Thief has a bad day
Discussion
vonhosen said:
And of course that sounds like a great system. 
And although I wouldn’t actually wish it on my worst enemy, I’d love you to experience what it’s like to be the victim of crime and having to deal with our criminal justice system as it is right now. We’ve had cars nicked, bikes torched, businesses robbed and occupied and the one constant was that the Police and the CJS were wholly inept and as the victim, you had seemingly less rights than those who choose to beak the law.So yes, breaking someone’s legs for robbing property is absolutely a great system, when the alternative is they’ll get a small fine and a course in anger management.
MrGman said:
Vonhosen, in your own personal opinion, do you think crime is out of control now?
Not addressed to me, but I'll offer my opinion if I may.The issue is that there is a growing number of people with nothing to lose.
Those of us with gainful employment, an adequate income and a safe home, we are easy to punish if we break the law.
You can fine us, we will regret the loss of the money but we have the ability to pay. You can give us a criminal record and we will regret the loss of respect that might engender and the restrictions that that might impose on our future aspirations. You can lock us up and we will regret the loss of freedom and liberty that we previously enjoyed.
But if I have no money then you can't fine me because I simply can't pay. If I have no self respect or aspirations for the future then a criminal record won't impair me. And if I live in a home that I can't afford to heat, where my safety is at risk from others and in a situation that I have no realistic hope of escaping from then what have I got to fear from going to jail.
You can look down upon, sneer and blame people who find themselves in that position if you wish, but how do we get them to "obey the law". Perhaps a better question would be how do you stop them from falling into that pit in the first place?
Wooda80 said:
MrGman said:
Vonhosen, in your own personal opinion, do you think crime is out of control now?
Not addressed to me, but I'll offer my opinion if I may.The issue is that there is a growing number of people with nothing to lose.
Those of us with gainful employment, an adequate income and a safe home, we are easy to punish if we break the law.
You can fine us, we will regret the loss of the money but we have the ability to pay. You can give us a criminal record and we will regret the loss of respect that might engender and the restrictions that that might impose on our future aspirations. You can lock us up and we will regret the loss of freedom and liberty that we previously enjoyed.
But if I have no money then you can't fine me because I simply can't pay. If I have no self respect or aspirations for the future then a criminal record won't impair me. And if I live in a home that I can't afford to heat, where my safety is at risk from others and in a situation that I have no realistic hope of escaping from then what have I got to fear from going to jail.
You can look down upon, sneer and blame people who find themselves in that position if you wish, but how do we get them to "obey the law". Perhaps a better question would be how do you stop them from falling into that pit in the first place?
Wooda80 said:
Not addressed to me, but I'll offer my opinion if I may.
The issue is that there is a growing number of people with nothing to lose.
Those of us with gainful employment, an adequate income and a safe home, we are easy to punish if we break the law.
You can fine us, we will regret the loss of the money but we have the ability to pay. You can give us a criminal record and we will regret the loss of respect that might engender and the restrictions that that might impose on our future aspirations. You can lock us up and we will regret the loss of freedom and liberty that we previously enjoyed.
But if I have no money then you can't fine me because I simply can't pay. If I have no self respect or aspirations for the future then a criminal record won't impair me. And if I live in a home that I can't afford to heat, where my safety is at risk from others and in a situation that I have no realistic hope of escaping from then what have I got to fear from going to jail.
You can look down upon, sneer and blame people who find themselves in that position if you wish, but how do we get them to "obey the law". Perhaps a better question would be how do you stop them from falling into that pit in the first place?
It's because of the reduction in effective policing that the "nothing to lose" group has grown. The issue is that there is a growing number of people with nothing to lose.
Those of us with gainful employment, an adequate income and a safe home, we are easy to punish if we break the law.
You can fine us, we will regret the loss of the money but we have the ability to pay. You can give us a criminal record and we will regret the loss of respect that might engender and the restrictions that that might impose on our future aspirations. You can lock us up and we will regret the loss of freedom and liberty that we previously enjoyed.
But if I have no money then you can't fine me because I simply can't pay. If I have no self respect or aspirations for the future then a criminal record won't impair me. And if I live in a home that I can't afford to heat, where my safety is at risk from others and in a situation that I have no realistic hope of escaping from then what have I got to fear from going to jail.
You can look down upon, sneer and blame people who find themselves in that position if you wish, but how do we get them to "obey the law". Perhaps a better question would be how do you stop them from falling into that pit in the first place?
I could point to three drug dealers and identify the suppliers for those dealers, I tried locally, but a quiet word was had and I was told that the police were aware.
2 years ago.
Bottom line is the police and the system need those dealers and the suppliers left alone, without the supply to the local addicts we would soon have some kind of day of the dead scene playing out while they all got more and more desperate for the fix, death, fighting over who has a stash left.
At the moment it's only thieving to feed the habit.
No cost to the government or police to sort out because the "have-slightly-more-because-we-work-hards" will pay.
Again, and again and again, both ends, the loss of property and the raiding of wallets for straying into a bus lane or infringement of a regulation.
People like me a pissed right off with it let me warn you of that.
yonex said:
vonhosen said:
It's not totally out of control, nor is it totally controlled. It's always controlled to varying degrees between those polar positions.
And we wonder why nothing ever improves?
s2racer said:
we still have relatively low crime bar this knife trend tho..
What about bike theft? 40,000 stolen last year. I know of 8 high end bikes that have been stolen by the same guy that had mine, police know him, have arrested him but nothing ever stands up in court, and only last week I spoke to someone who had his bike stolen by the same guy, so 6 months on from my loss he’s still doing it despite the police knowing he’s doing it.
I’m not blaming the police (although they weren’t great when I needed them) but there is a major problem there somewhere.
MrGman said:
What about bike theft? 40,000 stolen last year.
I know of 8 high end bikes that have been stolen by the same guy that had mine, police know him, have arrested him but nothing ever stands up in court, and only last week I spoke to someone who had his bike stolen by the same guy, so 6 months on from my loss he’s still doing it despite the police knowing he’s doing it.
I’m not blaming the police (although they weren’t great when I needed them) but there is a major problem there somewhere.
Yes, but what about that speeding offence....I know of 8 high end bikes that have been stolen by the same guy that had mine, police know him, have arrested him but nothing ever stands up in court, and only last week I spoke to someone who had his bike stolen by the same guy, so 6 months on from my loss he’s still doing it despite the police knowing he’s doing it.
I’m not blaming the police (although they weren’t great when I needed them) but there is a major problem there somewhere.
The lovely chap that stole my car had 20 years of previous convictions for car theft. I was a witness for the prosecution and had to put up with a £10 an hour defence lawyer and her attempts to try and convince the jury I was complicit in the offence when buying the car. Quite remarkable really, in the end the judge got fed up and shut her down. This wasn’t before my little outburst, that he was already in jail and had 20yrs previous, meaning the trial was stopped and I got a bit of a telling off. You see it’s just not on explaining why a career criminal should face proper justice, harms his defence.
Anyway. The scum bag got 18months, concurrent , which meant he would just serve the full term of his sentence. Therefore out in 6, a real deterrent. Meanwhile, the idiots (let’s call them the Police) gave out my address in court, to this loonies family, which led to a few interesting things. I took legal action against the Police but gave up after 12 months, they settled with a piddling amount, but if you try to sue these utter w
kers you’ll find out, as I did, it’s easier to train an eel to roll a cigarette. No respect for them, or the system. It’s FUBAR.
yonex said:
MrGman said:
What about bike theft? 40,000 stolen last year.
I know of 8 high end bikes that have been stolen by the same guy that had mine, police know him, have arrested him but nothing ever stands up in court, and only last week I spoke to someone who had his bike stolen by the same guy, so 6 months on from my loss he’s still doing it despite the police knowing he’s doing it.
I’m not blaming the police (although they weren’t great when I needed them) but there is a major problem there somewhere.
Yes, but what about that speeding offence....I know of 8 high end bikes that have been stolen by the same guy that had mine, police know him, have arrested him but nothing ever stands up in court, and only last week I spoke to someone who had his bike stolen by the same guy, so 6 months on from my loss he’s still doing it despite the police knowing he’s doing it.
I’m not blaming the police (although they weren’t great when I needed them) but there is a major problem there somewhere.
Getragdogleg said:
Which highlights how ridiculous the whole thing is.
At what point do crimes that the majority of people break become invalid?
Yet I don't view it as only effective if 100% of the people comply 100% of the time.At what point do crimes that the majority of people break become invalid?
The vast majority of the time I adhere to speed limits where I wouldn't be travelling at such a reduced speed without their existence & enforcement, so in that sense you could say they are pretty effective.
vonhosen said:
Yet I don't view it as only effective if 100% of the people comply 100% of the time.
The vast majority of the time I adhere to speed limits where I wouldn't be travelling at such a reduced speed without their existence & enforcement, so in that sense you could say they are pretty effective.
This world you live in, is it a result of recreational drug use?The vast majority of the time I adhere to speed limits where I wouldn't be travelling at such a reduced speed without their existence & enforcement, so in that sense you could say they are pretty effective.
I’m not really behind the argument that police will catch speeders but have no interest in catching thieves, laws are laws and speed limits have a purpose and should be enforced otherwise we’d all be flat out everywhere.
Speeders are just an easy catch.
What I don’t believe is correct is if you do 5mph over the limit you receive a similar punishment that some get for steeling something.
Speeders are just an easy catch.
What I don’t believe is correct is if you do 5mph over the limit you receive a similar punishment that some get for steeling something.
yonex said:
vonhosen said:
Yet I don't view it as only effective if 100% of the people comply 100% of the time.
The vast majority of the time I adhere to speed limits where I wouldn't be travelling at such a reduced speed without their existence & enforcement, so in that sense you could say they are pretty effective.
This world you live in, is it a result of recreational drug use?The vast majority of the time I adhere to speed limits where I wouldn't be travelling at such a reduced speed without their existence & enforcement, so in that sense you could say they are pretty effective.
Gassing Station | Biker Banter | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff