Porsche and Tivs
Discussion
I've always liked the look of a 993 C2, but I am a bit worried that I have been spoilt for acceleration and character by my Griff. Never driven a 993 (used to have a 924 turbo, but that was many years ago). If anyone out there has had a 993 and a Griff then I would be interested to hear your views on how the cars compared. The reason I am contemplating a 993 is that 1) I would really like a Cerbera but am put off by the servicing costs and 2) I hate having to ration the miles of pleasure in my Griff (Porkers seem less mileage-sensitive when it comes to prices).
FWIW I have driven a Griff 4.0 and a 964 C2, which isn't a million miles away from the 993.
Performance: Okay, it was a weedy Griff, but for my money the C2 felt just as quick. You have a ton of traction off the line cos of the weight over the rear wheels, and the engine is a bit more cammy, with more top end in the C2. This means it gathers pace more gently below 3000 and then screams to the red line. The 4.0 rover wasn't as rev hungry. That said the Tiv sounded gorgeous, but the chainsaw burble of a 911 isn't too bad either.
Handling: The Griff felt more 'go-kart' like - more like a Caterham perhaps, and the C2 felt a bit more planted. Both felt they would be quite nervous on the limit, but the 964 had optional sports suspension so I dunno how that changes the comparison.
Accommodation/Build: The C2 is much, much better built. End of story. The interior is less curvaceous though, and old fashioned. The pedals are strange too! Porker fans call it character - when you have a rev counter the size of a dinner plate bang in front of you, it is hard to disagree... And of course, you also get 2 small seats in the back of the porsche.
Running costs: Both can be serviced at specialist independents if needed. Dunno how the prices compare parts-wise, but Porsche can be v expensive if you go thru a main dealer. Plenty of breakers around for second hand parts tho', and Germand and Swedish can help for factor bits.
I am thinking of a 964 RS myself, as these have a more Tiv-like go-kart character, or even a 964 turbo, as these are pretty rapid. I would also condsider a 993 C2 as these have a few small improvements over the 964 and look more modern - probably the best air cooled porsche you'll get. If you want Tuscan performance, buy a 993 Twin Turbo (Turbo 4) as these will do 0-60 in 3.8 secs and 0-100 in 9.2. With four wheel drive they would be easy to hustle across country, too. They can be expensive to run, and entry is approx 30k LHD, 45k RHD.
Rgds
Dom
Performance: Okay, it was a weedy Griff, but for my money the C2 felt just as quick. You have a ton of traction off the line cos of the weight over the rear wheels, and the engine is a bit more cammy, with more top end in the C2. This means it gathers pace more gently below 3000 and then screams to the red line. The 4.0 rover wasn't as rev hungry. That said the Tiv sounded gorgeous, but the chainsaw burble of a 911 isn't too bad either.
Handling: The Griff felt more 'go-kart' like - more like a Caterham perhaps, and the C2 felt a bit more planted. Both felt they would be quite nervous on the limit, but the 964 had optional sports suspension so I dunno how that changes the comparison.
Accommodation/Build: The C2 is much, much better built. End of story. The interior is less curvaceous though, and old fashioned. The pedals are strange too! Porker fans call it character - when you have a rev counter the size of a dinner plate bang in front of you, it is hard to disagree... And of course, you also get 2 small seats in the back of the porsche.
Running costs: Both can be serviced at specialist independents if needed. Dunno how the prices compare parts-wise, but Porsche can be v expensive if you go thru a main dealer. Plenty of breakers around for second hand parts tho', and Germand and Swedish can help for factor bits.
I am thinking of a 964 RS myself, as these have a more Tiv-like go-kart character, or even a 964 turbo, as these are pretty rapid. I would also condsider a 993 C2 as these have a few small improvements over the 964 and look more modern - probably the best air cooled porsche you'll get. If you want Tuscan performance, buy a 993 Twin Turbo (Turbo 4) as these will do 0-60 in 3.8 secs and 0-100 in 9.2. With four wheel drive they would be easy to hustle across country, too. They can be expensive to run, and entry is approx 30k LHD, 45k RHD.
Rgds
Dom
The 993 C4s i drove a few weeks ago didn't feel anywhere near as quick as my Esprit V8-GT, but on the other hand, it did feel absolutely glued round corners, and didn't have any of the rattles, bangs and crunching noises you get when you hit a pothole hard in the esprit.
Depends what you're after. The 993 won't be as exhillerating to drive, but as a car you could live with every day, driving in good and bad weather, its a pretty fine machine. This is reflected in the prices people are still willing to pay for 5/6 yr old cars.
Rob.
Depends what you're after. The 993 won't be as exhillerating to drive, but as a car you could live with every day, driving in good and bad weather, its a pretty fine machine. This is reflected in the prices people are still willing to pay for 5/6 yr old cars.
Rob.
Yeah, i have to echo that. Porkers are great cars to live with every day. If you want something special for the weekend, then I'm not too sure. Saying that I love my 993 Turbo. I've not own a TVR but have been a avid follower of this site for years so I get a good impression of the running cost. If you go to a specialist the parts and labour are in fact quite resonable. I'd say its a lot cheaper than running a TVR, as long as its not a dog. And the build quality is very high. Engines will quite happy do 150,000 before a rebuild.
I'm not in the position to have 2 cars, but if I did then I would love to have a tuscan for the weekend and a porker for everyday use.
I'm not in the position to have 2 cars, but if I did then I would love to have a tuscan for the weekend and a porker for everyday use.
I have driven both (Griff 500 and 993 C2). The 993 is the perfect everyday car, it's a bit more refined, controls are also a bit lighter. And you get very good steering feedback. Build quality is super solid too. 911's also have interesting handling. A very fine car IMO. What it lacks compered to a TVR is the brutish acceleration, the first time I tried a 993, I was wondering what the whole supercar thing was all about (it was the first fast car I had driven). It also lacks the excitement a TVR brings you
I test drove a C2 (tiptronic and manual), a C4 and a Boxter S both on the road and at Bedford Autodrome before plumping for the Griff 500. OK, so the Griff isn't as practical, or as useful, or as reliable, or as sensible. But none of the Porsches had 'soul'. They sounded like sewing machines by comparison (admittedly, very, very angry sewing machines). Incidentally, the DB7 Vantage didn't fit a 6'4" frame - no headroom, where the Griff seems positively spacious. Ferrari 360 - same problem, designed by Italians for Italian sized/shaped people.
No, Don, I don't think it's an after-market fitting.....maybe it's the bit at the base of your right shoe that has a hole in it !
Anyone here without a hole in their right shoe please resign immediately; you aren't trying nearly hard enough...
Seriously though the average Tiv is a much quicker car 'off the mark' than the average Porsche, although from what I've read the new Turbo would be hard to beat.
It all depends what you want - the only problem is that I want them all! Took delivery of my new 996 today, and very, very impressed so far. Further reactions when I get to know it.
Anyone here without a hole in their right shoe please resign immediately; you aren't trying nearly hard enough...
Seriously though the average Tiv is a much quicker car 'off the mark' than the average Porsche, although from what I've read the new Turbo would be hard to beat.
It all depends what you want - the only problem is that I want them all! Took delivery of my new 996 today, and very, very impressed so far. Further reactions when I get to know it.
quote:-
Oh I don't know. Try a white-knuckle ride round Thruxton in a Porsche Boxster - they *can* be exciting. More on this later...
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I have driven a boxster round Thruxton. Aboslutely no soul or passion to it after my old chim 4.5. I am considering a 993 c2 and hope that it isnt like a boxster.
Wouldnt recommend the white knuckle from the resident drivers at thruxton. Not all of them are up to much. One of the instructors there blocked me for half a lap - my instructor made me lift off.
Oh I don't know. Try a white-knuckle ride round Thruxton in a Porsche Boxster - they *can* be exciting. More on this later...
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I have driven a boxster round Thruxton. Aboslutely no soul or passion to it after my old chim 4.5. I am considering a 993 c2 and hope that it isnt like a boxster.
Wouldnt recommend the white knuckle from the resident drivers at thruxton. Not all of them are up to much. One of the instructors there blocked me for half a lap - my instructor made me lift off.
Can we knock off the porker verse tiv thing all the time.? Lets not make this forum into one of those. Porkers and tivs are both great cars, aimed at different uses . Porkers are more of an everyday car and tivs are more of a weekend car, but obviously both exel in each others domains depending on the model etc.
Having owned a Cerbera Speed Six and now a 996 with full GT3 bits and pieces.
My take is the TVR is faster in a straight line when the road is dry but the 996 would more than make up for it on the corners and in the wet (not slow in a straight line either)
The TVR was back to Blackpool for 2 of the 4 mths that I owned it...
The 996 starts every morning does not leak, rattle or blow fuses and covers miles like a Merc/BMW.
Both sound great de-catted TVR with sports exhaust, Awesome.......
996 with Sports exhaust, loud enough but quiet when you want it to be.
Both great cars but the TVR had to go as I ended up in my Vauxhall Omega more than the TVR, with the 996 I can use it as an every day car.
My take is the TVR is faster in a straight line when the road is dry but the 996 would more than make up for it on the corners and in the wet (not slow in a straight line either)
The TVR was back to Blackpool for 2 of the 4 mths that I owned it...
The 996 starts every morning does not leak, rattle or blow fuses and covers miles like a Merc/BMW.
Both sound great de-catted TVR with sports exhaust, Awesome.......
996 with Sports exhaust, loud enough but quiet when you want it to be.
Both great cars but the TVR had to go as I ended up in my Vauxhall Omega more than the TVR, with the 996 I can use it as an every day car.
quote:
Yes, and I want one of each, please!
Me too ! I run a 993 C4. The comparison between the 993 and any TVR is not terribly valid, the TVR Griffith is a track day/blast in the countryside car with epic performance, a staggering exhaust note and great looks whereas my 993 has to perform roles arguably more suited to a Golf, but does them admirably. I couldn't use a TVR for my regular slogs from Derbys. to Scotland, get out and present to a sales conference. I'd get out hot and knackered
whereas the Porker did just that effortlessly this morning with very little wind noise, excellent aircon and a secure, dry boot for my PC.
Both cars can be total animals but the Porker will only really show its dark side on a racetrack, not on the way to Tesco!
Both sides of the TVR/Porsche argument always seem blinkered to the merits of the opposite camp's cars, I can only suggest taking one out for a drive you might be surprised ?
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