LED Headlights

LED Headlights

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Discussion

SILICONEKID345HP

14,997 posts

230 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
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ChimpOnGas said:
First off a serious word of warning teacher

When you first hook up these LED units, under no circumstances look directly at them before you secure them in the reflector bowls

Yes you guessed it folks, this is exactly what I did rolleyes

The result was I had a big yellow dot obscuring my vision for a good five minutes after, it was that bad I had to take a break from the project and at one point I thought a trip to A&E may me on the cards.

I AM NOT EXAGGERATING FOLKS, YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED!

Ok, enough teasing lets take a look at how these LED headlights look in the bright daylight against an H4 incandescent bulb.

At this point I should make it clear one side is the already vastly superior Philips Xtreme Vision H4 bulbs I've been so happy with up till now, the other is the 3200 LED unit all photographed in bright sunlight a few hours ago.

Here we are in dip beam:



It's also important to point out my reflector bowls are far from being in as "new condition". They're not bad you understand, I've seen a lot worse but being honest my reflectors are probably about 75% as reflective as a new set.


And here's what maim beam looks like:




And finally from a distance:




To be honest while the results in the above images look impressive the photos simply don't even come close to giving you a true representation of what these headlights deliver the real world.

Remember, the photos were taken earlier today on what has been a very bright and sunny day here, the only way I can describe the results so far is devastatingly brightyikescoolyikes

In fact I'd say they are even brighter than HiD!!!!!

Later today I'll be doing some dusk & nighttime testing, I'm sure from what I've seen already their performance will be amazing.

Lets just hope they don't dazzle oncoming drivers, if they do I'll be removing them quick smart.

Edited by ChimpOnGas on Saturday 25th October 16:42
Are the Chinese ones going to reliable ? Should i throw those away you recommended ?

SILICONEKID345HP

14,997 posts

230 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
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ChimpOnGas said:
Not happy with the bulbs you say, have you considered losing the Vee Dub boss eyed squinters and going back to proper round headlights?

You've fitted a set of lights designed for a completely different car, now you're saying the bulbs are at fault.

H4 bulbs are universal to literally thousands of different headlights that are designed to use H4 bulbs, Lupo headlights are universal to one small sub compact shopping car that gives out 65hp at best.

Go figure Einstein idea
Have you tested them on the road at night ? I`m wondering if you have been flashed by oncoming traffic .

Do they need relays and a new power source ?

The original TVR Chimaera lights were off a dirty great lorry so i don`t understand that comment regarding the Lupo lights .

SILICONEKID345HP

14,997 posts

230 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
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ChimpOnGas said:
You're not adding value to this post Sink Plunger, start your own if you cant make your shopping car headlights work on your 345hp monster.

Title it... "I'm a moaning dick, can you help?"

Best regards, Dave wavey
You are very good at doing that to my posts.. keep off and rant on about those 7" 1960`s lights somewhere else .laugh



http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...


Edited by SILICONEKID345HP on Saturday 25th October 22:32

ChimpOnGas

Original Poster:

9,637 posts

178 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
quotequote all
SILICONEKID345HP said:
ChimpOnGas said:
You're not adding value to this post Sink Plunger, start your own if you cant make your shopping car headlights work on your 345hp monster.

Title it... "I'm a moaning dick, can you help?"

Best regards, Dave wavey
You are very good at doing that to my posts.. keep off and rant on about those 7" 1960`s lights somewhere else .laugh

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
Fair enough Sink Plunger, you got me there old boy wink

SILICONEKID345HP

14,997 posts

230 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
quotequote all
ChimpOnGas said:
air enough Sink Plunger, you got me there old boy wink
Dave if they work for you i will buy a set ,the only thing is the heat sink units ,I`m wondering if they should be in a place a bit cooler with a bit of through draft for cooling .,it gets rather warm behind fibreglass .



MPoxon

5,329 posts

172 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
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Good write up Dave. I am looking forward to hearing how you get on with them. They certainly look better than the standard TVR candles

ChimpOnGas

Original Poster:

9,637 posts

178 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
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Purity14 said:
Interesting..
How much do they stick out in comparison to the standard h4 bulb?
The heat sinks look rather deep.!
The heat sinks screw to the back of the LED H4 bulb replacement unit so it sits between the back of the headlight & the wheel arch, and trust me there's plenty of space for it.

At the business end the LED bulb unit itself projects into the reflector bowl no deeper than a standard H4 incandescent bulb.

There's no such thing as a stupid question Purity14, but I've fitted them already and posted all the photographs on page 1 of this post, so hopefully its clear there are no fitment issues.

Cheers, Dave thumbup

ChimpOnGas

Original Poster:

9,637 posts

178 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
quotequote all
MPoxon said:
Good write up Dave. I am looking forward to hearing how you get on with them. They certaearsinly look better than the standard TVR candles
Cheers Matthew, right now they show promise but definitely need some adjustment.

So the Jury is still out mate.

TBH I think they are so bright they've just shown up a very slight adjustment issue I had already so some adjustment should sort it.

However, Rich's findings on HiD is revealing & respected, I'm listening because LED headlights are very new and it's highly probable they may still need some development?

It's worth reading this.........

sheel said:
Dave, excellent review, informative well written and precise, what you experienced on high beam was what I found using the HIDs hence my comments about going back to incandescent.
It will be interesting to hear how the beam setter views them when you have them checked out, with a tweak they maybe ok, in which case I will follow your lead in my mk3 conversion and rebuild.... top article
Rich
And then waiting to see what the beam setter tells us before anyone else stumps up for this LED H4 headlight kit.

ChimpOnGas

Original Poster:

9,637 posts

178 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
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Purity14 said:
Thanks Dave, I really enjoyed your write up and it has spurred me to purchase some for myself from that exact link.
The application wouldn't be a TVR specifically, so whilst I appreciate there is enough room in your scenario, I was just concerned for my own selfish purpose due to potential room in my scenario regarding the heatsink depth.

Hope that clears any misunderstanding up smile
Got it thumbup

The heat sink projection is about 55mm, hope this helps mate?

I'd be very interested in what vehicle you're proposing to put these lights in, and what headlight system it uses (reflector, projector ect).

If you can post your findings on how the LED bulbs perform in a different headlight/car it would help us all learn a bit more about where LED headlights work an where they could do with a bit more development.

Thanks, Dave.

Funk

26,254 posts

208 months

Sunday 26th October 2014
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Would these work on any car with this bulb type? My lights are like candles, I miss the xenons on my 123d and ST...

Wildfire

9,774 posts

251 months

Sunday 26th October 2014
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Hmmmmm... I wonder if I can put one half of these on my Ducati Monster?

Dr Mike Oxgreen

4,101 posts

164 months

Sunday 26th October 2014
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How difficult is it to adjust the beam angle on the Chimaera? Is it a simple case of turning a screw behind those access panels?

Also, is it possible that the two people who flashed you were simply receiving the full power of your correctly-aligned beams, but with your car pointing upwards as it drove up a slight crest in the road? Or your car was on the level but they were approaching from a lower point? HIDs can look incredibly bright to oncoming traffic in those situations, and I'm not sure that there's any solution to the problem.

Edited by Dr Mike Oxgreen on Sunday 26th October 06:59

Chuffmeister

3,597 posts

136 months

Sunday 26th October 2014
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ChimpOnGas said:
Very interesting and informative Christian, your professional knowledge on this subject is very welcome.

If reflector finish is that important these LED headlights may not be the answer on our cars, take a look at pretty much every Chimaera with standard headlight reflectors that are older than a year or so, and I guarantee you the silvering will be in a very degraded state.

I was looking at the TVR separate lens & reflector set up again today and they are completely open to moisture from the back, no winder they don't last 10 minutes.

Its difficult to make out from the picture of the photography lamp reflector you posted above what the finish is but would I be right to assume it's what they call an orange peel reflector?

The reason I ask is this is the type of reflector used in the more powerful modern LED torches.

Here's a comparison between smooth & orange peel reflectors:



My understanding is orange peel reflectors are good for a clean spread of localised light, but you want a smooth silvered reflector for decent throw.

You need decent throw with a headlight reflector, the beam is then controlled by the pattern cast into the glass lens.

TBH it's largely irreverent for me as the most I'm prepared do reflector wise is get my originals re-silvered.

Perhaps the beam setter session and the reflector re-silver I'm planning will be all these super bright lights need?

Only time will tell.
No, its a much finer finish than the orange peel effect. However, if you look at a standard bulb, the light emits from all directions and again through the glass of the bulb, before bouncing off the reflector. Flash bulbs are different again than car bulbs in shape. However, an LED emits light in a forward direction, so needs more scattering/ diffusion. The orange peel reflector would probably be ideal. Would be good to find some 7" ones to fit the Chim.

ChimpOnGas

Original Poster:

9,637 posts

178 months

Sunday 26th October 2014
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TBH the first thing I want to do is put a fresh set of reflectors on the car, then pop it on a beam setter so we can properly analyse the beam pattern and set the adjustment correctly.

After that I'll see if the main beam comes good, as it stands the dip is giving me vastly superior light to the Philips Xtreme Vision H4 incandescent bulbs, which themselves were a huge improvement over a standard H4 bulb.

These LED lights definitely show huge promise, even with my marginal reflectors and no adjustment whatsoever they work extremely well on dip and clearly offer many other advantages over incandescent bulbs. They are therefore well worth the effort to get them working perfectly which I genuinely feel is only a tweak or two away.

Making the assumption I could just fit a set of these units in my slightly tired reflectors and have them immediately working properly with no adjustment at all was at best a bit naive of me.

I'm going to start again taking a more professional and complete approach to the project using new reflectors and setting everything up on proper professional calibration equipment.

Only then can we really say for sure if these LED units are a good mod or a poorly developed gimmick that blinds other road users and doesn't deliver a proper full beam function.

I'm quietly optimistic these LED headlights can be made to work perfectly, the project just needs to be tackled properly.

Thanks for your interest and all the constructive comments, I'll update the post as things progress.

Dave.

m4tti

5,426 posts

154 months

Sunday 26th October 2014
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Aren't HID's and the new wave of headlight bulbs intended to be used in projector units? Does the old type headlamp lens construction affect the light emitted.

nawarne

3,088 posts

259 months

Sunday 26th October 2014
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Dave, interesting reading.

I've got a Mk.1 Tuscan S, and whilst the main beam units are HID (as standard), the dip beam are incandescent Hella 90mm lights (think these are deemed 'projector').

The main beam is fine with a good throw up the road and suitably bright. However, the dipped beam is poor - particularly when travelling along poorly lit A and B roads at night. Therefore, I'm interested in any further findings you post on here. The switch from dip to the HID main beam is, as you infer, slightly delayed as the arc 'strikes' in the HID units.

I see that Cree do H7 fittings, so could be the answer to my prayers!!
Nick

Dodsy

7,172 posts

226 months

Sunday 26th October 2014
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nawarne said:
Dave, interesting reading.

I've got a Mk.1 Tuscan S, and whilst the main beam units are HID (as standard), the dip beam are incandescent Hella 90mm lights (think these are deemed 'projector').

The main beam is fine with a good throw up the road and suitably bright. However, the dipped beam is poor - particularly when travelling along poorly lit A and B roads at night. Therefore, I'm interested in any further findings you post on here. The switch from dip to the HID main beam is, as you infer, slightly delayed as the arc 'strikes' in the HID units.

I see that Cree do H7 fittings, so could be the answer to my prayers!!
Nick
Thats interesting as every other car I've had has been the exact opposite. The dipped beam is HID and stays on all the time. Main beam is Halogen as it doesnt have that delay issue and when you go to main beam the dipped HIDs just stay on. HIDs wear out based on the number of times they are 'struck' rather than on the time they are on, so that setup would potentially significantly reduce the HID life as well. Seems very odd but then its TVR so not a surprise that its the wrong way around.


magpies

5,129 posts

181 months

Sunday 26th October 2014
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I've had led diving torches for a while and aware of the accelerating advances in this technology. I have been awaiting the time when leds (and just as importantly reflector design) would be good enough for vehicle headlights. My latest torch which I purchased 2 years ago has 3 leds producing 3000lumen is certainly bright enough for dip beam duties. With this torch the reflector is not suitable for automotive applications as the majority of the light is concentrated in a 6deg spot (also has a 50deg halo of general light)

The photo below shows a bmw with 55 watt dip beam, the torch beam floods over the rhs dip beam and is possible to see the 50deg halo too.




Pupp

12,206 posts

271 months

Monday 27th October 2014
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ChimpOnGas said:
I'm going to start again taking a more professional and complete approach to the project using new reflectors and setting everything up on proper professional calibration equipment.
Which in reality means adjusting height and direction right? What else is likley to be able to be 'calibrated'? confused

SirSagalot

176 posts

180 months

Monday 27th October 2014
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Thanks for taking the time to write such a useful article. I've just ordered a set too and will even try and fit it myself since your article suggests I might just be able to!