E10 Petrol

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Discussion

Cornwall1

Original Poster:

91 posts

53 months

Thursday 22nd July 2021
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Hi all,

I can not find a definitive answer - can you use E10 petrol in a 2006 4.3 V8 Vantage?

Hopefully someone can help.

Thanks in advance.

Trahison

132 posts

33 months

Thursday 22nd July 2021
quotequote all
Gov.uk seems pretty definitive...?

https://check-vehicle-compatibility-e10-petrol.ser...

Best way to be sure I guess is to forget about E10 altogether and give her the good stuff.

Agent57

1,631 posts

153 months

Thursday 22nd July 2021
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The models below are not suitable for E10 and should continue to use E5 petrol.


DB7 V12

Doh. Looks like I'll have to start buying the expensive stuff.

Trahison

132 posts

33 months

Thursday 22nd July 2021
quotequote all
Trahison said:
Gov.uk seems pretty definitive...?

https://check-vehicle-compatibility-e10-petrol.ser...

Best way to be sure I guess is to forget about E10 altogether and give her the good stuff.
OK I now concede that the page is actually pretty confusing, seemingly showing either post-2010 compatability, or pre-2000 incompatability, but less clear on 2000-2010. I assume that you could treat any on the post-2010 list as compatible. Then again, 98RON all the way and that's the headache solved.

Agent57

1,631 posts

153 months

Thursday 22nd July 2021
quotequote all
No, it is just Virage: models from 2010 plus the others listed can use E10.

And then Aston Martin V8: models before 2000 plus the others listed can't use E10.

It sort of makes sense after the 3rd time of reading carefully.

AdamV12V

4,987 posts

176 months

Thursday 22nd July 2021
quotequote all
Trahison said:
Then again, 98RON all the way and that's the headache solved.
98 RON is no guarantee of not being E10. RON and E rating are unrelated, albeiit its likely that low E rating fuel is most likely found in high RON fuel

LTP

2,054 posts

111 months

Thursday 22nd July 2021
quotequote all
AdamV12V said:
98 RON is no guarantee of not being E10. RON and E rating are unrelated, albeiit its likely that low E rating fuel is most likely found in high RON fuel
In the UK it is, at least for now:

During summer 2021, the standard (95 octane) petrol grade in Great Britain will become E10.
The change in fuel applies to petrol only. Diesel fuel will not be changing..
Almost all (95%) petrol-powered vehicles on the road today can use E10 petrol and all cars built since 2011 are compatible..
If your petrol vehicle or equipment is not compatible with E10 fuel, you will still be able to use E5 by purchasing the ‘super’ grade (97+ octane) petrol from most filling stations.
Petrol pumps will clearly label petrol as either E10 or E5. (my bold for emphasis)
Source:- https://www.gov.uk/guidance/e10-petrol-explained

AdamV12V

4,987 posts

176 months

Thursday 22nd July 2021
quotequote all
LTP said:
In the UK it is, at least for now:

During summer 2021, the standard (95 octane) petrol grade in Great Britain will become E10.
The change in fuel applies to petrol only. Diesel fuel will not be changing..
Almost all (95%) petrol-powered vehicles on the road today can use E10 petrol and all cars built since 2011 are compatible..
If your petrol vehicle or equipment is not compatible with E10 fuel, you will still be able to use E5 by purchasing the ‘super’ grade (97+ octane) petrol from most filling stations.
Petrol pumps will clearly label petrol as either E10 or E5. (my bold for emphasis)
Source:- https://www.gov.uk/guidance/e10-petrol-explained
Yeah thats by buying E5 super unleaded... not E10 super tho.... the E rating and the RON are not directly linked as far as I am aware. And the E rating is only the max, as currently some E5 fuels are in effect E0 - Esso Synergy Supreme+ being the best example.

The E rating simply signifies the Maximum bioethanol permitted.... not the actual. The RON of the fuel is unrelated, other than its not obligated to be E10, but that doesnt mean to say that somebody cant (and no doubt will) sell E10 98RON fuels too.

Dont confused the two thinking they will automatically be linked is what I am saying

Edited by AdamV12V on Thursday 22 July 21:04

Dewi 2

1,304 posts

64 months

Thursday 22nd July 2021
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Adam has just mentioned ESSO. Hopefully all AM PHers know about it. Unfortunate though if you live in any of the areas not supported.

The petrol that I use for some of my cars including the V8V, is ESSO super grade, think they call it Supreme.
Although the label on the pump shows E5, that means 'up to 5%' and this ESSO grade (in many parts of this country) does not contain any ethanol.
Whether that will change to 5% ethanol in (is it) September, I do not know.

For the change from leaded to unleaded, there were additives available ie. adding lead. Logic suggests that removal of ethanol, presumably cannot be done in that way, with a chemical being added.





Edited by Dewi 2 on Thursday 22 July 21:21

Trahison

132 posts

33 months

Thursday 22nd July 2021
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Genuinely very informative folks, thanks.

Cornwall1

Original Poster:

91 posts

53 months

Thursday 22nd July 2021
quotequote all
Cornwall1 said:
Hi all,

I can not find a definitive answer - can you use E10 petrol in a 2006 4.3 V8 Vantage?

Hopefully someone can help.

Thanks in advance.
Great chat, but still waiting for a definitive answer - yes or no ?

Trahison

132 posts

33 months

Thursday 22nd July 2021
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Jeez! Tell you what - go find out and let us know!

geresey

388 posts

122 months

Thursday 22nd July 2021
quotequote all
I'd say from the gov site that the 06 v8 is compatible, but I'd use the super anyway. What happens if its NOT compatible, what symptoms would you see, or would be invisible damage(until something goes bang) ???

Cornwall1

Original Poster:

91 posts

53 months

Thursday 22nd July 2021
quotequote all
geresey said:
I'd say from the gov site that the 06 v8 is compatible, but I'd use the super anyway. What happens if its NOT compatible, what symptoms would you see, or would be invisible damage(until something goes bang) ???
Thanks I agree.

From the gov site it is not very clear, all it says is V8 before 2000 not suitable.
You have to assume that means after 2000 they are.

I intend to use super, but useful to know if you can in an emergency.
Not worth the risk long term,as you say.

LTP

2,054 posts

111 months

Thursday 22nd July 2021
quotequote all
AdamV12V said:
.....
Dont confused the two thinking they will automatically be linked is what I am saying
I'm not. The UK government website clearly states that "super" fuels (97 RON and above) will be E5, not E10; the announced E10 UK introduction is restricted to 95 RON "Premium" fuels We know that, despite having to label it as E5, Esso "Synergy Supreme" 99 RON is currently zero ethanol (except in certain UK counties, apparently for logistical reasons).

Nobody claimed that the RON rating, which is a measure of octane (RON = Research Octane Number) is related to the percentage of ethanol in the fuel; however ethanol generally has a higher octane value that petrol, which allows lower octane petrol to be used to make a 95 RON E10 blend. Also, being oxygen-rich, added ethanol theoretically allows better combustion with fewer pollutants. However ethanol is, volume for volume, about 30% less energy dense than petrol, so the change from E5 to E10 will mean about a 3% reduction in the energy content of every gallon (or litre) you use. Or, to put it another way and all other things being equal, a 420 bhp car becomes a 407 bhp car.

The big problem with ethanol in the fuel is it tends to hold water and has high oxygen content, so can allow corrosion of metal parts if they are not chosen correctly or suitably protected; it also tends to eat certain plastics and rubbers: this is why it's unsuitable for many older cars.

It is perfectly possible to make high-octane fuels with more ethanol, as the octane rating of the alcohol is already higher than the petrol it's being mixed with, so all of the above could be subject to change in the future but, for now at least and in the UK, any fuel above 95 RON will be E5 and the best fuel for your Aston is Esso 99 RON.

Edited by LTP on Thursday 22 July 23:51

Jon39

12,782 posts

142 months

Friday 23rd July 2021
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LTP said:
The UK government website clearly states that "super" fuels (97 RON and above) will be E5, not E10;

Has it been announced that 'will be' is compulsory, or might it just be 'up to 5%' ?
Perhaps we can hope that ESSO will continue their zero ethanol.


AlistairMcD

75 posts

76 months

Friday 23rd July 2021
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My experience is that not all stations carry the higher octane fuel. Would it be prudent to carry something like Sta-Bil to drop into the tank in the event that E10/RON95 was only available?

andyvvc

240 posts

142 months

Friday 23rd July 2021
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Sooo.... filling up with 'Super' unleaded from anywhere (Sainsburys, Shell, ESSO) is always going to be E5? Regular unleaded is (potentially) E10?

If I've got that right - shouldn't the OP be using Super on the Vantage anyway? Were the 4.3s ever supposed to be run on anything less than 97 RON fuel? (Or is the question here "If I am on vapour and only E10 regular unleaded is available, is a tenners worth [until i get to a Super pump] going to kill my car" ?)

SHIFTY

888 posts

235 months

Friday 23rd July 2021
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Handbook for my wife's mini states it can run on E5, E10 and E25, wonder how many AM can use E25?

Trahison

132 posts

33 months

Friday 23rd July 2021
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SHIFTY said:
Handbook for my wife's mini states it can run on E5, E10 and E25, wonder how many AM can use E25?
Just checked my own V8V handbook and the workshop manual out of interest and no mention of fuel type (other than unleaded obv).