Ethanol/E85

[minime68]

So I was thinking of maybe making a trip up to Santa Pod early next year to see how the new setup works at the drag strip. After looking at ethanol prices in the UK, I may have to re-think that. ~100GBP for 25 litres? Holy Crap!!! I drive 40 minutes to pick up in France and it is .79 euro cents per litre. I'm guessing that's why no one runs it there.

[ARAF]

minime68 said:

So I was thinking of maybe making a trip up to Santa Pod early next year to see how the new setup works at the drag strip. After looking at ethanol prices in the UK, I may have to re-think that. ~100GBP for 25 litres? Holy Crap!!! I drive 40 minutes to pick up in France and it is .79 euro cents per litre. I'm guessing that's why no one runs it there.

Some do. Fastbikes76 always used it in his Jap cars, so hopefully he will see this and let you know how much he pays.

[liner33]

The E85 sold at the pod is a race fuel derived from bio ethanol , if you just want E85 you can buy it here and it will probably be the same as you can buy from the pump

http://www.ekofuel.org/bioethanol-fuel-for-firepla...

Consistency is so variable and the fuel goes off so quickly I think E85 is much more trouble than its worth

[minime68]

liner33 said:

The E85 sold at the pod is a race fuel derived from bio ethanol , if you just want E85 you can buy it here and it will probably be the same as you can buy from the pump

http://www.ekofuel.org/bioethanol-fuel-for-firepla...

Consistency is so variable and the fuel goes off so quickly I think E85 is much more trouble than its worth

Much cheaper but still relatively expensive. Yea I would just mixed it with some petrol. I didn't see much gains past E60 content. Smells soooooo good out the exhaust

[stevieturbo]

minime68 said:

So I was thinking of maybe making a trip up to Santa Pod early next year to see how the new setup works at the drag strip. After looking at ethanol prices in the UK, I may have to re-think that. ~100GBP for 25 litres? Holy Crap!!! I drive 40 minutes to pick up in France and it is .79 euro cents per litre. I'm guessing that's why no one runs it there.

E85 of any kind is not available at the pump in the UK...so certainly do not be reliant on finding it !!
And TBH when I read the US forums....between it clogging filters, lines, injectors etc etc and then poor consistency of quality, I'm almost baffled why people put up with it.

[minime68]

stevieturbo said:

E85 of any kind is not available at the pump in the UK...so certainly do not be reliant on finding it !!
And TBH when I read the US forums....between it clogging filters, lines, injectors etc etc and then poor consistency of quality, I'm almost baffled why people put up with it.

You have a point there as well...but I think a lot of issues could be avoided by using the right components. I haven't had any issues but I do run injectors and lines made specifically to handle the fuel. That includes the filters and pumps. I'm sure by now you have ridden in a flex fuel car to see the differences first hand. It is night and day for me. Probably over 200hp on the table by just making a stop at the pump. Well worth it!

[stevieturbo]

minime68 said:

You have a point there as well...but I think a lot of issues could be avoided by using the right components. I haven't had any issues but I do run injectors and lines made specifically to handle the fuel. That includes the filters and pumps. I'm sure by now you have ridden in a flex fuel car to see the differences first hand. It is night and day for me. Probably over 200hp on the table by just making a stop at the pump. Well worth it!

Never have....there's absolutely no E85 here either.

I can make more power than traction on pump fuel anyway, so whilst a fancy fuel may have its uses, it's totally impractical for me.

And on pump+meth I was faster than almost all of the GTR's using race E85 at TOTB over the 1km lol. And I'm only starting to get grip at the 1/4 to try and hit a decent speed.

As much as I know fancy fuels can yield benefits, for me if they are not readily available anywhere and sensibly priced, they just dont make any sense. Hell, even pump fuel is too bloody expensive !...or should say too heavily taxed, the fuel itself is a bloody bargain.

Race fuel and ethanol should also be bloody cheap as there should be none of that extortion hacked onto the price as neither are aimed at road vehicles. Sadly neither are.

[minime68]

stevieturbo said:

Never have....there's absolutely no E85 here either.

I can make more power than traction on pump fuel anyway, so whilst a fancy fuel may have its uses, it's totally impractical for me.

And on pump+meth I was faster than almost all of the GTR's using race E85 at TOTB over the 1km lol. And I'm only starting to get grip at the 1/4 to try and hit a decent speed.

As much as I know fancy fuels can yield benefits, for me if they are not readily available anywhere and sensibly priced, they just dont make any sense. Hell, even pump fuel is too bloody expensive !...or should say too heavily taxed, the fuel itself is a bloody bargain.

Race fuel and ethanol should also be bloody cheap as there should be none of that extortion hacked onto the price as neither are aimed at road vehicles. Sadly neither are.

Absolutely.....I would never run it if I lived in the UK. Maybe on a race day or something. I drive around on pump + meth but on ethanol, the car is a different animal. Hooks surprisingly well with a 305/30/19 R compound tire. UK gets the shaft when it come to petrol prices compared to mainland Europe.

[stevieturbo]

minime68 said:

Absolutely.....I would never run it if I lived in the UK. Maybe on a race day or something. I drive around on pump + meth but on ethanol, the car is a different animal. Hooks surprisingly well with a 305/30/19 R compound tire. UK gets the shaft when it come to petrol prices compared to mainland Europe.

Interesting to hear it really is of benefit. I'm always dubious when I see others use race fuel....and go much slower than cars I've worked on that run on pump fuel.
I can never understand that TBH.

[fastbikes76]

ARAF said:

Some do. Fastbikes76 always used it in his Jap cars, so hopefully he will see this and let you know how much he pays.

I use Methanol instead of E85. Methanol is £0.70 a liter and readily available from Jennychem with free delivery. I order 210L drums at a time and have just ordered my 10th drum in 4 years

I don't run an injection kit, I run it straight in the fuel tank in a 20% ratio (5l meth and 20L pump) and the results for me are night and day. I run a high compression turbo engine and make FAR more power than any of the other guys on pump and low comp Turbo lumps with the same setups. The best thing is you need nothing at all to run it apart from the extra head room in your injectors to be able to add roughly 12-15% extra overall fuel into the map. Other than that due to pre mixing it you cant mess up. There are no pumps to fail, no meth tanks to run out no air locks to deal with or any other injection kit associated issues. If I'm out of meth, its because I'm out of petrol too

Depending on how rich the stock VXR8 map is you could probably throw 10% mix in without touching anything. The stock 3000GT Mitsubishi map is pretty rich at mid 10's on WOT. Throwing 10% meth in without touching a thing or altering the map makes the car run closer to mid 11's AFR and adds a fair chunk of power while staying safe due to the Meths cooling and increased octain properties.

I cannot recommend it enough ! 2 of us have run meth for 4 years solid now on stock fuel systems and never had a single failure like the gloopy E85 injectors etc.

Happy to answer any questions if you have.

[HappyMidget]

Good info fb

[minime68]

fastbikes76 said:

I use Methanol instead of E85. Methanol is £0.70 a liter and readily available from Jennychem with free delivery. I order 210L drums at a time and have just ordered my 10th drum in 4 years

I don't run an injection kit, I run it straight in the fuel tank in a 20% ratio (5l meth and 20L pump) and the results for me are night and day. I run a high compression turbo engine and make FAR more power than any of the other guys on pump and low comp Turbo lumps with the same setups. The best thing is you need nothing at all to run it apart from the extra head room in your injectors to be able to add roughly 12-15% extra overall fuel into the map. Other than that due to pre mixing it you cant mess up. There are no pumps to fail, no meth tanks to run out no air locks to deal with or any other injection kit associated issues. If I'm out of meth, its because I'm out of petrol too

Depending on how rich the stock VXR8 map is you could probably throw 10% mix in without touching anything. The stock 3000GT Mitsubishi map is pretty rich at mid 10's on WOT. Throwing 10% meth in without touching a thing or altering the map makes the car run closer to mid 11's AFR and adds a fair chunk of power while staying safe due to the Meths cooling and increased octain properties.

I cannot recommend it enough ! 2 of us have run meth for 4 years solid now on stock fuel systems and never had a single failure like the gloopy E85 injectors etc.

Happy to answer any questions if you have.

Hmmmmm. I've never looked into this actually. I do run a meth nozzle even when on the ethanol. Here it is the opposite...I pay 90 euros for 30 litres of meth. You need some sort of business license to get a hold of it.

[fastbikes76]

HappyMidget said:

Good info fb

No problem, happy to help where I Can.

minime68 said:

Hmmmmm. I've never looked into this actually. I do run a meth nozzle even when on the ethanol. Here it is the opposite...I pay 90 euros for 30 litres of meth. You need some sort of business license to get a hold of it.

Ah that's a shame, for us its very easy to get hold of and I get 210L deliveries which last me 2-3 months. Its also MUCH cheaper than V power which just adds the cherry on top. I run M20 (20% meth) all year round and not just for track days, It also has super cleaning properties so the last engine we stripped after bending a conrod from Torque was as clean as whistle. 100% methanol is corrosive and everyone will say so when mentioning running intake meth, however at 20% dilution there is zero corrosion in our fuel systems even on stock rubber fuel lines, ali fuel rails and ali plenums. Another chap has run it for 7 years solid now and is the guy who put me onto it.

[HappyMidget]

Hmmmm, tempting... http://www.jennychem.com/shop/methanol/803-205-lt-...

[HappyMidget]

Only 45p/l http://www.jennychem.com/shop/methanol/984-205-lt-...

Think the wife would kill me if I got that though

[MyM8V8]

fastbikes76 said:

I use Methanol instead of E85. Methanol is £0.70 a liter and readily available from Jennychem with free delivery. I order 210L drums at a time and have just ordered my 10th drum in 4 years

I don't run an injection kit, I run it straight in the fuel tank in a 20% ratio (5l meth and 20L pump) and the results for me are night and day. I run a high compression turbo engine and make FAR more power than any of the other guys on pump and low comp Turbo lumps with the same setups. The best thing is you need nothing at all to run it apart from the extra head room in your injectors to be able to add roughly 12-15% extra overall fuel into the map. Other than that due to pre mixing it you cant mess up. There are no pumps to fail, no meth tanks to run out no air locks to deal with or any other injection kit associated issues. If I'm out of meth, its because I'm out of petrol too

Depending on how rich the stock VXR8 map is you could probably throw 10% mix in without touching anything. The stock 3000GT Mitsubishi map is pretty rich at mid 10's on WOT. Throwing 10% meth in without touching a thing or altering the map makes the car run closer to mid 11's AFR and adds a fair chunk of power while staying safe due to the Meths cooling and increased octain properties.

I cannot recommend it enough ! 2 of us have run meth for 4 years solid now on stock fuel systems and never had a single failure like the gloopy E85 injectors etc.

Happy to answer any questions if you have.

Yeah, I have one. How do you stop the Methanol from eating the fuel system on the car?

[monkfish1]

MyM8V8 said:

Yeah, I have one. How do you stop the Methanol from eating the fuel system on the car?

Gates Barricade fuel hose.

[fastbikes76]

Neat methanol is VERY corrosive and will eat away at aluminium pretty quick. In the 20% ratios I mix it there are zero issues with corrosion. I'm still on stock rubber fuel lines, and everything fuel system wise is as it left the factory apart from bigger pump and bigger injectors. I have recently removed injectors and they are still as the day they went in , my stock Ali fuel rails are still like brand new with no hint of corrosion.

I have run over a 1000 Liters of methanol alone through my car now and apart from the lovely smell on WOT there is no telling. 4 years trouble free so far on my car and 7 years on the chap who recommended this route to me .

[fastbikes76]

HappyMidget said:

Only 45p/l http://www.jennychem.com/shop/methanol/984-205-lt-...

Think the wife would kill me if I got that though

Sadly I don't have the space for a 1000L IBC or I would buy that instead, at the rate I go through it the savings are huge !

[HappyMidget]

fastbikes76 said:

Sadly I don't have the space for a 1000L IBC or I would buy that instead, at the rate I go through it the savings are huge !

Still trying to work out where I could put a barrel TBH! Wonder if she would notice me burying the IBC in the drive