Luis Sola

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Discussion

wormus

Original Poster:

11,640 posts

159 months

Sunday 31st May
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Mezzell said:
I’ve since spoken to Carl Herkes and he’s quoting a similar figure but wants the car for a week!!!
To be fair, that sounds quite normal and Wortec did the same with mine. They need to get it to run right on the road so it doesn't want to stall at junctions, starts and idles from cold etc. Only way to do that is drive the car about for a few days, the dyno bit is just to finish it off at the top end. As I said before, Carl will want to map the car from scratch so I think a week is normal. I'm not sure how you can map a car from scratch on a dyno in a day.

SturdyHSV

7,027 posts

123 months

Monday 1st June
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As above, to actually map a car to be decently driveable isn't just a dyno job.

The bit at the end where you check fuelling and twiddle the timing a bit on the dyno is the easy bit and doesn't take long at all really.

The driveability takes a lot of time and driving in various road conditions, tweaking and refining etc.

As I have EFI Live and am used to using it to log etc. I basically did this part of the map, logging the data (including wideband) and sending the logs to Luis along with my notes of what occured in each of the short logs.

He'd then send me back a tweaked map to flash on and the process repeated until I was happy with it. I haven't even done a dyno day yet, Luis is happy to do this whenever and also any ongoing tweaks if I find issues in the future.

Excellent service as far as I was concerned. I never had a Wortec map so can't offer any comparisons in that regard.

stevieturbo

14,880 posts

203 months

Monday 1st June
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Let's face it, OEM ecu's are never mapped from scratch, as GM has already done most of the hard work for you.


selondonman

68 posts

163 months

Tuesday 9th June
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how can a remap be so expensive ? if many of these remaps have been done ... unless you have very bespoke mods .. the remap must be very close to the most of the other 70 he has done

H5V VE

591 posts

159 months

Tuesday 9th June
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Lets put it another way

How much (roughly) do you think that you should pay and what would you expect to get for the money?

Superchips and the like charge £400/500 for a standardised chip that is not tuned to your car or mods?

And how many of our cars are actually identical in spec? There are so many slight tweaks and variants, not to mention the effects of wear and tear on what are oldish cars now - I think that you would struggle to get a one size fits all tune. WP, Monkfish (as was), Luis, none of them offered that. I suspect that there its a reason why that is.

selondonman

68 posts

163 months

Tuesday 9th June
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i assumed a remap would take a few hours max to achieve.. with the work done on a laptop and no change of parts


i would have assumed it would have cost max £500

mfp4073

1,603 posts

130 months

Tuesday 9th June
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selondonman said:
i assumed a remap would take a few hours max to achieve.. with the work done on a laptop and no change of parts


i would have assumed it would have cost max £500
Quite a few years ago I paid just over £800.00 for MF to remap my 05 CV8 with a Wortec tune.
A lot of cash but the car has never missed a beat since.
I think 04 CV8 Monaro's were about £500.00, but that would have been a good 12+ years ago.

stevieturbo

14,880 posts

203 months

Tuesday 9th June
quotequote all
selondonman said:
how can a remap be so expensive ? if many of these remaps have been done ... unless you have very bespoke mods .. the remap must be very close to the most of the other 70 he has done
Time is not free, the software is not free, the knowledge, ability and experience to do it right are not free ( sadly those without those three things also charge money too though ).

But yes, many vehicles can be very similar, and potentially those could take much less time. Others may not, or may have issues along the way.

slimtater

1,032 posts

126 months

Tuesday 9th June
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selondonman said:
how can a remap be so expensive ? if many of these remaps have been done ... unless you have very bespoke mods .. the remap must be very close to the most of the other 70 he has done
I have the original Picador receipt for mine having a re-map and sports exhaust (both Wortec), along with a Rip Shift at 1478 miles in December 2005. It was £2100 which according to inflation is about £3150 now. I suspect just over half the cost was the parts so still a fair bit for labour/mapping costs, even for a generic map.

However my point is that the only mods that I have had since that original exhaust/map is a K&N element, yet the LS/MWP bespoke map has made further power, torque and drive-ability improvements. You get what you are prepared to pay for I suppose.

Mezzell

107 posts

11 months

Tuesday 9th June
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I had a telephone call with Carl Herkes today. He wants £1100 plus fuel and £160 for a day on the dyno to map my modified ‘04 cv8. At first I thought this was a bit much but since speaking to him I kind of get why.......
I will drop the car to him, at his home on a Sunday. He will then use the car to get to work and back (about 4 miles) logging it during ‘real world’ everyday driving. He will then send the logs to Luis Sola who will then send him a map to flash onto the car at the end of the day for the drive home. This will go on for 3 days. On the 4th day he’ll take it on a 60 mile round trip to finalise a lot of the info gained during the week and do some final tweaks. On the fifth day the car will go on a dyno and have the WOT work done to maximise the power output.
Once it’s finished it should not only have more power, but be better to drive and hopefully do more than 12mpg!!!
If I’m not happy with it, he will flash the original map on it and I’ll be on my way.
I really don’t think you can say fairer than that.
My car will be going to him in the next couple of months so once it’s done I’ll report back. Have to say that I’m quite excited to see what difference can be made.

stevieturbo

14,880 posts

203 months

Wednesday 10th June
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That's one thing about remote mapping.

It is more labour intensive, requires people at both ends and in this case is not helped by the time differences.

But if it gives a better result that those locally trying to map....it could well be worth it.

wormus

Original Poster:

11,640 posts

159 months

Wednesday 10th June
quotequote all
stevieturbo said:
That's one thing about remote mapping.

It is more labour intensive, requires people at both ends and in this case is not helped by the time differences.

But if it gives a better result that those locally trying to map....it could well be worth it.
I’d contest that, depends how you define “better”. Mine certainly starts, idles and drives perfectly. Still makes decent power too.

Mezzell

107 posts

11 months

Wednesday 10th June
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wormus said:
I’d contest that, depends how you define “better”. Mine certainly starts, idles and drives perfectly. Still makes decent power too.
Don’t get me wrong. My car starts, idles (cold and hot) and drives very well. I’m not in any position to say that one map is or will be better than another. But, like I’ve said before, with the mods I’ve got I’d expect more power than I currently have and, although I obviously didn’t buy the car for its green credentials, I would also like to see my average fuel consumption above 12mpg!!
Carl has explained to me that depending how deep you delve can make big differences. He started mentioning fuel trims and various other things that went right over my head!
I know it’s a fair bit of money but to say that he won’t charge me if I don’t see a noticeable difference gives me confidence.
As I’ve changed no parts at all and currently have a Wortec map, I’ll be able to give you an honest opinion as to whether or not I feel that the difference is worth the money or not.

wormus

Original Poster:

11,640 posts

159 months

Wednesday 10th June
quotequote all
Mezzell said:
Don’t get me wrong. My car starts, idles (cold and hot) and drives very well. I’m not in any position to say that one map is or will be better than another. But, like I’ve said before, with the mods I’ve got I’d expect more power than I currently have and, although I obviously didn’t buy the car for its green credentials, I would also like to see my average fuel consumption above 12mpg!!
Carl has explained to me that depending how deep you delve can make big differences. He started mentioning fuel trims and various other things that went right over my head!
I know it’s a fair bit of money but to say that he won’t charge me if I don’t see a noticeable difference gives me confidence.
As I’ve changed no parts at all and currently have a Wortec map, I’ll be able to give you an honest opinion as to whether or not I feel that the difference is worth the money or not.
Sounds like something is wrong if you are only seeing 12mpg. If it’s a Wortec map (as is mine), it will be tuned with HPT, path of least resistance would be to call Paul Spinks, the guy who tuned it and ask his opinion. I’ve found him honest and willing to answer questions. He also tuned all the Monkfish cars. PM me if you want his number.

Lincsls1

1,450 posts

96 months

Wednesday 10th June
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Yeah, the poor fuel consumption suggests there is something amiss, it could also account for some power loss too.

Mezzell

107 posts

11 months

Wednesday 10th June
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Lincsls1 said:
Yeah, the poor fuel consumption suggests there is something amiss, it could also account for some power loss too.
Agreed. Maybe over fuelling is what came to my mind as when you follow the car down the road it absolutely stinks too. This is what brings me back to mapping..........

Lincsls1

1,450 posts

96 months

Wednesday 10th June
quotequote all
Mezzell said:
Agreed. Maybe over fuelling is what came to my mind as when you follow the car down the road it absolutely stinks too. This is what brings me back to mapping..........
Forgive if I'm wrong, maybe getting a bit muddled. Is your car the black CV8 bought quite recently from off another forum user via eBay? If so, I seem to remember it being advertised with all sorts of pretty sweet goodies and boasting nearly 500bhp (fly) which if I remember the spec of cam, heads and intake seemed perfectly possible.
Point being, the map won't have suddenly changed, and surely if its over fuelling that badly it would have failed its MOT.
Maybe you have a duff o2 sensor or something, just might be worth a little investigation before spending so much on a fresh map?
I'm probably way off.laughgetmecoat

Janosh

1,548 posts

123 months

Wednesday 10th June
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I’ve had mine redone by Luis and have spent more than I should have on the car in the last 12 months but it now runs better than ever and I’m a happy owner. Without Carl (and Luis) I would have probably given up on HSV.

People seem happy to spend £1k+ on things like Fast intakes, headers, etc.. and several thousand on cam packages yet think that £1k for the tune is expensive?

It’s not just a tune that you’re paying for, it’s the expertise and customer service.

Mezzell

107 posts

11 months

Wednesday 10th June
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Janosh said:
I’ve had mine redone by Luis and have spent more than I should have on the car in the last 12 months but it now runs better than ever and I’m a happy owner. Without Carl (and Luis) I would have probably given up on HSV.

People seem happy to spend £1k+ on things like Fast intakes, headers, etc.. and several thousand on cam packages yet think that £1k for the tune is expensive?

It’s not just a tune that you’re paying for, it’s the expertise and customer service.
100% agree with this!

Mezzell

107 posts

11 months

Wednesday 10th June
quotequote all
Lincsls1 said:
Forgive if I'm wrong, maybe getting a bit muddled. Is your car the black CV8 bought quite recently from off another forum user via eBay? If so, I seem to remember it being advertised with all sorts of pretty sweet goodies and boasting nearly 500bhp (fly) which if I remember the spec of cam, heads and intake seemed perfectly possible.
Point being, the map won't have suddenly changed, and surely if its over fuelling that badly it would have failed its MOT.
Maybe you have a duff o2 sensor or something, just might be worth a little investigation before spending so much on a fresh map?
I'm probably way off.laughgetmecoat
Haha. Yes! That’s the one!
Problem is the bhp figure was an estimation compared to a similar the previous owner had.
Nothing has changed with the car and parts since my ownership (roughly a year now). The mpg has been the same since I owned it. The power output has been the same since I owned it.
My problems, if you can call them problems, have started since having a recent power run on a dyno at a respectable tuners near Brands Hatch.
My car has a Wortec map. When I spoke to Wortec shortly after purchasing it, I was told that the car was road mapped but never went on a dyno. The tuner who did the power run for me told me that they’ve had cars that have been road mapped and then when put on a dyno, can make significant increases to the power output by finalising the mapping on the dyno.
Then this thread was started and that has set me on the road to thinking that maybe my car needs some ‘tweaking’ to make the most out of the modifications that have been done.
I hope this makes sense and clears things up a bit!