Engines everyone assumes are weak but actually arnt.

Engines everyone assumes are weak but actually arnt.

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Discussion

turbotoaster

Original Poster:

645 posts

171 months

Sunday 21st May 2017
quotequote all
Over the years there has been many engines that as soon as you mention, people instantly get an opinion on it and mention its 'well known' weakness.

For example:

The rotary engine.....as soon as you turn the boost above 1bar it will spit its apex seals out

Ive heard a few times that people have cracked a certain V8 block when upping the power.

The rover k series will blow a headgasket or crack a liner at the first sign of power.

Renault 5 turbo engine will melt a piston or pop a headgasket for fun


Yet to counter that you do some research and find examples of engines doing pretty big power without the issues mentioned.

For example the rotary engine until very recently has been making big power using all factory components as there wasnt a manufacturer prepared to make new stronger parts, yet these little 1.3 engines have been making over 1000bhp on 40psi+ of boost

The rover k series in my car has been run up to 27psi of boost and made 382bhp, in which i ran out of fuel and turbo, thats all stock bottom end components.

The renault 5 engine now that people have access to widebands and efi so can be tuned properly are going from 115bhp to over 300bhp and 30psi+ of boost all on stock components


So I wonder what other engines out there do people instantly state are rubbish but are actually pretty strong when tuned properly.

It would be great to get other peoples opinion and results.

anonymous-user

53 months

Sunday 21st May 2017
quotequote all
It's all about probability, not absolutes.


A k series is more likely to shat its head gasket than say a 1.8 duratec

A rotary turbo is more likely to pop a seal than say a 2.0 cossie turbo

A blown rover V8 is more likely to have it's valve train fall apart than say a blown OHC V8


etc etc

You might get lucky, you might not,but generally these reputations are well earned. (and if you think you're getting 300 bhp out of a stock internals R5 turbo, you're very much mistaken!!)

GreenV8S

30,152 posts

283 months

Sunday 21st May 2017
quotequote all
turbotoaster said:
Over the years there has been many engines that as soon as you mention, people instantly get an opinion on it and mention its 'well known' weakness.
You seem to be making the assumption that these commonly held opinions are unfounded. On the contrary - the issues you listed are well known and definitely do affect the reliability of these engines. Even if you are able to find examples of engines that haven't suffered these failures, that doesn't negate the fact that these are well known weaknesses.

Bennachie

1,090 posts

150 months

Sunday 21st May 2017
quotequote all
Chrysler Imps.

998 and a wills ring head = wow!





Ah, hell. Am I really that old.?...............................





yep.

227bhp

10,203 posts

127 months

Tuesday 23rd May 2017
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It's often on a scale of cost to make something work better, but some engines are just beyond that though and will never make large amounts of power, or maybe could if huge amounts of money are ploughed into them.
Some just need the odd mod here and there.....

To make a particular engine make a lot more power than it was originally intended takes a lot of patience, knowledge, time and money.

PhillipM

6,515 posts

188 months

Friday 2nd June 2017
quotequote all
Gotta agree with one thing with the OP here, a k-series doesn't try to spit it's headgasket out at the first sign of power, it only tries to do it any time it's got fuel going through it.

DVandrews

1,315 posts

282 months

Friday 2nd June 2017
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PhillipM said:
Gotta agree with one thing with the OP here, a k-series doesn't try to spit it's headgasket out at the first sign of power, it only tries to do it any time it's got fuel going through it.
Mmm.. I've upgraded over 700 K series engines, 90% involve a head upgrade/swap. These have had power outputs up to 286BHP. Over the course of these works I have had around 10 HGFs.

Go figure.

Dave

PhillipM

6,515 posts

188 months

Monday 5th June 2017
quotequote all
And yet I've done 6-7 headgaskets just for friends and family on them out of maybe a dozen or so K-series cars. Turns out situation evidence is situational, who knew?

caelite

4,273 posts

111 months

Monday 5th June 2017
quotequote all
Literally any Rover engine. I had a V6 MG and people still quoted the headgasket fault too me every time I mentioned it... KV6 was fine, except from its inlet valve problems... and rust biggrin

DVandrews

1,315 posts

282 months

Tuesday 6th June 2017
quotequote all
PhillipM said:
And yet I've done 6-7 headgaskets just for friends and family on them out of maybe a dozen or so K-series cars. Turns out situation evidence is situational, who knew?
Proper preparation of the surfaces is the key to gasket longevity, the factory methodology was hit and miss.

Dave

andyf1140

54 posts

109 months

Tuesday 6th June 2017
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DVandrews said:
Proper preparation of the surfaces is the key to gasket longevity, the factory methodology was hit and miss.

Dave
Sounds like the same story as with the Stag V8, the design was fine it was the assembly methods/quality that was poor and lead to overheating.

PhillipM

6,515 posts

188 months

Wednesday 7th June 2017
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Unfortunately most people don't buy a car from the factory then immediately strip the engine to re-grind the mating surfaces.

C Lee Farquar

4,066 posts

215 months

Wednesday 7th June 2017
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PhillipM said:
Unfortunately most people don't buy a car from the factory then immediately strip the engine to re-grind the mating surfaces.
Slackers! hehe

MXRod

2,731 posts

146 months

Wednesday 7th June 2017
quotequote all
Bennachie said:
Chrysler Imps.

998 and a wills ring head = wow!





Ah, hell. Am I really that old.?...............................





yep.
Hillman Imp

Frankthered

1,619 posts

179 months

Thursday 15th June 2017
quotequote all
MXRod said:
Bennachie said:
Chrysler Imps.

998 and a wills ring head = wow!





Ah, hell. Am I really that old.?...............................





yep.
Hillman Imp
Quite! You can't be that old if you think of them as Chrysler Imps! hehe

Bennachie

1,090 posts

150 months

Thursday 15th June 2017
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I actually had a Hillman Imp and Singer Chamois. The last 'Chrysler Imps' had the Sport engine in all but name; with a single carb..... and standard exhaust, instead of the twin Strombergs and tubular extractor..........

I really liked those engines....

MXRod

2,731 posts

146 months

Friday 16th June 2017
quotequote all
Bennachie said:
I actually had a Hillman Imp and Singer Chamois. The last 'Chrysler Imps' had the Sport engine in all but name; with a single carb..... and standard exhaust, instead of the twin Strombergs and tubular extractor..........

I really liked those engines....
Derived from a fire pump engine by Coventry Climax

battered

4,088 posts

146 months

Friday 16th June 2017
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DVA is the man who knows about the K. I've only done one HG. My take is that *as originally manufactured* they were crap and basically all failed. Then when rebuilt with steel dowels, modified hg, deck prepared, liner heights correct, they were as good as anything else. Bottom ends appear bulletproof, valvegear and cams solid, the only other snag is standard pistons won't last long over 7500 rpm. Hovever if used normally with only occasional visits to the limiter they will last 100k miles plus. On the second hg, natch.

Boosted LS1

21,167 posts

259 months

Friday 16th June 2017
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Ah, the Coventry Climax. Now when I were a young lad .....

Frankthered

1,619 posts

179 months

Friday 16th June 2017
quotequote all
Bennachie said:
I actually had a Hillman Imp and Singer Chamois. The last 'Chrysler Imps' had the Sport engine in all but name; with a single carb..... and standard exhaust, instead of the twin Strombergs and tubular extractor..........

I really liked those engines....
thumbup

Fair dos! I've always liked the idea of an Imp, or one of the other versions, quite like the engines too - if only the heads didn't warp!

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