Spare 4.2 engine?

[robsco]

I wish you the best of luck with it. Your input to the Cerbera forum has been invaluable over the years I think we would all agree. We’ve all been in difficult situations with TVRs over the years - it’s never an easy ride. Don’t let emotion taken over and take some time to cool off before you make any definitive decisions would be my only advice. Fingers crossed for you!

[Caddyshack]

Byker28i said:

Nope, the engine was taken out and sent off, so it's still got to be put back in, ancillaries swapped over. My engine had work on the inlets, act exhaust manifolds, brand new starter, coils, everything new in the last year really bar the internals

Where are you based? If local a few of us off here could all put in a few hours to get an ls3 in there, I don't mind welding up a few bits and spinning a few spanners? I am Surrey / Hants

[Chimp871]

you'll have to forgive me here and I'm not being rude.... but nothing has catastrophically broken and crucially your crankshaft is in one piece.

The heads need to come off but valve guides, valve seating, oil seals, head skim and the like don't have to be done by a TVR outfit, plenty of rebore companies out there, as long as they're FER (federation of engine re-manufacturers) I'd use them as I did for my Chimaera 450 heads (yes I know its just a RV8 lump ) but this part isn't the toughest of jobs .... hope you see where I'm going with this. This is one company who I used https://www.phoenixrebore.co.uk/

I'd get the heads off and then review. A leakdown test would be interesting to pin-point where the issues are but you never know once your heads are re-done it may not be a disaster and a lot cheaper than first thought. The bottom end is basically new main journals and the big decision to move from 2.25" cast crank to 2.5" forged crank, for me this is where I'd spend the money.

Wish you all the luck with it (from a fellow AJP 4.2 owner - original small journal crankshaft)

[ukkid35]

I know it's a relatively small saving, but you could delay replacing the camshafts and buckets until the next valve re-shim, with no additional risk, and without significant additional cost (there would be a need to redo cam timing)

Good luck

[TwinKam]

Every sympathy for you, but to find something positive in all of this, you caught it just in time; if the shells were down to the copper and a valve guide was loose, it could have all let go in spectacular style in the overtaking lane of the M4 at 100+ mph. At least 'all' it needs atm is a 'refresh'.... if you're prepared to live with the original crank.

[Adambul]

Out of interest do we know when the small journal cranks were replaced? Mine is a March 97 4.2 and I've no idea which crank has been installed.
For my money i'd stick with the original crank, new shells and a polish will reduce the risk of it breaking and its lasted this long with no issues. Re-fresh the top end and if money is really tight as UKidd said delay the camshafts for another couple of years as they are easily done by an enthusiast DIY mechanic at home over a winter or when funds allow.

[TwinKam]

My 4.2 is a Jan '98 and it has the small bearing crank, Adam.
Rik

[Adambul]

TwinKam said:

My 4.2 is a Jan '98 and it has the small bearing crank, Adam.
Rik

Thanks Rik, that's my engine anxieties increased then :-)

[Caddyshack]

Adambul said:

Thanks Rik, that's my engine anxieties increased then :-)

When engines go pop they do you a favour and make you buy or build a better one.

[TwinKam]

My engine went pop (well not literally, but I had to strip it because the pump shaft failed) and I've rebuilt it with the original small bearing crank.
Time will tell whether that was wise or not, but at the time I took comfort from the testimonies of owners of small crank engines still running after 20 years.

[Chimp871]

It has to be overplayed the smaller journal crank problem. As I understand it it was a combination of the crank not balanced and a suspect batch (but I stand to be corrected). Some failed yes but the vast majority haven't.

Its a bit like the porsche 996 IMS bearing problem. It allegedly affect 10% of cars but 99% of the owners all felt doomed.

[Jhonno]

Chimp871 said:

It has to be overplayed the smaller journal crank problem. As I understand it it was a combination of the crank not balanced and a suspect batch (but I stand to be corrected). Some failed yes but the vast majority haven't.

Its a bit like the porsche 996 IMS bearing problem. It allegedly affect 10% of cars but 99% of the owners all felt doomed.

I think it is.. There was an earlier batch that were the biggest issue, with a lack of counterweight! Plenty of small journal cranks out there fine.

[CanoeSniffer]

Sorry to hear of your woes Dave, I hope a viable solution presents itself to you. I'm only up the road from yourself so give me a shout if there's anything I can do to be of help.

[Byker28i]

Jhonno said:

Chimp871 said:

It has to be overplayed the smaller journal crank problem. As I understand it it was a combination of the crank not balanced and a suspect batch (but I stand to be corrected). Some failed yes but the vast majority haven't.

Its a bit like the porsche 996 IMS bearing problem. It allegedly affect 10% of cars but 99% of the owners all felt doomed.

I think it is.. There was an earlier batch that were the biggest issue, with a lack of counterweight! Plenty of small journal cranks out there fine.

I've not had issues with mine and it's been well used in my ownership. Trackdays until the rebuild, Fighting Torque twice, it was happy chasing a McLaren P1 at Spa last year
My car was sold in May 1997 so the engine is earlier that that.

So I had £5k put aside as a contingency of an engine rebuild required. Looks like it will need twice that now. I can see the attraction of LS3 engines now. A good modern engine with a power upgrade

[Jhonno]

Byker28i said:

I've not had issues with mine and it's been well used in my ownership. Trackdays until the rebuild, Fighting Torque twice, it was happy chasing a McLaren P1 at Spa last year
My car was sold in May 1997 so the engine is earlier that that.

So I had £5k put aside as a contingency of an engine rebuild required. Looks like it will need twice that now. I can see the attraction of LS3 engines now. A good modern engine with a power upgrade

Have you spoken to Andy @APM? (I did send you an e-mail through here with his details..)

Nothing against LS engines, but AJP FTW!

[nawarne]

Jhonno said:

Byker28i said:

I've not had issues with mine and it's been well used in my ownership. Trackdays until the rebuild, Fighting Torque twice, it was happy chasing a McLaren P1 at Spa last year
My car was sold in May 1997 so the engine is earlier that that.

So I had £5k put aside as a contingency of an engine rebuild required. Looks like it will need twice that now. I can see the attraction of LS3 engines now. A good modern engine with a power upgrade

Have you spoken to Andy @APM? (I did send you an e-mail through here with his details..)

Nothing against LS engines, but AJP FTW!

Andy Mac is the guru for AJP V8 engines - seen him several times trackside spannering for the Tuscan Racer boys back in the day.

Hope you get a good outcome from all of the advice!

Nick

[nawarne]

spitfire4v8 said:

Putting aside the "its not a cerbera" arguement for a second .. that vid is great. Fezza owner must have been gutted.

Jules, yep, gutted was an understatement!

Cerb owner was a bit disbelieving too - until he did the arithmetic and worked out that the Cerbera had a better power/weight ratio than the Ferrari - so made sense then.

Nick

[Byker28i]

nawarne said:

Jhonno said:

Byker28i said:

I've not had issues with mine and it's been well used in my ownership. Trackdays until the rebuild, Fighting Torque twice, it was happy chasing a McLaren P1 at Spa last year
My car was sold in May 1997 so the engine is earlier that that.

So I had £5k put aside as a contingency of an engine rebuild required. Looks like it will need twice that now. I can see the attraction of LS3 engines now. A good modern engine with a power upgrade

Have you spoken to Andy @APM? (I did send you an e-mail through here with his details..)

Nothing against LS engines, but AJP FTW!

Andy Mac is the guru for AJP V8 engines - seen him several times trackside spannering for the Tuscan Racer boys back in the day.

Hope you get a good outcome from all of the advice!

Nick

What can I say. I've been a regular customer of Neil Garners and so I've had little contact with other independents especially those mentioned, yet I've reached out to as many as I could think of and have received many positive replies, even though I've never given them business. At the same time Neils staff have been very helpful in seeking solutions also.

I've had suggestions of others to contact, offers of some parts if they weren't available, even just good vibes from those who couldn't help.

It's an amazing community, not just from the owners but from the independants and suppliers as well

[900T-R]

Byker28i said:

I can see the attraction of LS3 engines now. A good modern engine with a power upgrade

I still don't see it. Done the numbers for our Tuscan project and it sure doesn't look like one could ever recoup the initial cost of a conversion (which would for 2 full engine rebuilds, granted, servicing will be cheaper but it's once a year for the vast majority of us anyway) unless you did mega mileages. And you have to be pretty damn sure the engine will work within damn near the operation parameters in your tight GRP engine bay as it would in the cars the engine weas designed for in the first place as in typical mass market fashion the parts aren't vastly overspecified. In the end it's a cast piston, wet sump engine and in one or two converted cars the engine has let go in spectacular fashion.

[Byker28i]

One suggests £16-18K for a drive in drive out conversion, thats new exhaust, ecu, gearbox, engine, wiring, ancilleries etc but I bet thats the base 430bhp engine
Easy to get into product creep if you've deep pockets. 525bhp, 6 speed box...

http://www.partsworldperformance.com/v8-performanc...

I'm looking at £12-£15k to rebuild my early engine - drive in/drive out, vat etc (theres still some unknowns) and thats done around 60K miles, regular servicing, oil changes. Ok at my 4-5k a year thats a lot of years yet but even so..

I just quite bring myself to change my Cerbera engine but I've a lot more understanding now on those that have.