Carrera T or GT4
Discussion
Depends if you prefer a 911 to a Cayman. The GT4 feels a smaller car on the road despite being identical 1978mm width mirror to mirror to the T. Both cars have different but equally endearing characteristics re handling etc for rapid road use.
Depends if you need rear seats.
Also depends whether you want n.a. or
'turbine.'
Finally depends whether you want essentially a track car or road car.
Both great packages at the money.
T will be rarer in the UK. More usable as a daily too. Although the GT4 is quite usable despite no lift.
And T perhaps a more authentic package having regard to the GT4s drawbacks...lack of proper high revving GT Porsche engine and inappropriate gearing.
Depends if you need rear seats.
Also depends whether you want n.a. or
'turbine.'
Finally depends whether you want essentially a track car or road car.
Both great packages at the money.
T will be rarer in the UK. More usable as a daily too. Although the GT4 is quite usable despite no lift.
And T perhaps a more authentic package having regard to the GT4s drawbacks...lack of proper high revving GT Porsche engine and inappropriate gearing.
Edited by av185 on Monday 19th February 21:46
Edited by av185 on Monday 19th February 21:51
Also is it me or is there an awful lot of GT4 ‘s for sale at minute, many seem to of been up for a while? Everywhere I look a bloody GT4 is for sale, keep tripping over them!
Are these actually changing hands in the quantities that we see for sale? Or they just rusting on the classifieds.....
Are these actually changing hands in the quantities that we see for sale? Or they just rusting on the classifieds.....
TDT said:
av185 said:
And T perhaps a more authentic package having regard to the GT4s drawbacks...lack of proper high revving GT Porsche engine and inappropriate gearing.
Just to be clear..... you’re saying the T is a MORE authentic package than the GT4?For those wanting a proper GT engine the GT4 is lacking with its strangled and detuned Carrera S engine.
Having said this it is nevertheless a great package at the money. Almost as great as the 981 Spyder.
av185 said:
Yes. Truer to form.
For those wanting a proper GT engine the GT4 is lacking with its strangled and detuned Carrera S engine.
Having said this it is nevertheless a great package at the money. Almost as great as the 981 Spyder.
The T is marketed as a driver focused backed to basics..... actually it is a more expensive base carrera.... so a marketing exercise to sell during 991 run-out, off the back of the GT3 Touring… What is authentic about that? For those wanting a proper GT engine the GT4 is lacking with its strangled and detuned Carrera S engine.
Having said this it is nevertheless a great package at the money. Almost as great as the 981 Spyder.
Now, if it was like a T or Clubsport of old and authentic and true to that historical form… it would be even more stripped down..... not just 20KG that most people spec back in anyway and it would have been cheaper than the base carrera.
It’s an interesting package if you’re looking for a new 911, maybe unlocking the best that the base car has to offer, but authentic? To what..... please. The word you are looking for is cynical.
The GT4 was developed by Weissach- with bespoke hardware for the first ever Mid-engine car to come from that department. It ushered in a return to drivers cars for Porsche.. Gearing is tall… but not vastly different than the GTS or manual GT cars before it or even the 991.2 GT3 manual after it.. it’s old school but not old-fashioned.
Edited by TDT on Monday 19th February 23:09
TDT said:
av185 said:
Yes. Truer to form.
For those wanting a proper GT engine the GT4 is lacking with its strangled and detuned Carrera S engine.
Having said this it is nevertheless a great package at the money. Almost as great as the 981 Spyder.
The T is marketed as a driver focused backed to basics..... actually it is a more expensive base carrera.... so a marketing exercise to sell during 991 run-out, off the back of the GT3 Touring… What is authentic about that? For those wanting a proper GT engine the GT4 is lacking with its strangled and detuned Carrera S engine.
Having said this it is nevertheless a great package at the money. Almost as great as the 981 Spyder.
Now, if it was like a T or Clubsport of old and authentic and true to that historical form… it would be even more stripped down..... not just 20KG that most people spec back in anyway and it would have been cheaper than the base carrera.
It’s an interesting package if you’re looking for a new 911, maybe unlocking the best that the base car has to offer, but authentic? To what..... please. The word you are looking for is cynical.
The GT4 was developed by Weissach- with bespoke hardware for the first ever Mid-engine car to come from that department. It ushered in a return to drivers cars for Porsche.. Gearing is tall… but not vastly different than the GTS or manual GT cars before it or even the 991.2 GT3 manual after it.. it’s old school but not old-fashioned.
Edited by TDT on Monday 19th February 23:09
The car equates to more than just a marketing exercise by Porsche and is a stand alone product entirely different to the GT3 T. Remember how the 997 GTS was ridiculed as a run out parts bin special? How wrong were the naysayers......the market still values cars over list £ even 7 years later!
The T is not and was never intended as a stripped out special....the current market for these type 911s would not accept that. What it does offer is subtle differences over a basic Carrera which add up to quite alot as a package.......such as thinner glass less sound insulation lower sport psm mechanical diff lock shorter gear ratios pse rear seat delete optional buckets and pccbs. And the all important rarity..in fact to be as rare as a gen 2 GT3.
Can't agree with your comments claiming the GT4 'ushered in a return to drivers cars for Porsche.' Presumably you are referring to the 'Manuel' gearbox.....PDK S on the GT3 does not instantly mean less driver involvement and I enjoy both gearboxes depending on which cars are being driven and what they are used for.
Great package that the GT4 undoubtedly is, as previously discussed by many it's biggest problem is the strangled and detuned Carrera S non GT engine.
And unfortunately for a car with the promised capabilities offered by the GT3s front suspension and a GT badge on the rear, that will always be the cars main Achilles heel.
Edited by av185 on Tuesday 20th February 06:37
av185 said:
It's easy to miss the point of the T.
The car equates to more than just a marketing exercise by Porsche and is a stand alone product entirely different to the GT3 T. Remember how the 997 GTS was ridiculed as a run out parts bin special? How wrong were the naysayers......the market still values cars over list £ even 7 years later!
]
you cannot put the T up vs the 997 GTSThe car equates to more than just a marketing exercise by Porsche and is a stand alone product entirely different to the GT3 T. Remember how the 997 GTS was ridiculed as a run out parts bin special? How wrong were the naysayers......the market still values cars over list £ even 7 years later!
]
the GTS was the best non GT 911 could be at the time ie. the top model in the line up
GT4 is the best Cayman in the line up
etc etc
the T is a base model 911 with S sus ! it's a bit like the black ed run outs they did last time on the base models.
the T will not follow GTS prices of the 997 , as the S and GTS in the range are better cars, they will be like the black ed prices.
Porsche911R said:
the T is a bit like the black ed run outs they did last time on the base models.
.
.
Haha 'bit' being the operative word.
The black edition runouts were purely cosmetic marketing exercises giving turbo wheels auto dim mirrors rain sensor cruise different steering wheel dynamic lights Bose heated seats and park!
Oh yes, and black paint lol!
Hardly ground breaking improved 911 driving involvement.
GT4 for me.
Henry Catchpole's review of the T - posted on Carfection's YT channel yesterday - seemed to summarise the car accurately.
He makes what I think is a very fair point at the end, saying that what Porsche should have done is not to have allowed the removed components to be added again and as a result kept the price of the car at £75k - the theory being that they couldn't offer the car at £75k whilst allowing the removed parts to be added as "no cost options" as they're worth about £10k as options over a base Carrera.
In my opinion, anyone who decides to add the removed components back into the car are clearly more interested in residuals than anything else, which is of course fine as a) it's a Porsche and b) it's their money, however it does seem a bit perverse.
Henry Catchpole's review of the T - posted on Carfection's YT channel yesterday - seemed to summarise the car accurately.
He makes what I think is a very fair point at the end, saying that what Porsche should have done is not to have allowed the removed components to be added again and as a result kept the price of the car at £75k - the theory being that they couldn't offer the car at £75k whilst allowing the removed parts to be added as "no cost options" as they're worth about £10k as options over a base Carrera.
In my opinion, anyone who decides to add the removed components back into the car are clearly more interested in residuals than anything else, which is of course fine as a) it's a Porsche and b) it's their money, however it does seem a bit perverse.
av185 said:
Haha 'bit' being the operative word.
The black edition runouts were purely cosmetic marketing exercises giving turbo wheels auto dim mirrors rain sensor cruise different steering wheel dynamic lights Bose heated seats and park!
Oh yes, and black paint lol!
Hardly ground breaking improved 911 driving involvement.
if it has the S brakes and the GT3 6 speed , then yes it would be like a Cayman R sort of thing , but it's a base model 911 with S sus !!!
let me guess you have bought one, you must have to be quoting how rare they will be over s GT4 lol
Porsche911R said:
av185 said:
Haha 'bit' being the operative word.
The black edition runouts were purely cosmetic marketing exercises giving turbo wheels auto dim mirrors rain sensor cruise different steering wheel dynamic lights Bose heated seats and park!
Oh yes, and black paint lol!
Hardly ground breaking improved 911 driving involvement.
if it has the S brakes and the GT3 6 speed , then yes it would be like a Cayman R sort of thing , but it's a base model 911 with S sus !!!
let me guess you have bought one, you must have to be quoting how rare they will be over s GT4 lol
When your GT3 arrives you will be able to appreciate the benefits of 4ws(which you previously derided btw)...an option available on the T for those who may want it.....unavailable on the S. Ditto ceramics. Ditto buckets and various other options.
As for residuals, it's all about the production numbers.
Gassing Station | Porsche General | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff