AML - Stock Market Listing

[oilit]

Sorry to say it but not having a V8 is hardly an issue as we move to other forms of propulsion - they could probably electrify the whole range of AM in 6 months …..and keep the V12 for where they can sell a ICE model - everyone seems to want a V12 vantage and V12 DBX !!

[cardigankid]

It's a minor point, but a 999 year lease is effectively a sale, so it would appear that Aston owns their Gaydon site, subject to the security holder.

The tragic thing about all of this, is that whoever acquires Aston, the whole woke left wing promoted electrical agenda is going to destroy AML and many others, all for no purpose. Climate Change? A fairy story. I know that Porsche are selling a good number of Taycans, but I don't see electric sports car sales taking off generally. Do you regard the Ferrari 296GTB as desirable? I don't. Not for a moment. I daresay that the Vantage, whatever it looks like, is going to get the Mercedes 6 cylinder hybrid running gear. I don't personally want a hybrid, because once the battery is flat, which is not long if you are using the performance, then a reduced size engine is carrying a large weight of batteries around. Furthermore, how economical is it going to be to run an electric car once the electricity prices really start to skyrocket?

LS can hold on to AML only as long as the company does not run out of cash.

[Shrimpvende]

Jon39 said:

Thank you.

So good to hear from someone with first hand knowledge. You must chuckle sometimes, because we have to make guesses here and inevitably must get some things completely wrong.

Very old first hand knowledge nowadays as I haven't been there for quite some time! I was also in a fairly junior role, so was never privy to anything outside of what I was working on, other than general hearsay (which is all the info in my above post was at the time).

I sadly don't have a clue what the place is like now, I imagine very different. I'd love to go on the factory tour now as an owner to see how things have changed and to show my partner round, however last I heard they had suspended these due to covid?

It's amazing how accurately people on here predict (or find out) what's going on behind closed doors sometimes. Generally, everything becomes public knowledge at some point or another where car companies are concerned!

[hornbaek]

Jon39 said:

Can this really be true ?
A buy / sell difference (spread) of 32.8 pence.







Big companies, even with a £33 share price, often have just a 1 pence spread.






Is it simply the frequency of trading ?

Yes is the short answer. This is as a result of liquidity in the share. Big spreads simply show that the liquidity is simply not there. Which also means, that volatility is high.

[Jon39]

cardigankid said:

It's a minor point, but a 999 year lease is effectively a sale, so it would appear that Aston owns their Gaydon site, subject to the security holder. ...

... I daresay that the Vantage, whatever it looks like, is going to get the Mercedes 6 cylinder hybrid running gear. I don't personally want a hybrid, because once the battery is flat, which is not long if you are using the performance, then a reduced size engine is carrying a large weight of batteries around. Furthermore, how economical is it going to be to run an electric car once the electricity prices really start to skyrocket?

LS can hold on to AML only as long as the company does not run out of cash.

My memory is rather vague in this point, but I think originally the Gaydon factory was transferred to AML from Jaguar (one Ford pocket to another). Perhaps Jaguar were owners of the whole site (airfield). I think more recently there was a financial transaction of some sort. Fairly sure it is being used as security for one of the bonds.

It appears that once a hybrid battery is flat, carrying a large weight of batteries around, will be the least of your worries.
Finding out that the pertol engine will no longer start, might be more of a concern. Ref. the electric era topic - 8 year old Mercedes hybrid scrapped. A relative of Adam experience an identical situation.

Many Mercedes models now, including I think some with the in-line 6 cylinder engine, are not PHEVs, but have an electric motor fitted in the drive train, between the engine and gearbox. It provides boost to overcome turbo-lag. The battery used is only 48 volts, so presumably replaceable.

Some have suggested that the total new F1 sponsorship funds (aided by AM association), might be more than LS has put into AML.
Probably therefore be worth him ensuring, that AML's cash is kept topped up.

[Shrimpvende]

It would be a shame to see a 6 cylinder Vantage (although far more so a 4 cylinder...surely that's a non-starter?!)

These 48v 'mild hybrid' systems, or the non plugin versions with slightly more capacity, are a great idea but don't make an emotive sports car. If you really want to worry about the future of petrol cars, have a look at some of the proposals for Euro 7 (2025 onwards). Talk of multistage filters, electrically heated 'supercats' etc.

It's another reason never to let my Vantage go - they won't ever be able to make a production car that sounds like that again, the new one with the OPF already proves that!

[SpeckledJim]

cardigankid said:

It's a minor point, but a 999 year lease is effectively a sale, so it would appear that Aston owns their Gaydon site, subject to the security holder.

The tragic thing about all of this, is that whoever acquires Aston, the whole woke left wing promoted electrical agenda is going to destroy AML and many others, all for no purpose. Climate Change? A fairy story. I know that Porsche are selling a good number of Taycans, but I don't see electric sports car sales taking off generally. Do you regard the Ferrari 296GTB as desirable? I don't. Not for a moment. I daresay that the Vantage, whatever it looks like, is going to get the Mercedes 6 cylinder hybrid running gear. I don't personally want a hybrid, because once the battery is flat, which is not long if you are using the performance, then a reduced size engine is carrying a large weight of batteries around. Furthermore, how economical is it going to be to run an electric car once the electricity prices really start to skyrocket?

LS can hold on to AML only as long as the company does not run out of cash.

The reasons to want a flash car are not going to go away.

Aston Martins don’t run on petrol because that’s what their customers demand. They run on petrol because that’s simply the way the world used to get around.

You might not want one if it’s an EV. But AM can’t plan to make and sell illegal cars. The world is going in this direction. Tiny AM have to follow, or close their doors.

[Dewi 2]

Shrimpvende said:

It would be a shame to see a 6 cylinder Vantage. ...

... It's another reason never to let my Vantage go - they won't ever be able to make a production car that sounds like that again, the new one with the OPF already proves that!

With the recent steady move by the motor industry, to smaller capacity engines, I suppose at least there is history of Aston Martins with 6 cylinder engines (DB2, DB5 etc..)

I am sure that you are one of very many, who now own keeper Aston Martins, some for the reason you have mentioned.
Not good for business, but we have what we wanted.

[AstonV]

oilit said:

I would prefer Geely to Mercedes.

Geely got turned down in preference to Stroll, and got refused again at the recent fund raise. Their track record with Volvo is pretty impressive if you ask me.

I wonder if Mercedes said if you take the Geely route as an investor we will not participate - or something similar?

I just hope Geely do buy it - they obviously want it - and I suspect they would be prepared if buying it out of receivership to not ship a single unit for 12 months if Mercedes refused the components (just like BMW with RR) - and we would be back to using Volvo elements albeit in an electric skateboard.

Can’t happen soon enough for me

Geely~China. I'd rather see AM fold that go to China.

[oilit]

Your wish will probably become reality……

[Simpo Two]

Dewi 2 said:

Shrimpvende said:

It would be a shame to see a 6 cylinder Vantage. ...

... It's another reason never to let my Vantage go - they won't ever be able to make a production car that sounds like that again, the new one with the OPF already proves that!

With the recent steady move by the motor industry, to smaller capacity engines, I suppose at least there is history of Aston Martins with 6 cylinder engines (DB2, DB5 etc..)

I am sure that you are one of very many, who now own keeper Aston Martins, some for the reason you have mentioned.
Not good for business, but we have what we wanted.

I have no objection to a Straight Six; it's very British! (arguably more than a V8).

Four pots however I draw the line at.

[p102768]

cardigankid said:

I don't personally want a hybrid, because once the battery is flat, which is not long if you are using the performance, then a reduced size engine is carrying a large weight of batteries around.

That is true to a point and depends on driving conditions but the battery is being constantly regenerated every time you brake.

My wife has a BMW 330e which has a range of around 20 miles on pure electric. Perfect for getting to work and back during the week but if she does the 300 mile journey to go and see her parents that doesn't last long.

She can still get there and back on a third of a tank of petrol though because the car regenerates enough electricity going up and over the mountains between here and there to spend a lot of time running on electric.

[nite_narc]

GreasyHands said:

Aston doesn’t need to sell cheaper cars anymore than Bentley, Ferrari, Lambo or McLaren do. ROFLMAO

If Aston's sales/growth was as strong as any of those brands I'd agree with you. But they're not so they need to do something differently.

[nite_narc]

cardigankid said:

Yes, the increasing sales of SUV's and oncoming electric may make all of this irrelevant. Can you imagine summoning up a great deal of enthusiasm for buying an electric DBX?

Yes, actually. More so than a soon-to-be redundant petrol version.

[Piginapoke]

Any idea why the share price has gone up last week- it can’t be based on the financial projections!

[Agent57]

Stock markets in general have gone up.

My limited understanding is that inflation is now predicted to be extremely bad rather than catastrophically bad.

That's markets for you. As a wise person once said. "When the herd moves...."

[cardigankid]

nite_narc said:

cardigankid said:

Yes, the increasing sales of SUV's and oncoming electric may make all of this irrelevant. Can you imagine summoning up a great deal of enthusiasm for buying an electric DBX?

Yes, actually. More so than a soon-to-be redundant petrol version.

It's a reasonable position to take. The political decision has been made, whatever the implications, and will probably turn out to be catastrophic, like most political decisions. My problem with EV's is that to me there will be little difference between a Porsche, a Bentley, a Mercedes, a Ferrari or an Aston Martin electric drivetrain, and that is such an integral part of having one of these cars, that there will be no point in owning one. The technology may change in the future, and if so, great. If I am forced to buy an EV based on the current technology, I'd rather own the most basic model I can get which meets my needs. It's a functional decision, not an aspirational one.

[RichB]

cardigankid said:

nite_narc said:

cardigankid said:

Yes, the increasing sales of SUV's and oncoming electric may make all of this irrelevant. Can you imagine summoning up a great deal of enthusiasm for buying an electric DBX?

Yes, actually. More so than a soon-to-be redundant petrol version.

<clip> If I am forced to buy an EV based on the current technology, I'd rather own the most basic model I can get which meets my needs. It's a functional decision, not an aspirational one.

Likewise, I am in the fortunate position that I get a new Volvo every 9-12 months. Just had an XC60 T8 Recharge delivered and although I've only had it 3 weeks I can already see the advantages of PHEV, 160mpg without trying and I only plug it in once a week. That said, if ever the Volvo scheme ended I could see no reason to have anything more expensive or 'aspirational'. The interior of the Volvo is excellent and the difference in appearance of SUVs is so minimal that leaving aside the engine, there would be nothing to entice me to spend large sums of money on one!

[Piston Ted]

cardigankid said:

It's a reasonable position to take. The political decision has been made, whatever the implications, and will probably turn out to be catastrophic, like most political decisions. My problem with EV's is that to me there will be little difference between a Porsche, a Bentley, a Mercedes, a Ferrari or an Aston Martin electric drivetrain, and that is such an integral part of having one of these cars, that there will be no point in owning one. The technology may change in the future, and if so, great. If I am forced to buy an EV based on the current technology, I'd rather own the most basic model I can get which meets my needs. It's a functional decision, not an aspirational one.

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again you’ve summed up exactly my thoughts on the whole subject. I’ve no desire to own an EV, I’m sure they’re fine as an A to B mode of transport but they are nothing more than white goods in my eyes. As for walking into an Aston or Ferrari dealership with 200k or even 100k to spend on an emotional purchase well there is no way on this earth am I doing that if it’s a battery car - not a chance.

[Jon39]

Piginapoke said:

Any idea why the share price has gone up last week- it can’t be based on the financial projections!

Agent57 said:

Stock markets in general have gone up.

My limited understanding is that inflation is now predicted to be extremely bad rather than catastrophically bad.

That's markets for you. As a wise person once said. "When the herd moves...."

...... do the opposite.

My own interpretation:-

Long-term, it is the fundamentals and future profitability of any business, which dictates the share price behaviour.
The present AML financial outlook, indicates difficulty in ever becoming profitable. Even the proposed capital raise is only enough to repay a modest portion of the total debt and the remainder will be spent as usual, on vehicle development and regular business costs.

Short-term, who knows what is moving the share price. Buyers and sellers with many different opinions. Some will see value in the business brand and anticipate a takeover with a share price premium. Others might see Mr Stroll's stated plan, as the 100 year solution to creating a profitable car manufacturing business. Combined this with the activity of short-term traders, who hope for a share price movement (up or down) in order to rapidly exit with a profit (never guaranteed).

Edited by Jon39 on Monday 15th August 12:42