Penske to buy Mercedes F1
Discussion
So the rumour goes anyway according to German Auto Bild, could well be true, I also think there's more to it that Toto hasn't come to Brazil when he's never missed a race weekend since becoming a principle, personally I think he's back at Stuttgart being told we aren't offering Lewis a contract and you need to start looking for another job
Doink said:
So the rumour goes anyway according to German Auto Bild, could well be true, I also think there's more to it that Toto hasn't come to Brazil when he's never missed a race weekend since becoming a principle, personally I think he's back at Stuttgart being told we aren't offering Lewis a contract and you need to start looking for another job
Doesn't Woolf own 30% of the team? Either way, Mercedes pulling out wouldn't surprise me at all. They've achieved all they can in F1, the automotive landscape is changing quickly to electric (and they have their FE team now) and the rule changes are the ideal time to move on having dominated an era.
Doink said:
So the rumour goes anyway according to German Auto Bild, could well be true, I also think there's more to it that Toto hasn't come to Brazil when he's never missed a race weekend since becoming a principle, personally I think he's back at Stuttgart being told we aren't offering Lewis a contract and you need to start looking for another job
I think... for about a year there have been rumours around Toto's future ambitions in the sport - so something probably is brewing there, although I wouldn't speculate as to what that could be, I'm sure none of the rumours are entirely correct.It's a bit of a stretch to connect that 'something' with an unlikely sale of the team at such a key point in their mission though. The facts are that all the team has to do next year, is repeat this years success and in most people's eyes, and by most stats, they will go down in history as the most successful team, delivering the most sustained team and driver performance in the sports history. I'm sure the bigwigs at Stuttgart know how valuable that is for the brand!
On the cusp of the only opportunity they'll ever get to complete that milestone, it seems that every force possible will be aligned at Stuttgart specifically to keep the key people in place, at least for next year. After that, who knows/cares? Job will be done, and 2021 onward the entire landscape changes.
If it were prove-able that such talks were underway for the team to change hands at the end of NEXT season, including a Toto exit, that wouldn't surprise me all that much tbh. The temptation to leave on the ultimate high note for all involved must be strong. But if it were to happen before then, it would shock me and would seem to fly in the face of all logic.
Look at it through the eyes of the Daimler board. F1 is going to become less and less relevant to the car buying public and other activities may align better with where they're going than F1 will.
Woolf can either keep his investment in the team or realise what I imagine will be a very healthy return (he's an investment guy first, remember).
It was fairly well publicised that Zetsche was a supporter of the F1 activity in the face of a less enthusiastic board. Now he's gone there is less to bang the drum about.
From a marketing perspective Mercedes have already achieved pretty much all they can. Leave on a high, or risk a year or two of declining fortunes followed by retreat?
Developing to the new regs will be expensive from a chassis point of view and less so for power train. They can continue supplying teams with engines (including Penske or whoever buys the team) at far lower cost/risk whilst maintaining some marketing benefit if those customers are successful.
If I were on the Daimler board I'd be voting to sell.
Woolf can either keep his investment in the team or realise what I imagine will be a very healthy return (he's an investment guy first, remember).
It was fairly well publicised that Zetsche was a supporter of the F1 activity in the face of a less enthusiastic board. Now he's gone there is less to bang the drum about.
From a marketing perspective Mercedes have already achieved pretty much all they can. Leave on a high, or risk a year or two of declining fortunes followed by retreat?
Developing to the new regs will be expensive from a chassis point of view and less so for power train. They can continue supplying teams with engines (including Penske or whoever buys the team) at far lower cost/risk whilst maintaining some marketing benefit if those customers are successful.
If I were on the Daimler board I'd be voting to sell.
janesmith1950 said:
From a marketing perspective Mercedes have already achieved pretty much all they can. Leave on a high, or risk a year or two of declining fortunes followed by retreat?
Developing to the new regs will be expensive from a chassis point of view and less so for power train. They can continue supplying teams with engines (including Penske or whoever buys the team) at far lower cost/risk whilst maintaining some marketing benefit if those customers are successful.
If I were on the Daimler board I'd be voting to sell.
They haven't already achieved all they can though, they should be able to extend their uninterrupted winning steak in to next season. That would surely be the time to depart?Developing to the new regs will be expensive from a chassis point of view and less so for power train. They can continue supplying teams with engines (including Penske or whoever buys the team) at far lower cost/risk whilst maintaining some marketing benefit if those customers are successful.
If I were on the Daimler board I'd be voting to sell.
I agree with everything you have said from the point of view of selling ahead of 2021, but maintaining the status quo for 2020 seems like it should be a no-brainer. Even if the current board aren't F1 friendly, it doesn't mean they would throw away a job very nearly done at this late stage.
I would also vote to sell, but effective as of the end of next season, not before.
TheDeuce said:
janesmith1950 said:
From a marketing perspective Mercedes have already achieved pretty much all they can. Leave on a high, or risk a year or two of declining fortunes followed by retreat?
Developing to the new regs will be expensive from a chassis point of view and less so for power train. They can continue supplying teams with engines (including Penske or whoever buys the team) at far lower cost/risk whilst maintaining some marketing benefit if those customers are successful.
If I were on the Daimler board I'd be voting to sell.
They haven't already achieved all they can though, they should be able to extend their uninterrupted winning steak in to next season. That would surely be the time to depart?Developing to the new regs will be expensive from a chassis point of view and less so for power train. They can continue supplying teams with engines (including Penske or whoever buys the team) at far lower cost/risk whilst maintaining some marketing benefit if those customers are successful.
If I were on the Daimler board I'd be voting to sell.
I agree with everything you have said from the point of view of selling ahead of 2021, but maintaining the status quo for 2020 seems like it should be a no-brainer. Even if the current board aren't F1 friendly, it doesn't mean they would throw away a job very nearly done at this late stage.
I would also vote to sell, but effective as of the end of next season, not before.
2021 will also even tie in nicely for the end of Hamilton's contract, if this does happen will this mean Hamilton to Ferrari to replace Vettel for 2021.
I think I read that Hamilton has said that 2021 will see many driver changes, could be very interesting and exciting times ahead.
Makes a lot of sense to sell now with next season as a hand over / transition year ahead of the new regs.
I can’t see Mercedes seeing any brand benefit any more from F1 what with the rise of EVs and the growing realisation that motorsport is quickly becoming a negative for a brand (despite having a vegan driver).
I can’t see Mercedes seeing any brand benefit any more from F1 what with the rise of EVs and the growing realisation that motorsport is quickly becoming a negative for a brand (despite having a vegan driver).
If they do sell it'll be after they next season when hopefully they'll seal the 7th WC, after that yes I can see them walking away but not before the job is done, Toto says they have nothing left to prove I get that but they have one last big thing to achieve which is the 7th WC, you can't walk away from all the hard work and money you've spent getting to 6 time champions, one last push and I think the Daimler board will afford them that, after 2020 yes I can see them leaving which brings you onto what happens to the workforce at Brixworth when they pull out, it would take a big set up to want to take all that on, won't be a Manor or HRT outfit, with the money Penske have I think its totally plausible that they will buy Mercedes F1
We're at least 10 years from EV becoming 'mainstream' - probably longer than that. Between now and then, cars still need to be sold be they petrol, diesel, hybrid or electric - market share still needs to be maintained. If you get it right, F1 remains an efficient means to contribute to these aims.
Formula E is improving but is nowhere near to being an equal to F1. The point at which it does, we will see the amalgamation of the two - F1e. This too is at least 10 years away and again, most probably longer than that.
So for Mercedes, who are now active in both F1 and FE, it would make sense to maintain a presence in the sport. Quite how that presence is maintained is another matter and it may well be via 'privatisation' but I really can't see them upping sticks anytime soon as they'd loose too much commercial capital. The caveat to this is that they re able to maintain their level of dominance at the top, or close to it.
Formula E is improving but is nowhere near to being an equal to F1. The point at which it does, we will see the amalgamation of the two - F1e. This too is at least 10 years away and again, most probably longer than that.
So for Mercedes, who are now active in both F1 and FE, it would make sense to maintain a presence in the sport. Quite how that presence is maintained is another matter and it may well be via 'privatisation' but I really can't see them upping sticks anytime soon as they'd loose too much commercial capital. The caveat to this is that they re able to maintain their level of dominance at the top, or close to it.
StevieBee said:
We're at least 10 years from EV becoming 'mainstream' - probably longer than that. Between now and then, cars still need to be sold be they petrol, diesel, hybrid or electric - market share still needs to be maintained. If you get it right, F1 remains an efficient means to contribute to these aims.
Formula E is improving but is nowhere near to being an equal to F1. The point at which it does, we will see the amalgamation of the two - F1e. This too is at least 10 years away and again, most probably longer than that.
So for Mercedes, who are now active in both F1 and FE, it would make sense to maintain a presence in the sport. Quite how that presence is maintained is another matter and it may well be via 'privatisation' but I really can't see them upping sticks anytime soon as they'd loose too much commercial capital. The caveat to this is that they re able to maintain their level of dominance at the top, or close to it.
I get all of that but Mercedes don't need to build chassis to maintain any of that, they have already stated they would be prepared just to supply powertrains and remain in F1Formula E is improving but is nowhere near to being an equal to F1. The point at which it does, we will see the amalgamation of the two - F1e. This too is at least 10 years away and again, most probably longer than that.
So for Mercedes, who are now active in both F1 and FE, it would make sense to maintain a presence in the sport. Quite how that presence is maintained is another matter and it may well be via 'privatisation' but I really can't see them upping sticks anytime soon as they'd loose too much commercial capital. The caveat to this is that they re able to maintain their level of dominance at the top, or close to it.
There's an interview with Hamilton in The Times where he talks of his contract negotiations.
It also mentioned, almost in passing, that Wolff would not be at the Brazil race.
Made me think that there was some connection. It came as little surprise. If they win the WCC next year they'll make the longest run in F1, beating Ferrari's 6. I don't know if such records are important to them, but it might give Merc an opportunity to leave the sport with a reason.
It also mentioned, almost in passing, that Wolff would not be at the Brazil race.
Made me think that there was some connection. It came as little surprise. If they win the WCC next year they'll make the longest run in F1, beating Ferrari's 6. I don't know if such records are important to them, but it might give Merc an opportunity to leave the sport with a reason.
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