drive quickly, all at the cutting edge of modern tech. All a little too easy for their own good some would say....
The old cars offer something refreshing in that you have to work and think! when trying to enjoy their performance, they make absolutely no sense when measured against modern design/cost criteria. I guess it depends on your personal approach to driving. Cheap easy thrills of the modern or an old style workout?
The old cars offer something refreshing in that you have to work and think! when trying to enjoy their performance, they make absolutely no sense when measured against modern design/cost criteria. I guess it depends on your personal approach to driving. Cheap easy thrills of the modern or an old style workout?
highway said:
ILast year it was having some work done at the OPC and they loaned me a 981S. I found it a fantastic thing. Unapologetically fast and the PSE combined with pdk were addictive and compelling.
I felt quite the reverse.PDK was dull is dull and always will be dull.
PSE was fake, which was a shame
steering was lifeless
gearing was longer due to bigger wheels.
Brakes over servoed
thought it was a bit of a dud, but if you like it buy one
I enjoyed your posts as Mr D and remember you from the in house lotus forum where Nick Adams used to answer questions. I'm curious as to how you conclude pdk is "dull" the paddles feel good to the touch. You can change gear at speed without losing momentum and the action is quite satisfying. It's not a slow witted auto box. The PSE sounds good. It's a real noise it's not piped in via the speakers. How do you conclude its fake?
I'm not proclaiming it's the finest thing on 4 wheels but I found it enjoyable with a duality of nature that some other cars don't have. Pressing on, as I was this morning, it's fun yet it's still easy like a good daily should be, for mundane purposes..
I've had a bunch of Lotus cars over the years but they aren't a pleasant cat to use in the rain on a motorway. The Boxster can do the boring stuff like any other modern car but it can still offer entertainment when required. That's why I find most impressive.
I'm not proclaiming it's the finest thing on 4 wheels but I found it enjoyable with a duality of nature that some other cars don't have. Pressing on, as I was this morning, it's fun yet it's still easy like a good daily should be, for mundane purposes..
I've had a bunch of Lotus cars over the years but they aren't a pleasant cat to use in the rain on a motorway. The Boxster can do the boring stuff like any other modern car but it can still offer entertainment when required. That's why I find most impressive.
I think you have answered all of your own questions in your post, you should sell the 993 and get the 981S that you really want! You seem smitten.
Unless there is some reason why you want anyone to persuade you otherwise?
One thing I will say is to forget whether the 981 will become a classic or not. Even if does, that could be 20 years away. Hardly relevant now.
Unless there is some reason why you want anyone to persuade you otherwise?
One thing I will say is to forget whether the 981 will become a classic or not. Even if does, that could be 20 years away. Hardly relevant now.
highway said:
I do want taking out of it! I don't want t take on £4K a year depreciation instead of appreciation!!
Haha ok. Lets start with the 4k depreciation, I would expect it to be more than that, significantly more. Of course, it depends on how long you keep it for.The other thing is that if you sell the 993, you may not be able to afford another one in the future, and I think you know you will miss it. Of course, this is total guess work, nobody really knows for sure. But its a real possibility in my view, maybe even likely.
But in the end, life is short and you should do what you want, maybe you will make a mistake, perhaps you will just move on and never look back.
A nice choice to have though.
Porsche911R said:
I felt quite the reverse.
PDK was dull is dull and always will be dull.
PSE was fake, which was a shame
steering was lifeless
gearing was longer due to bigger wheels.
Brakes over servoed
thought it was a bit of a dud, but if you like it buy one
Surely it's the tyre size, not the wheel size which affects gearing?PDK was dull is dull and always will be dull.
PSE was fake, which was a shame
steering was lifeless
gearing was longer due to bigger wheels.
Brakes over servoed
thought it was a bit of a dud, but if you like it buy one
A 981 with 20" tyres will have a smaller rear tyre circumference than 18" or 19" tyres on the 981:
18" Front = 2100.8mm; Rear = 2185.6mm
19" Front = 2106.8mm; Rear = 2182.2mm
20" Front = 2112.7mm; Rear = 2178.7mm
A smaller tyre will rotate faster, meaning shorter gearing on 20" tyres than the smaller wheeled equivalent 981.
Apart from that...
PDK is excellent. A manual can't be an auto too, but a PDK can be a manual.
PSE is unnecessary on the base car imo. Engine noise is quite enough for me when revs are high.
Steering full of life, especially since I ditched the Pirellis and moved to GY F1 A2s.
Brakes have just the right feel, coming from an over servoed TTS.
My 981 Cayman, 2.7, PDK is the best move I've made.
Edited by DJMC on Monday 28th March 22:37
stuttgartmetal said:
Couldn't face pulling up alongside a 911 in it myself.
I chose the Cayman over the Boxster as it's a more appealing overall design and I'd had convertibles for 15 years, plus the "glance over the shoulder" view is flawed in the Boxster.A Cayman fares rather well next to a 911...
Edited by DJMC on Monday 28th March 22:49
I couldn't justify £40k plus on another toy car. If I changed the fun car the 993 would have to go.'ive thought
I was ready for that several times over the past 6'years but, like an ill treated spouse, I'm not ready to make a permanent move. A nice chap at the gym was sounding me out for a swap for his 991s. Sorely tempting but the garage w
e has a hold on me!
I was ready for that several times over the past 6'years but, like an ill treated spouse, I'm not ready to make a permanent move. A nice chap at the gym was sounding me out for a swap for his 991s. Sorely tempting but the garage w
e has a hold on me!stuttgartmetal said:
Couldn't face pulling up alongside a 911 in it myself.
Said it before - I'll say it again. Who cares what someone else drives? Most of us buy cars that we enjoy driving. Why do you care if someone else has something that you perceive as 'superior'? Is it envy? Is it an overwhelming sense of inferiority? What? I really don't get this attitude at all. Maybe if you spent more time enjoying what you've got, and less time worrying about what other people may have, you'd be a whole lot happier
Just saying!
Your 993 may appreciate in value but running costs appear high. A 981 will depreciate more in the coming years and who knows if it will plateau and then rise again in the future?
Running costs, handling and comfort may be improved in the 981. Mine has averaged 35mpg over the last 5,000 miles, 40mpg on a run.
Running costs, handling and comfort may be improved in the 981. Mine has averaged 35mpg over the last 5,000 miles, 40mpg on a run.
DJMC said:
A Cayman fares rather well next to a 911...
No it doesn't!! Absolutely zero contest which car I'd take based on that picture.Edited by DJMC on Monday 28th March 22:49
DavidJG said:
Said it before - I'll say it again. Who cares what someone else drives? Most of us buy cars that we enjoy driving. Why do you care if someone else has something that you perceive as 'superior'? Is it envy? Is it an overwhelming sense of inferiority? What?
I really don't get this attitude at all. Maybe if you spent more time enjoying what you've got, and less time worrying about what other people may have, you'd be a whole lot happier
Just saying!
I would say 99% of the people in here (including me) care more about it then they would admit. People are vain by nature.I really don't get this attitude at all. Maybe if you spent more time enjoying what you've got, and less time worrying about what other people may have, you'd be a whole lot happier
Just saying!
mollytherocker said:
fredt said:
I would say 99% of the people in here (including me) care more about it then they would admit. People are vain by nature.
Speak for yourself, I couldn't give a crap!I had some vanity in my 20's, but not now!
My point comes across badly, I don't care what other people drive, I care what I drive.
What I mean is most people like to have nice things and when it comes to cars it is not out and out about the driving experience, it's an ownership thing and most people would buy as nice a car they can afford.
I don't think that is any clearer
What I mean is most people like to have nice things and when it comes to cars it is not out and out about the driving experience, it's an ownership thing and most people would buy as nice a car they can afford.
I don't think that is any clearer
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