E46 - transmission vibration when accelerating through 40mph

E46 - transmission vibration when accelerating through 40mph

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dhutch

Original Poster:

14,198 posts

196 months

Friday 17th February 2023
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helix402 said:
Autodoc ATE sensor.
Fair. Typically, its £30 for a rear (same both sides) and £50 for a front (handed) but if the garage is still struggling I'll mail-order one.

Seems I paid £37 for an Apec 1093 sensor 18months ago for the front right. Plus £75 for a 'wheel bearing including reader ring' presumably two parts! The bearing and a new ring.

Left showing the issue this time, so in away atleast it's not the same one!




Edited by dhutch on Friday 17th February 20:32

dhutch

Original Poster:

14,198 posts

196 months

Tuesday 14th March 2023
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New sensor fitted which has cleared that, but still can't find the transmission vibration!

WIL35

525 posts

209 months

Friday 17th March 2023
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I had similar symptoms earlier in the year with my high mileage (225k) E46 M3. I had the following work done; centre bearing, guibo, clutch and DMF replaced, rear wheel bearings, diff rebuilt and driveshafts replaced (diff and driveshafts had quite a bit of play). The vibration on hard acceleration remained.

I ended up getting a secondhand propshaft from a breaker (which would have had a much lower mileage than mine!) and fitted that, which fixed it. There were no weights missing from my original propshaft, but there was a small amount of play in the joints, which I assume must have caused the vibration.

I'm going to get my original propshaft rebuilt and balanced, so that I know the drivetrain from the gearbox back has all been refreshed for many more miles to come smile

helix402

7,832 posts

181 months

Friday 17th March 2023
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WIL35 said:
I had similar symptoms earlier in the year with my high mileage (225k) E46 M3. I had the following work done; centre bearing, guibo, clutch and DMF replaced, rear wheel bearings, diff rebuilt and driveshafts replaced (diff and driveshafts had quite a bit of play). The vibration on hard acceleration remained.

I ended up getting a secondhand propshaft from a breaker (which would have had a much lower mileage than mine!) and fitted that, which fixed it. There were no weights missing from my original propshaft, but there was a small amount of play in the joints, which I assume must have caused the vibration.

I'm going to get my original propshaft rebuilt and balanced, so that I know the drivetrain from the gearbox back has all been refreshed for many more miles to come smile
If you read Redish’s stuff they say the spline at the end of the shaft wears.

dhutch

Original Poster:

14,198 posts

196 months

Friday 17th March 2023
quotequote all
Yeah, second garage in and I was left wondering what the next step was, as they where not able to offer any advice other than 'see if it gets worse' which with time it might, but it is bugging me now.

Feels funny how it has common on so suddenly, and isn't seemly getting rapidly worse.

Maybe it has just got to a tipping point where it can get into oscillation? Was that how it was for you WIL? How come you are getting a refurbished prop, is a new one prohibitively expensive or due to availability? Who are you using for the referb? Struggling to even find one for sale.

Helix, when talking about the spline, do you mean the rear drive shafts, rather than the prop? I think the propshaft is bolted flange both ends?

helix402

7,832 posts

181 months

Friday 17th March 2023
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dhutch said:
Yeah, second garage in and I was left wondering what the next step was, as they where not able to offer any advice other than 'see if it gets worse' which with time it might, but it is bugging me now.

Feels funny how it has common on so suddenly, and isn't seemly getting rapidly worse.

Maybe it has just got to a tipping point where it can get into oscillation? Was that how it was for you WIL? How come you are getting a refurbished prop, is a new one prohibitively expensive or due to availability? Who are you using for the referb? Struggling to even find one for sale.

Helix, when talking about the spline, do you mean the rear drive shafts, rather than the prop? I think the propshaft is bolted flange both ends?
I’m not suggesting this is the definite cause of your issue. The rear of the prop has a joint, which slides onto the splined end of the prop. The suggestion is the prop splines wear.

dhutch

Original Poster:

14,198 posts

196 months

Friday 17th March 2023
quotequote all
helix402 said:
I’m not suggesting this is the definite cause of your issue. The rear of the prop has a joint, which slides onto the splined end of the prop. The suggestion is the prop splines wear.
Ah right. Yes.

Forgot about the teliscopic element.

WIL35

525 posts

209 months

Wednesday 22nd March 2023
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dhutch said:
Yeah, second garage in and I was left wondering what the next step was, as they where not able to offer any advice other than 'see if it gets worse' which with time it might, but it is bugging me now.

Feels funny how it has common on so suddenly, and isn't seemly getting rapidly worse.

Maybe it has just got to a tipping point where it can get into oscillation? Was that how it was for you WIL? How come you are getting a refurbished prop, is a new one prohibitively expensive or due to availability? Who are you using for the referb? Struggling to even find one for sale.
My one had the classic centre prop bearing failure symptoms, could sort of feel it through the transmission tunnel when accelerating hard through 30-40mph. The support bearing was replaced but still had the same symptom.

There was only one M3 propshaft on eBay when I needed one, which was not too far away and was only £170, so I thought it was worth a try. I think new ones are around £900+.

I found this place http://www.jwtransmissions.co.uk/, again not too far from me. Just need to get around to dropping it off.

dhutch

Original Poster:

14,198 posts

196 months

Wednesday 22nd March 2023
quotequote all
WIL35 said:
My one had the classic centre prop bearing failure symptoms, could sort of feel it through the transmission tunnel when accelerating hard through 30-40mph. The support bearing was replaced but still had the same symptom.

There was only one M3 propshaft on eBay when I needed one, which was not too far away and was only £170, so I thought it was worth a try. I think new ones are around £900+.
Fair. And did it come on fairly suddenly, or was it gradual over months? Mine basically appeared overnight. Car is my daily so gets frequent use, millage is 190k.

dhutch

Original Poster:

14,198 posts

196 months

Thursday 27th July 2023
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So, continuing the progress on this, the noise fairly suddenly went from annoying and only under acceleration, to really fairl bad basically any time you took it through from 20mph to 40!

Yesterday the car had a new giubo coupling and centre bearing, as the old coupling didn't look amazing and the (fairly new) central bearing had completely collapsed, and the noise remained basically unchanged! Balls.

Tried to recreate it on the 4post, rear off the ground, handbrake on. Slightly inconclusive, but if you forget to turn the traction control off, the abs shakes the rear all over the place and it's clear the fwd rear subframe mounts (item2) are in a pretty bad way, rear diff mount also not amazing (item9) so currently waiting on the garage to confirm availability and book it back in for that.

Fast becoming awkward with work and childcare as it's my daily and our toddler can go in the kitcar. Plus it's rain loads this week!



Short clip of the movement!
https://youtu.be/u0tPYRWLts8

dhutch

Original Poster:

14,198 posts

196 months

Thursday 27th July 2023
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The other suggestion, having spoken to the local tame Z4 specialist is the propshaft spigot bearing. Item1 on the below. And ther it's unlikely to be the shot subframe bushes.

However the garage who changed the giubo assures said part was in good shape.


I plan to keep the car for a while yet, and have no issues replacing the subframe bushes, but also really need the car back on the road asap!

Sardonicus

18,928 posts

220 months

Thursday 27th July 2023
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Never at to change a prop spigot bush on a BMW , dont go chasing other causes yet scratchchin when you clearly have wkered diff mountings frown

dhutch

Original Poster:

14,198 posts

196 months

Thursday 27th July 2023
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Fair enough. I'm certainly not trying create work, just trying to get advice from various sources.

Plus it seems every part on this car is only available next day, rather than save day. Even if they send the right part first time.... Oh sorry, yes, it should have been this other part, we'll get out to, tomorrow..... Ahhhhgggg!

Every time it's another 'tomorrow' I have to get the train in, 10-15mins push bike each end, after arranging another way to drop the toddler off half an hours walk away. In the rain.

Sardonicus

18,928 posts

220 months

Thursday 27th July 2023
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If your talking dealers I dont blame them the E46 is getting on for 25 years old (I wouldnt stock non-fast moving parts either) we are lucky the parts are still available try that with Ford or Vauxhall for older models and you will be glad you own a BMW thumbup

dhutch

Original Poster:

14,198 posts

196 months

Friday 28th July 2023
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Talking 3rd party parts outlets, predominantly GT (General Traffic) as that's who most garages around here use.

I'm not at all supprised the parts are next day not same day for an older car, but it's also frustrating that garages don't seem at all keyed onto this, even when I suggest it's a possibility I've had times it's been booked a fortnight in advance for simple job, only be told they don't have the part and can't get it tomorrow. The last e46 rolled off Aug 2006 I believe, so 17 years ago, an older car but hardly rare or prehistoric.


d_a_n1979

8,096 posts

71 months

Friday 28th July 2023
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dhutch said:
Talking 3rd party parts outlets, predominantly GT (General Traffic) as that's who most garages around here use.

I'm not at all supprised the parts are next day not same day for an older car, but it's also frustrating that garages don't seem at all keyed onto this, even when I suggest it's a possibility I've had times it's been booked a fortnight in advance for simple job, only be told they don't have the part and can't get it tomorrow. The last e46 rolled off Aug 2006 I believe, so 17 years ago, an older car but hardly rare or prehistoric.
C3BMW and BMWmotormec are your friends re parts for the older BMWs

Both have their own website & are on eBay and they know what they're talking about, which helps a lot!

dhutch

Original Poster:

14,198 posts

196 months

Monday 7th August 2023
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Garage had decided the subframe and diff bushes job is larger than they want to take on, so have recommended another slightly larger repair shop t do the work (same place they recommended for some welding and painting work the car needs) but they are close for a fortnight while the two owners holiday with their children (fair enough) so I have another week of limping around trying to avoid any acceleration at all between 20 and 30mph.

Easy on sub 20mph roads, and trunk roads, but a pain anywhere else!

dhutch

Original Poster:

14,198 posts

196 months

Wednesday 25th October 2023
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Still ongoing, but booked in for the diff and subframe bushes on Monday.

Got a propshaft bush too, and will likely fit a new centre bearing.