I've bought something sh*t
Discussion
Whilst my Monster is awaiting repair I decided to buy a crap 37 year old scooter to 'have fun' on in the meantime.
Now I seem to remember that riding around Ibiza on a 50cc scooter in shorts and flipflops was a laugh, but 30 years later and in sunny Manchester..perhaps not so much.
Anyway..I also wanted something basic to try and fix up over winter.
This thing has numerous minor cosmetic problems (apart from generally looking crap) and probably some major problems too in the mechanical department. Some of these are becoming apparent pretty quickly.
First off, the vacuum fuel tap has been replaced by a regular fuel tap. This means I have to remember to turn it off or fuel pisses over the floor. If I want to fix this, do I need to find a vacuum fuel tap specific to this scooter, or will any generic 50cc scooter vacuum tap work?
I decided to change the gearbox oil as it was an easy job. There was only about 100cc of oil in it instead of 600cc.
I decided to have a bit of a test ride after doing this and everything was going fine. I even started to smile a bit. Obviously it's slow, but it reached an indicated 35mph and changed gear automatically OK.
After riding for about 15mins, something bad happened. The scooter bogged down when trying to rev it and an increasing amount of white smoke started issuing from the exhaust. It then stalled and more white smoke came from the exhaust/engine area as if about to catch fire. I looked down and saw the paint on the exhaust cover bubbling so something was obviously getting quite hot!
I decided to let things cool down whilst pushing the f
king thing 2 miles back home, looking like I'd nicked it.
I checked things over in an amateur fashion when I got home, and everything seemed OK. I took out the spark plug and that looked OK too.
I started it up again and it ran OK but after a few minutes, more white smoke. Not as much as when it stalled but more than I would think is normal.
So, any pointers to where I should start looking to fix this....or should I just bin it
Oh, here's a picture....
Now I seem to remember that riding around Ibiza on a 50cc scooter in shorts and flipflops was a laugh, but 30 years later and in sunny Manchester..perhaps not so much.
Anyway..I also wanted something basic to try and fix up over winter.
This thing has numerous minor cosmetic problems (apart from generally looking crap) and probably some major problems too in the mechanical department. Some of these are becoming apparent pretty quickly.
First off, the vacuum fuel tap has been replaced by a regular fuel tap. This means I have to remember to turn it off or fuel pisses over the floor. If I want to fix this, do I need to find a vacuum fuel tap specific to this scooter, or will any generic 50cc scooter vacuum tap work?
I decided to change the gearbox oil as it was an easy job. There was only about 100cc of oil in it instead of 600cc.
I decided to have a bit of a test ride after doing this and everything was going fine. I even started to smile a bit. Obviously it's slow, but it reached an indicated 35mph and changed gear automatically OK.
After riding for about 15mins, something bad happened. The scooter bogged down when trying to rev it and an increasing amount of white smoke started issuing from the exhaust. It then stalled and more white smoke came from the exhaust/engine area as if about to catch fire. I looked down and saw the paint on the exhaust cover bubbling so something was obviously getting quite hot!
I decided to let things cool down whilst pushing the f
king thing 2 miles back home, looking like I'd nicked it. I checked things over in an amateur fashion when I got home, and everything seemed OK. I took out the spark plug and that looked OK too.
I started it up again and it ran OK but after a few minutes, more white smoke. Not as much as when it stalled but more than I would think is normal.
So, any pointers to where I should start looking to fix this....or should I just bin it
Oh, here's a picture....
Moulder said:
Looks too nice to bin and easy enough to push. On that two miles out I bet women were wanting you and men were wanting to be you...
Is it two stroke? If so is it running on pre-mix or does it have an oil pump and tank?
I did get quite a few looks. The basket came in handy for helmet storage whilst pushing it home. I'd pushed it a few hundred yards juggling the helmet before it dawned on me though.Is it two stroke? If so is it running on pre-mix or does it have an oil pump and tank?
It's 2 stroke and has an oil pump and tank.
One more symptom is that when I rev it on the stand, the revs don't drop very quick. I'm lead to believe that this might be significant.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
It is aircooled and the smell was an oily petrol type smell. Definitely not steam.I've resigned myself to the fact that I'll probably suffer serious injury if I come off it, as there's no way I'll be wearing any protective clothing whilst there's the risk I may be pushing it around Salford again.
Rollin said:
Moulder said:
Looks too nice to bin and easy enough to push. On that two miles out I bet women were wanting you and men were wanting to be you...
Is it two stroke? If so is it running on pre-mix or does it have an oil pump and tank?
I did get quite a few looks. The basket came in handy for helmet storage whilst pushing it home. I'd pushed it a few hundred yards juggling the helmet before it dawned on me though.Is it two stroke? If so is it running on pre-mix or does it have an oil pump and tank?
It's 2 stroke and has an oil pump and tank.
I am going for the oil pump isn't pumping. May be gummed up, needs bleeding, or a blocked line. It is getting hot as it is running on just petrol.
Hard to check as when working it will only be pumping a minuscule amount. You could try running it on pre-mix and see if it still gets as hot as it did today. Not a massive trip as it sounds like it is in danger of going bang if that isn't the issue.
If the oil pump would be blocked the motor would seize pretty quick,
I am with Auntieroll with his crankshaft seal failure.
Also, check the intake seals by spraying brake cleaner around the carb / intake area when idling,
the revs dropping only slowly could be side-drafted air.
Where is the carb mounted, close to the crankcase or on an intake tube going to the cylinder ?
Does it have an intake membrane ?
Should have bought a Cub like any sane person.........looks cool, though, what is the official name, Imola, Pergola ?
I am with Auntieroll with his crankshaft seal failure.
Also, check the intake seals by spraying brake cleaner around the carb / intake area when idling,
the revs dropping only slowly could be side-drafted air.
Where is the carb mounted, close to the crankcase or on an intake tube going to the cylinder ?
Does it have an intake membrane ?
Should have bought a Cub like any sane person.........looks cool, though, what is the official name, Imola, Pergola ?
Thanks for the help so far. I'll check the carb mounting tomorrow. I seem to remember being able to move it around as if it's attached to something else rubber as well as the hose from the airbox.
Crank seals are £1.88 each so I may as well get them ordered and attempt fitting.
The model is a Passola.
The fuel tap has to be turned on for about a minute before it will kickstart, but it starts easily.
Crank seals are £1.88 each so I may as well get them ordered and attempt fitting.
The model is a Passola.
The fuel tap has to be turned on for about a minute before it will kickstart, but it starts easily.
Yamaha Pissola - remember having to work on the feckin things 33 years ago.
Exhaust nuts seizing, having to explain to a customer that it will cost mega bucks to fit a £6 rear tyre as the exhaust has to come off and exhaust studs drilling & replacing - I think we did do one tyre change with the wheel still on the bike.
Gynecologist skills needed to change any control cables as these have to be done through the headlight aperture.
35mph - wow, usually the exhaust gunks up with years of cheap 2 stroke oil giving 20mph max.
Once had one in pissing out oil from everywhere, the owner had put 3 bottles of Tesco's finest 2 stroke oil into the transmission filler & 'it still isn't full'.
Horrible little things - nothing like hiring a modern fat wheel moped in the sun.
Bookmarked your pain.
eta - crank seals, probably engine strip required as they will be lipped.
Exhaust nuts seizing, having to explain to a customer that it will cost mega bucks to fit a £6 rear tyre as the exhaust has to come off and exhaust studs drilling & replacing - I think we did do one tyre change with the wheel still on the bike.
Gynecologist skills needed to change any control cables as these have to be done through the headlight aperture.
35mph - wow, usually the exhaust gunks up with years of cheap 2 stroke oil giving 20mph max.
Once had one in pissing out oil from everywhere, the owner had put 3 bottles of Tesco's finest 2 stroke oil into the transmission filler & 'it still isn't full'.
Horrible little things - nothing like hiring a modern fat wheel moped in the sun.
Bookmarked your pain.
eta - crank seals, probably engine strip required as they will be lipped.
Edited by graham22 on Thursday 31st August 09:58
graham22 said:
Yamaha Pissola - remember having to work on the feckin things 33 years ago.
Exhaust nuts seizing, having to explain to a customer that it will cost mega bucks to fit a £6 rear tyre as the exhaust has to come off and exhaust studs drilling & replacing - I think we did do one tyre change with the wheel still on the bike.
Gynecologist skills needed to change any control cables as these have to be done through the headlight aperture.
35mph - wow, usually the exhaust gunks up with years of cheap 2 stroke oil giving 20mph max.
Once had one in pissing out oil from everywhere, the owner had put 3 bottles of Tesco's finest 2 stroke oil into the transmission filler & 'it still isn't full'.
Horrible little things - nothing like hiring a modern fat wheel moped in the sun.
Bookmarked your pain.
eta - crank seals, probably engine strip required as they will be lipped.
So you're not keen then? Exhaust nuts seizing, having to explain to a customer that it will cost mega bucks to fit a £6 rear tyre as the exhaust has to come off and exhaust studs drilling & replacing - I think we did do one tyre change with the wheel still on the bike.
Gynecologist skills needed to change any control cables as these have to be done through the headlight aperture.
35mph - wow, usually the exhaust gunks up with years of cheap 2 stroke oil giving 20mph max.
Once had one in pissing out oil from everywhere, the owner had put 3 bottles of Tesco's finest 2 stroke oil into the transmission filler & 'it still isn't full'.
Horrible little things - nothing like hiring a modern fat wheel moped in the sun.
Bookmarked your pain.
eta - crank seals, probably engine strip required as they will be lipped.
Edited by graham22 on Thursday 31st August 09:58
I'm going to try and remove the engine this weekend and see if I can fix it.
Bearing in mind that I'm a complete amateur (but keen and with nothing to lose), what work would you suggest I do whilst its out?
Looks like exhaust removal might be critical so I'll have a go at that this afternoon.
I have nothing to add other than I bought a 92K Suzuki AE50 for £30 last year, spent that again on eBay buying a new battery, spark plug etc . . . and I still haven't got the thing going as I've discovered the only way I'll get at the spark plug is by removing all of the bodywork and that's not as easy as I thought it might be.
So have faith, you're doing better than me!
So have faith, you're doing better than me!
Rollin said:
So you're not keen then?
I'm going to try and remove the engine this weekend and see if I can fix it.
Bearing in mind that I'm a complete amateur (but keen and with nothing to lose), what work would you suggest I do whilst its out?
Looks like exhaust removal might be critical so I'll have a go at that this afternoon.
Lots of release oil on the exhaust studs for some time prior to starting (or accept they'll break & drill out once motor on bench). I'm going to try and remove the engine this weekend and see if I can fix it.
Bearing in mind that I'm a complete amateur (but keen and with nothing to lose), what work would you suggest I do whilst its out?
Looks like exhaust removal might be critical so I'll have a go at that this afternoon.
I never took one to pieces as they were relatively new and didn't need mechanical work but I imagine the engine & running gear comes off the frame as 1 lump, once done, can do the rest on a bench.
Will need flywheel puller to remove that which I guess is behind dry cover on right (this is the failed seal probably drawing in air making it weak/hot). Left transmission cover will need removing & see what needs to come apart for access the failed seal here (where the extra oil is being drawn into the motor itself).
Thinking it through more though, most things I've done recently have been twins where the crank cases split horizontally, I assume this thing the cases split vertically, the seals may be able to be extracted 'outwards' if they are installed from this direction - seen this done with self tapers & simply pulled out with mole grips. If they fit from 'inside' the crank area then cases will need splitting for access.
Definitely not keen - too much work for too little reward !
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