AML - Stock Market Listing

AML - Stock Market Listing

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Discussion

SFO

5,065 posts

147 months

Friday 19th February
quotequote all
Minglar said:
Possibly slightly off topic, but imho could be worth keeping an eye on for comparison purposes if nothing else. I have read a few speculative reports recently that VW is considering floating Porsche separately from within the group. After 115 pages on here discussing and critiquing the AML IPO it could be interesting to see how it pans out should it happen.

https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2021-02...

Best Regards

Minglar
Wasn't that long ago when Porsche tried to buy VW ..

Jon39

Original Poster:

8,029 posts

107 months

Friday 19th February
quotequote all

The debate about whether Mr Strolls real passion, is for Racing Point (err Aston Martin) or Aston Martin Lagonda, will probably rumble on.

It was suggested by someone, that obtaining new sponsors would become far easier for the Racing Point F1 team, after it is renamed Aston Martin. Perhaps we are now seeing examples, of how sponsors are being attracted.

A jeans firm say they are thrilled to be associated with Aston Martin. They even suggest, that when Sebastian Vettel attends an evening event, he can now wear jeans. Perhaps they have not yet appreciated the Aston Martin standards. Try to imagine James Bond wearing a dinner jacket, crisp white shirt with double cuffs, bow tie and ....... jeans!

"We are thrilled to announce this partnership with Aston Martin Cognizant Formula One Team," said Matteo Sinigaglia, CEO of Fashion Box SpA. "To work with such an iconic car brand is a real privilege. As companies, we share many common attributes, such as craftsmanship, passion and innovation. These are the values that continuously inspire us in the denim world.





My wife recently noticed a small tear in the knee of my gardening trousers. I told her that rips are very fashionable now, it is called designer and you have to pay extra for that. She said, "Nonsense, they are spoilt goods made by trainee sewing machine workers in far-off countries, but still offered for sale. Throw your trousers away".




Old Chimer

104 posts

8 months

Thursday 25th February
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Minglar

429 posts

87 months

Thursday 25th February
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Looks like good news. Stock price has moved roughly 10% higher in early trading. That’s a solid quarter for DBX in the current environment, and hopefully is a good sign for things going forward. Well done AM!

Best Regards

Minglar

oilit

1,598 posts

142 months

Thursday 25th February
quotequote all
indeed, that is better than the ex-demo units sat for sale on the forecourts in the UK would have suggested.

Probably underlying the original statement that the UK is not the core market - and thank goodness (for AM) that it would appear that strategy may be working, also if sales stay at that level that would suggest that Wales is at almost capacity until phase 2 which was originally schedule for 2 years after plant opening:-

"The company is putting the finishing touches on its second production facility, in St Athan in the U.K. where it plans to build the SUV. The maximum production capacity for this new plant is estimated at around 5,000 vehicles per annum at first, but it is expected to be increased to 7,500 two years after its opening.

And it hopes to sell a lot of these high riders - the aim is to more than double its yearly sales target (which, as previously mentioned, won’t be met in 2019), increasing it to 14,000 vehicles.


Edited by oilit on Thursday 25th February 09:06

Jon39

Original Poster:

8,029 posts

107 months

Thursday 25th February
quotequote all

During the pandemic, sales figures are obviously not going to be indicative.

I have though spotted a comparison, which must be surprising to anyone not knowing the background.

The core sports car (lowest price Aston Martin) is always expected to be the best selling model.
However during 2020, if you add sales of the DB11 and DBS, that total is 60% more than the Vantage.

..................................

Financing costs

We knew about the high interest rates on the refinanced bond debt.
Paying off the previous bond debts early cost £21.4 million.
Annual financing costs now exceed £100 million.




Edited by Jon39 on Thursday 25th February 21:34

Minglar

429 posts

87 months

Thursday 25th February
quotequote all
Jon39 said:

During the pandemic, sales figures are obviously not going to be indicative.

I have though spotted a comparison, which must be surprising to anyone not knowing the background.

The core sports car (lowest price Aston Martin) is always expected to be the best selling model.
However during 2020, if you add sales of the DB11 and DBS, that total is 60% more than the Vantage.

..................................

Financing costs

We knew about the high interest rates on the refinanced bond debt.
Paying off the previous bond debts early cost £21.4 million.
Annual financing costs now exceed £100 million.




Edited by Jon39 on Thursday 25th February 21:34
Imho the Vantage is no longer part of the master plan. It may be the cheapest and perhaps the sportiest model but it will not be able to generate the required income. Fifteen years ago it could, but not anymore. I actually think that it may end up being a rare sight going forward, especially if new cars are only built to customer order. If the demand isn’t there, AM won’t bother building them. AM have everything pinned on DBX and they need to sell lots of them. I still think today’s Q4 sales numbers for the new model were strong, and that surely must offer some optimism for the rest of this year. The financing costs have been well documented, and thanks for reminding us all once again. As others (including me) have mentioned in another thread, the engine/platform developments announced today are disappointing, but AM need to adapt to survive. It is likely that well established markets and models will become less relevant going forward. Unfortunately it’s a sign of the times and the challenges that face many motor manufacturers nowadays.

Best Regards

Minglar

Speedraser

1,476 posts

147 months

Friday 26th February
quotequote all
Minglar said:
As others (including me) have mentioned in another thread, the engine/platform developments announced today are disappointing, but AM need to adapt to survive. It is likely that well established markets and models will become less relevant going forward. Unfortunately it’s a sign of the times and the challenges that face many motor manufacturers nowadays.

Best Regards

Minglar
A badge on a Benz is not surviving. That's Aston dead.

Jon39

Original Poster:

8,029 posts

107 months

Friday 26th February
quotequote all

Do you ever look in the Aston Martin share forums?
Think the participants must be mostly short-term gamblers looking for a quick profit.
Can never really tell whether the posts are purposely over positive, hoping to encourage others to buy shares, which might then raise the share price.

On here we are worried about the future, if Aston Martin bodies are fitted on M-Bs, but the forum people seem to think we are wrong.
They see a very rosy future. Here is one example.

'£34.80 [share price] would put AM in the FTSE100 with a Market Value of £4 billion. I think that share price is possible by the 1st Quarter 2023, but could well be sooner if covid doesn’t cause another lockdown again and we manage to refinance debt. Once it hits the FTSE100, I think it will go from £4 billion to £7-8 billion in a year or two, so long as they manage to hit that 15,000 production target.'

(The main debt does not require refinancing in 2023.)

Would be funny if he turns out to be correct and we are wrong.
Strange, they have suddenly all gone quiet. Oh I see why, share price at present down 6% today.




Agent57

754 posts

118 months

Friday 26th February
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Just put an Aston body on an E63 chassis..... spin

oilit

1,598 posts

142 months

Friday 26th February
quotequote all
I wonder if build to order is appropriate across the range?

I remember reading an article which suggested that the Cygnet lead time was a problem for sales.

How does the BTO lead time of a Vantage compare to its competitors?

At the DBX/DBS level customization is expected - at the vantage level you are dealing with ideally younger buyers who have the attitude of "i want it my way now" (aka SMS vs post and fax world)

look at Tesla - my understanding is the S & X model buyers can customize, whereas the 3 have a Henry Ford type menu of customization - maybe there is a reason to meet cost targets versus market values?

Edited by oilit on Friday 26th February 19:13

RichB

44,880 posts

248 months

Friday 26th February
quotequote all
oilit said:
...I remember reading an article which suggested that the Cygnet lead time was a problem for sales...
rofl must have been written by Bez himself.

RMDB9

1,711 posts

12 months

Friday 26th February
quotequote all
DickyC said:
You're overlooking the DB7 which saw Aston Martin thrive. If there was a market for an Aston that was largely Jaguar then there would be a market for an Aston that was largely Mercedes-AMG.

Anyone noticed how Astonesque the Mercedes-AMG GT Coupe and Roadster look? Just saying.
Have you noticed the Astonesqueness of the new VW Passat 4 door coupe?

Jon39

Original Poster:

8,029 posts

107 months

Friday 26th February
quotequote all

oilit said:
I wonder if build to order is appropriate across the range.

This seems to vary by region. I gather many US buyers like to buy showroom stock vehicles, whereas in the UK (prior to 2017 or 2018) it was fairly normal for the factory only to build cars which had been specified by customers or dealers. That is evidenced by the US dealers openly advertising new Aston Martins, whereas in the UK, dealers do not appear to be allowed to openly advertise individual unregistered new stock cars. Build to order is probably not a new LS idea at AML. Think it has been mentioned here, that Germany might also be a purchase from showroom nation.

The 'dealer stuffing' seems to have started in 2017/2018, when AP was keen to see (wholesale) sales growth. Perhaps he panicked somewhat, when realising new Vantage sales were not meeting targets. Initially the Vantage numbers looked good, because dealers around the world were taking demonstrators and showroom stock vehicles, in addition to orders from the early adopter customers, press and promotional cars.





DickyC

39,673 posts

162 months

Saturday 27th February
quotequote all
DickyC said:
Anyone noticed how Astonesque the Mercedes-AMG GT Coupe and Roadster look? Just saying.
Agent57 said:
Just put an Aston body on an E63 chassis..... spin


It must have crossed their minds.

Jon39

Original Poster:

8,029 posts

107 months

Saturday 27th February
quotequote all

DickyC said:


It must have crossed their minds.


They do have form.

However they discovered the hard way, that you cannot fool tradesmen into paying extra for a Mercedes-Benz X-class made in a Nissan factory, when the Nissan original version is cheaper.

Chrysler Crossfire = M-B SLK
M-B X-class = Nissan Navaro
M-B Citan = Renault Kango











RMDB9

1,711 posts

12 months

Saturday 27th February
quotequote all
DickyC said:
DickyC said:
Anyone noticed how Astonesque the Mercedes-AMG GT Coupe and Roadster look? Just saying.
Agent57 said:
Just put an Aston body on an E63 chassis..... spin


It must have crossed their minds.
Could be the next Vantage...

SFO

5,065 posts

147 months

Saturday 27th February
quotequote all
Jon39 said:


They do have form.

However they discovered the hard way, that you cannot fool tradesmen into paying extra for a Mercedes-Benz X-class made in a Nissan factory, when the Nissan original version is cheaper.

Chrysler Crossfire = M-B SLK
M-B X-class = Nissan Navaro
M-B Citan = Renault Kango
these are all low end stuff, plus they don't own AM yet so cannot force AM to use MB platforms.

RMDB9

1,711 posts

12 months

Saturday 27th February
quotequote all
Jon39 said:

A jeans firm say they are thrilled to be associated with Aston Martin. They even suggest, that when Sebastian Vettel attends an evening event, he can now wear jeans. Perhaps they have not yet appreciated the Aston Martin standards. Try to imagine James Bond wearing a dinner jacket, crisp white shirt with double cuffs, bow tie and ....... jeans!

"We are thrilled to announce this partnership with Aston Martin Cognizant Formula One Team," said Matteo Sinigaglia, CEO of Fashion Box SpA. "To work with such an iconic car brand is a real privilege. As companies, we share many common attributes, such as craftsmanship, passion and innovation. These are the values that continuously inspire us in the denim world.
And why is that bad? I guess most Vantage and DBS owners are wearing jeans most of the time.

And Cognizant....would Sean Connery as 007 have been a brand ambassador for UNIVAC, Bull or Control Data?

Agent57

754 posts

118 months

Saturday 27th February
quotequote all
DickyC said:
DickyC said:
Anyone noticed how Astonesque the Mercedes-AMG GT Coupe and Roadster look? Just saying.
Agent57 said:
Just put an Aston body on an E63 chassis..... spin


It must have crossed their minds.
coolcool