Any DB 11 owners?
Discussion
jonby said:
Jon39 said:
Some time ago I also wondered how well the DB11 was selling, and so posed a question on a related topic. There were no answers, so perhaps worth trying again.
If a customer places an order now, for their own specification new build DB11, how long will they have to wait for delivery?
Soon after launch, the Company was saying the order book was full for two years ahead.
If that statement was correct, presumably the answer to my question must be about 12 months.
I do hope the sales are strong, but it does seem worrying to see so many used models already advertised for sale.
I may be wrong, but I think you'll find that sales (particularly globally) have indeed been very strong and were not made up. I suspect they have died down a fair amount since but the real problem presumably is the sheer number of people who bought thinking they could flip - non-limited run Astons are rarely flippable at a profit for very long..........If a customer places an order now, for their own specification new build DB11, how long will they have to wait for delivery?
Soon after launch, the Company was saying the order book was full for two years ahead.
If that statement was correct, presumably the answer to my question must be about 12 months.
I do hope the sales are strong, but it does seem worrying to see so many used models already advertised for sale.
Doesn't take many cars up for sale to distort the market.
Thank you Jonby.
Initial customer deliveries were about October 2016.
If there were orders for 2 years of production as stated after launch, the next customer to order would presumably have to wait until October 2018 for delivery. Obviously sooner if there have been cancelled 'flip' orders, but an answer to my question should reveal how the sales are going.
Edited by Jon39 on Thursday 20th April 17:39
Jon39 said:
Thank you Jonby.
Initial customer deliveries were about October 2016.
If there were orders for 2 years of production as stated after launch, the next customer to order would presumably have to wait until October 2018 for delivery. Obviously sooner if there have been cancelled 'flip' orders, but an answer to my question should reveal how the sales are going.
I don;t know current DB11 order to delivery time but as you say, if those times have dropped significantly, it tells it's own story. Initial customer deliveries were about October 2016.
If there were orders for 2 years of production as stated after launch, the next customer to order would presumably have to wait until October 2018 for delivery. Obviously sooner if there have been cancelled 'flip' orders, but an answer to my question should reveal how the sales are going.
first customer DB11s rolled off the line at the end of September '16 and they announced hitting the 1,000th a little before Christmas, so almost exactly 3 months. At that rate, they should have made well over 2,000 in total by now and 4,000 by September this year which isn't unsimilar to total annual production numbers in recent years. Be amazed if they were keeping that production rate up. When they said sold out for first 2 years, did they put a number to that ?
I guess the other factor is that DB11 Volante and/or V8 DB11, replacement Vantage, a whole variety of specials and one or two surprises are all to be made within two years of DB11 launch. So they may have a restriction on how many DB11s they can build in it's 2nd yr of production. They must be banking on 3,000 vantage sales in it's first year and say 1,500 DB11 Volante. IIRC Gaydon capacity is about 7,500. Factor in a few specials etc and there may only be room for 2-2.5k DB11 coupes p.a.
Aston really do need to be getting to that stage where a new model every year which each has great sales figures in year 1 mean they are hitting capacity overall and don't need to push the models near the end of their life as aggressively. They can make zagato and amr versions of each new model part way through their life so again, less pressure on older core models. It's obviously their aim. But of course they have only ever had a tiny handful of really good global years at those top sales levels, so I guess like most, I'm sceptical
jonby said:
... first customer DB11s rolled off the line at the end of September '16 and they announced hitting the 1,000th a little before Christmas, so almost exactly 3 months. At that rate, they should have made well over 2,000 in total by now and 4,000 by September this year ...
When they said sold out for first 2 years, did they put a number to that ?
Aston really do need to be getting to that stage where a new model every year which each has great sales figures in year 1
No number, I was only told by an AML staffer, "We have orders for nearly two years of production". Your analysis of possibly 4,000 sold in the first year, would be deemed a success I am sure, but as you say, DB11 capacity in 2018 would presumably be lower because of the Vantage launch.
They have of course spoken about a seven model, seven year replacement and 7,000 production limit (sports cars), so that should create a new model sales numbers boost every year.
One has to be positive. Ambitious certainly, but who knows, it might work.
Maybe we tend to think too much about the business problems of first 100 years.
Nearly all businesses are loss making initially, but as Aston Martin is such an exceptional company, they don't follow the norm. -
Edited by Jon39 on Thursday 20th April 21:26
Was speaking to my dealer today about something else Jon and asked about DB11
He said he thinks current delivery on DB11, if ordered today, is Q4 this year
Last of the launch editions still being sold, regular car sales about to start now
They have a car in the showroom now which is number 1,800 odd so that means c. 2,000 produced to date
He said he thinks current delivery on DB11, if ordered today, is Q4 this year
Last of the launch editions still being sold, regular car sales about to start now
They have a car in the showroom now which is number 1,800 odd so that means c. 2,000 produced to date
From AM trading statement on 28 Feb 17 (http://www.astonmartin.com/en/live/news/2017/03/24/aston-martin-announces-recent-trading-update):
"As of February 28, 2017, we had 1,438 Orders in Production and 743 Orders not yet in Production. In addition, as of February 28, 2017, we had 2,018 Qualified Marketing Leads with respect to the DB11. We did not track these measures in prior periods.
“Orders in Production” means fully committed orders for our cars from our customers and dealers as of March 1, 2017, which are scheduled to be in production during the period from March 1, 2017 to May 31, 2017, and which have been loaded onto our internal scheduling system. These orders are fully specified, meaning the ordered unit’s specifications such as the trim, upholstery colors and material finishes have been specified by our customer or dealer. We require 12 weeks, at a minimum, to satisfy our production scheduling for an order. Orders in Productions are firm orders for which we have scheduled supply of components from suppliers and begun production and which our dealers cannot unilaterally cancel.
“Orders not yet in Production” means (i) orders for our cars from our customers and dealers that are not yet fully specified because details, such as trim, upholstery color and materials finish still need to be specified by our customer or dealer, such that they cannot yet be loaded onto our internal scheduling system and therefore production has not yet begun as of March 1, 2017 and (ii) fully specified orders that are scheduled to begin production after May 31, 2017. Additionally, we have not scheduled the relevant supply of components from suppliers if an order is designated as an Order not yet in Production. Orders not yet in Production are cancellable by dealers and are not counted toward the adjustments to give pro forma effect on EBITDA.
"As of February 28, 2017, we had 1,438 Orders in Production and 743 Orders not yet in Production. In addition, as of February 28, 2017, we had 2,018 Qualified Marketing Leads with respect to the DB11. We did not track these measures in prior periods.
“Orders in Production” means fully committed orders for our cars from our customers and dealers as of March 1, 2017, which are scheduled to be in production during the period from March 1, 2017 to May 31, 2017, and which have been loaded onto our internal scheduling system. These orders are fully specified, meaning the ordered unit’s specifications such as the trim, upholstery colors and material finishes have been specified by our customer or dealer. We require 12 weeks, at a minimum, to satisfy our production scheduling for an order. Orders in Productions are firm orders for which we have scheduled supply of components from suppliers and begun production and which our dealers cannot unilaterally cancel.
“Orders not yet in Production” means (i) orders for our cars from our customers and dealers that are not yet fully specified because details, such as trim, upholstery color and materials finish still need to be specified by our customer or dealer, such that they cannot yet be loaded onto our internal scheduling system and therefore production has not yet begun as of March 1, 2017 and (ii) fully specified orders that are scheduled to begin production after May 31, 2017. Additionally, we have not scheduled the relevant supply of components from suppliers if an order is designated as an Order not yet in Production. Orders not yet in Production are cancellable by dealers and are not counted toward the adjustments to give pro forma effect on EBITDA.
V8 Vantage GT said:
I was wrong. I got to see a DB11 in Black to day. Looked fantastic 
. Dark solid color looked so good, like a different car from the two toned ones.
They definitely look better in the flesh than in photos (someone smarter than me can probably explain why that is). And totally agree with you that they seem very colour dependent. Dark colours work well. . Dark solid color looked so good, like a different car from the two toned ones. RobDown said:
They definitely look better in the flesh than in photos (someone smarter than me can probably explain why that is). And totally agree with you that they seem very colour dependent. Dark colours work well.
100% agree. There is a beauty in Black at AM Birmingham, stunning looking thing!I wonder if the comments on black ones looking good is because it hides some of the detailing...
From a personal perspective, I think the wheels they all seems to be seen on are awful too. A change of wheel would make all the difference. Maybe even a slightly smaller rim.
As a case in point...I think this car has possibly been lowered a little too. But it's probably the nicest DB11 I've seen in photos.
I reckon even brighter two-tone coloured cars would look a lot better without the standard wheels.
From a personal perspective, I think the wheels they all seems to be seen on are awful too. A change of wheel would make all the difference. Maybe even a slightly smaller rim.
As a case in point...I think this car has possibly been lowered a little too. But it's probably the nicest DB11 I've seen in photos.
I reckon even brighter two-tone coloured cars would look a lot better without the standard wheels.
Edited by Murph7355 on Monday 24th April 09:50
Hmm. I am not convinced that the DB11 is a lasting design. It looks to wide and the rear end is too fussy. I was at HWM over the week end and they had a couple of launch models in different colours. In my opinion the darker colours look better and single tone rather than dual tone work better.
However, if you put them next to a DBS or a Vanquish (or even a DB9 GT) i don't think there is any contest of which design language is the more elegant on the eye.
However, if you put them next to a DBS or a Vanquish (or even a DB9 GT) i don't think there is any contest of which design language is the more elegant on the eye.
Murph7355 said:
I wonder if the comments on black ones looking good is because it hides some of the detailing...
From a personal perspective, I think the wheels they all seems to be seen on are awful too. A change of wheel would make all the difference. Maybe even a slightly smaller rim.
As a case in point...I think this car has possibly been lowered a little too. But it's probably the nicest DB11 I've seen in photos.
I reckon even brighter two-tone coloured cars would look a lot better without the standard wheels.
I respect your opinion Andy, but in this case just NO! Far too customised for no good reason! IMHO, the current wheel options look great (particularly the black Diamond-turned option). As for lowering it - From a personal perspective, I think the wheels they all seems to be seen on are awful too. A change of wheel would make all the difference. Maybe even a slightly smaller rim.
As a case in point...I think this car has possibly been lowered a little too. But it's probably the nicest DB11 I've seen in photos.
I reckon even brighter two-tone coloured cars would look a lot better without the standard wheels.
Edited by Murph7355 on Monday 24th April 09:50
Darker colours look better on large cars.. simples!
I know some dealers have DB11's sitting in their showrooms for immediate delivery, so unless you wanted a very specific spec then I don't see any need to wait 18 months or so.
Not great really, I can't see Ferrari dealers having stock of new models sitting there at RRP only 9 months after model release.
Not great really, I can't see Ferrari dealers having stock of new models sitting there at RRP only 9 months after model release.
Big Ry said:
I know some dealers have DB11's sitting in their showrooms for immediate delivery, so unless you wanted a very specific spec then I don't see any need to wait 18 months or so.
Not great really, I can't see Ferrari dealers having stock of new models sitting there at RRP only 9 months after model release.
This is the market challenge that AM face. The DB11 is for the sliver of a market between high-end customers who like to drive (who typically go Italian and consider AM to be for old fogey Vanquish/DB9 set) and those who just prefer a more comfortable and spacious ride.Not great really, I can't see Ferrari dealers having stock of new models sitting there at RRP only 9 months after model release.
That just leaves the few who like to drive but want something more understated and elegant (and who get teased by their peers for being old fogey's
)HBradley said:
I respect your opinion Andy, but in this case just NO! Far too customised for no good reason! IMHO, the current wheel options look great (particularly the black Diamond-turned option). As for lowering it -
Darker colours look better on large cars.. simples!
I generally don't like modified cars. But that is the first DB11 I've really liked. The std wheels and stance make it look like it's on tip toes and that Hot Wheels designed them (almost as if the design objective of the std wheels was to put Kahn out of business!).Darker colours look better on large cars.. simples!
Edited to add - I am right in thinking it's only the wheels and ride height that are changed??
RobDown said:
The UK stock position is odd; Andy Palmer was in Tokyo earlier and (according to the newswires) saying the Japanese allocation of DB11s is sold out for 2017
Who are they sold out to?As I recall, dealers bought *a lot* of stock from Aston in 2007 or so in the UK. This led to Aston having great sales figures (volume) and some very punchy deals on new stock cars (thank you Aston Martin)...it also caused issues with resale amongst other things I suspect.
Maybe they're doing the same in Japan
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