2008 E87 Timing Chain warranty work?

[brian chim]

I'm sure its been mentioned over the years but the GF has a 2008 118d N47D20A with a rattling timing chain. We bought it in June last year and believe it has full BMW service history. The chain has started to rattle quite bad now and have phoned the local BMW dealer (Chester). I have asked if it is covered under a warranty repair but surprise surprise they wont commit to it. They have stated that if we put the car in for an exploratory inspection for £130 they will let us know the findings and if it is covered? Is this just a test to see if we take the chance? Surely they can tell me if its covered or not if that is the problem before I take it in.

My friend crashed his 1 series 2.5 years ago, a 57 plate M sport and while it was in getting the body work done they phoned and said they would rebuild the timing chain and any other warranty work they could do on it. He had new crank and pumps and chain. He hadn't had it serviced, never mind by BMW so they weren't bothered about service history etc. It had only 1 BMW service in 10 years and his Father in laws mate did the second service. He didn't even ask or know about any of this work they just sorted it out for him.

I am looking at doing the work myself if they don't do the work has anyone got a link to a "How To guide" that would help and maybe a list of parts please.

Many thanks Brian oh and the GF

[DailyHack]

I would just be certain it is the chain, these are noisy/chainy engines by nature...believe me I have had two of them now, and a 2008 118d aswell, both with relatively high miles 100k>

Noticed you were in Chester, there is a very good independent garage literally behind BMW main dealer in Sealand, called SJR Automotive (BMW/Mini Specialist) take it hear for a second opinion.

Edited by DailyHack on Thursday 11th April 15:34

[P700DEE]

Sorry you have an 11 year old car and you think you should get it fixed under warranty. I'd be very surprised if BMW agree to do anything other than offer free parts and this will be because the job with them will be £2.5K. Go independent, swallow the cost (more like £1200) After 10 years there is no way this could be manufacturing fault, its wear and tear.

[brian chim]

I don't think I will get it fixed under warranty and i understand that it is 11 years old. I've priced up doing the job myself as I'm competent to do this at around £300 inc a clutch and a days work but don't see why I have to. The thing is why did they do my mates and why charge me £130 to check this? All I asked was would it be covered under warranty with full BMW service history.

Its been in 2 months ago for a warranty job so they have shown willing to do a warranty job for free and there is enough documentation out there to prove that there is a fault and a safety issue. Its not my fault that we bought it with what was low mileage for a 118d at 100,000 and it now sits at 120,000 9 months later because she uses it for work.

[DailyHack]

brian chim said:

I don't think I will get it fixed under warranty and i understand that it is 11 years old. I've priced up doing the job myself as I'm competent to do this at around £300 inc a clutch and a days work but don't see why I have to. The thing is why did they do my mates and why charge me £130 to check this? All I asked was would it be covered under warranty with full BMW service history.

Its been in 2 months ago for a warranty job so they have shown willing to do a warranty job for free and there is enough documentation out there to prove that there is a fault and a safety issue. Its not my fault that we bought it with what was low mileage for a 118d at 100,000 and it now sits at 120,000 9 months later because she uses it for work.

Wish I was competent to do an engine out cam chain replacement, like I said earlier I would get a second opinion on it, as it may not be the chain, there is lots of things that rattle on these engines, water pumps for one is a similar noise and sometimes misdiagnosed.

[brian chim]

DailyHack said:

Wish I was competent to do an engine out cam chain replacement, like I said earlier I would get a second opinion on it, as it may not be the chain, there is lots of things that rattle on these engines, water pumps for one is a similar noise and sometimes misdiagnosed.

Its a good shout but the water pump is on the front of the engine and this is coming from the back by the gearbox. It doesn't change with depressing the clutch or not so it can only really be the timing chain. I could wait until May the 9th as my F30 is in for recall but worried it might give in by then.

Next question would be gearbox out or engine out? Have seen videos of people doing them with the engine in but think they were more the 3 and 5 series.

[DailyHack]

brian chim said:

Next question would be gearbox out or engine out? Have seen videos of people doing them with the engine in but think they were more the 3 and 5 series.

Very true about the pump, my chain was noisy on my 118d for 170,000 miles, and my now 318d 2012 has always been noisy since new, I bought it off my mum as it was her company car and stopped with the long oil services straight away from 56k, so known it, it's whole life, it's always "chuff chuffed".

Apparently it's the chain running over the guides, it is normal but looking on the net does get you thinking, I stopped worrying long ago and just double up the oil services now.

Yes your are right I think, 1ers are gearbox out as it's quite tight in there, 3er & 5ers I think you can move them out of the way as there is little more space.

I plan to do my 318d chain and tensioners around 200k as preventative maintenance, got every hope it will last, it gets oil every 8k and at the minute that's every 4/5 months, it's a busy car.

[Elliot2000]

brian chim said:

I don't think I will get it fixed under warranty and i understand that it is 11 years old. I've priced up doing the job myself as I'm competent to do this at around £300 inc a clutch and a days work but don't see why I have to. The thing is why did they do my mates and why charge me £130 to check this? All I asked was would it be covered under warranty with full BMW service history.

Its been in 2 months ago for a warranty job so they have shown willing to do a warranty job for free and there is enough documentation out there to prove that there is a fault and a safety issue. Its not my fault that we bought it with what was low mileage for a 118d at 100,000 and it now sits at 120,000 9 months later because she uses it for work.

I can only assume you had a recall, not warranty work a few months ago.

Your logic doesn’t stand up tbh, they done your mates car so should do yours too? And they were good enough to do some free work on it recently so they should do more free work on it?

Anyway, yes it’s normal practice to charge an investigation fee if your going for goodwill claims because bmw will want details and tests done to show exactly what’s at fault and what needs to be replaced, if after the dealer submits the report bmw then decline to offer anything towards repair then at least the dealer have covered their technicians labour time with the charge to you. Goodwill is completely discretionary on BMW’s part and their is no guarantee, if they do offer to help pay then they normally cover cost of parts and not the labour cost, and u get no warranty on the new parts as you haven’t paid for them. Most times cars your age have no chance, but every so often they do seem to pay out

Engine out is the quickest and easiest way imo - you can get engine and gearbox out on one of them within an hour after u have done a couple.

Bare in mind- early n47’s also used to damage the teeth for the chain on the crankshaft - can’t be repaired so would need a new crankshaft if it has, oil pump bolt is left hand thread too

[stevemcs]

£300 for parts including the clutch ? not BMW bits then. Its a full days job too, well 18 hours.

[Mr Tidy]

I can see why BMW might not want to accept this as warranty work on a car that's over 10 years old.

Back in 2014 they hadn't started the "Quality Enhancement" programme on them, which is largely why I sold my 2007 123d that I'd had since it was 3 months old - before it landed me with a silly bill!

Which did me a favour, as I've only had straight 6 N/A petrols since then.

[hilly10]

Search a thread on here someone did a N47 rebuild recently and documented on here

[brian chim]

My GF has just said to leave it till it dies and then we will buy a new car.

[DailyHack]

brian chim said:

My GF has just said to leave it till it dies and then we will buy a new car.

it may never die lots dont

[brian chim]

Correct, just she drives 120 miles a day round trip sometimes across to the coast of wales and it won't be the best of places to snap a chain, but it's her decision.

[Mr Tidy]

brian chim said:

My GF has just said to leave it till it dies and then we will buy a new car.

That's probably the best way to approach it - it may never happen. But keep the recovery cover up to date just in case.

[IT1GTR]

brian chim said:

I'm sure its been mentioned over the years but the GF has a 2008 118d N47D20A with a rattling timing chain. We bought it in June last year and believe it has full BMW service history. The chain has started to rattle quite bad now and have phoned the local BMW dealer (Chester). I have asked if it is covered under a warranty repair but surprise surprise they wont commit to it. They have stated that if we put the car in for an exploratory inspection for £130 they will let us know the findings and if it is covered? Is this just a test to see if we take the chance? Surely they can tell me if its covered or not if that is the problem before I take it in.

My friend crashed his 1 series 2.5 years ago, a 57 plate M sport and while it was in getting the body work done they phoned and said they would rebuild the timing chain and any other warranty work they could do on it. He had new crank and pumps and chain. He hadn't had it serviced, never mind by BMW so they weren't bothered about service history etc. It had only 1 BMW service in 10 years and his Father in laws mate did the second service. He didn't even ask or know about any of this work they just sorted it out for him.

I am looking at doing the work myself if they don't do the work has anyone got a link to a "How To guide" that would help and maybe a list of parts please.

Many thanks Brian oh and the GF

It's not a job that's fun to do yourself and will require a ramp (2 post probably).

The chain on these is at the back of the engine, not the front so you need to drop the exhaust, propshaft, gearbox, and the sump.

Bank on replacing clutch and flywheel also while it's all apart. In terms of waiting for it to go bang, it's almost guaranteed to happen at some point and will be terminal when it does.

Jay

[stevemcs]

2011 520 with 2 broken chains

[Mr Tidy]

stevemcs said:

2011 520 with 2 broken chains

Ouch - that looks expensive, or maybe potentially terminal.

What I can't understand is why BMW designed these engines with the cam-chain at the back! Surely it isn't significantly cheaper to manufacture than putting it on the front? So why did they do it?

It would be great to hear from anyone with any insight into that rationale - to me it just seems like complication for the sake of it!

[brian chim]

I've read somewhere that they designed the chain as a non service item so that it would last the lifetime of the car. That's why they put it to the back. They just put a crap chain on them, although I've. Done chains on most of my cars I've had from Japan imports to vw's.

[Elliot2000]

The chain was put at the back to lower the profile at the front of the engine to help meet crash regs with the space under the bonnet to top of the engine