D.I.Y Camshaft replacement - how hard and long ?
Discussion
Apologies for the more than tardy reply.
Late is an understatement.
Thanks for all of your replies and advice on Camshaft replacement. Especially thanks to John who offered to help out. That's very generous and greatly appreciated. nice to see a lot of camaraderie in the marque and on here too.
Quick and late update.
I deleted the entirely broken plug extenders, changed the plugs to BPR6ES' and the performance has been transformed. I'll whip the plugs back out after a few more miles and examine the tips. Hopefully a little less fouling.
It's still ticking though and I can't find any exhaust leaks, at the gasket or in the headers. No soot lines and the ol' hosepipe stethoscope sounds the same everywhere.
It's high pitched, tinny and matched to the revs.
I think the next step is to whip off the rockers and do a rudimentary test to see how much the pushrods deflect the rockers. You never know, I may just have lost a rocker pad / toe / tip.
Thanks again for your help. If it turns out it does require a camshaft, I'd very much like to have a go.
Mark
Late is an understatement.
Thanks for all of your replies and advice on Camshaft replacement. Especially thanks to John who offered to help out. That's very generous and greatly appreciated. nice to see a lot of camaraderie in the marque and on here too.
Quick and late update.
I deleted the entirely broken plug extenders, changed the plugs to BPR6ES' and the performance has been transformed. I'll whip the plugs back out after a few more miles and examine the tips. Hopefully a little less fouling.
It's still ticking though and I can't find any exhaust leaks, at the gasket or in the headers. No soot lines and the ol' hosepipe stethoscope sounds the same everywhere.
It's high pitched, tinny and matched to the revs.
I think the next step is to whip off the rockers and do a rudimentary test to see how much the pushrods deflect the rockers. You never know, I may just have lost a rocker pad / toe / tip.
Thanks again for your help. If it turns out it does require a camshaft, I'd very much like to have a go.
Mark
Duly noted - thanks.
There are so many cam options as illustrated by many a heated discussion on here. There seem to be a few pretty good contenders.
In all likelihood, to me at least, the difference between the different cam grinds will be far less noticeable than the difference between a worn cam and a new cam, whatever I go for. If I do indeed need to.
There are so many cam options as illustrated by many a heated discussion on here. There seem to be a few pretty good contenders.
In all likelihood, to me at least, the difference between the different cam grinds will be far less noticeable than the difference between a worn cam and a new cam, whatever I go for. If I do indeed need to.
How many miles has the car done? What year is it?
What characteristics do you want from the cam, and ultimately, the car?
IMO if you're going to the bother of replacing the cam, take the engine out and replace the cam bearings too. Obviously new followers too. Depending on what cam you get, the springs will be new too. So you might as well give the whole engine a refresh. Bores honed, new rings, core plugs, etc.
The next one I rebuild I'll be getting top hatted liners. Wish I'd done it this time round, but y'live 'n'learn...
If you want any advice on cam choice, message me.
What characteristics do you want from the cam, and ultimately, the car?
IMO if you're going to the bother of replacing the cam, take the engine out and replace the cam bearings too. Obviously new followers too. Depending on what cam you get, the springs will be new too. So you might as well give the whole engine a refresh. Bores honed, new rings, core plugs, etc.
The next one I rebuild I'll be getting top hatted liners. Wish I'd done it this time round, but y'live 'n'learn...
If you want any advice on cam choice, message me.
Thanks Belle. It's always good to get first had info for these shafts and how they really perform.
Caduceus - I'm not expecting miracles or miraculous changes. The car runs pretty darn well at the moment. Just worried that the ticking is a worn component that's secreting fragments into the bearings. And the ticking / tappety sound just bugs me!
I've got no shunting and the car pulls smoothly. As the revs rise it certainly feels like it has a power-band.From 3-5.5k it absolutely sings. It's the only one I've ever been in, let alone driven. If it's on the original camshaft, I love it.
I'd say I'm not specifically looking for more power. For me, more power = less time at wide open throttle with the hairs on my neck standing up and grin like a Cheshire cat. On the road, for me at least, getting to high speeds as quick as possible due to huge power is less fun than working for it.
I want the feeling of driving the car at 10/10ths more of the time. It's already far more capable than the public roads will let me exploit on a day to day basis.
So I've plumped for brake and suspension upgrades over power.
The car is a 1998 450. 75k miles. Still running a 14CUX and dizzy.
It's green, so I' believe that makes it the fastest...
I'll defo do the followers with the shaft.
I'd love to whip the engine out and give it a complete refresh but it'll likely more than double the cost of the job...and where do you stop!! If I've got the block out..what about the gearbox and diff.
Mark
Caduceus - I'm not expecting miracles or miraculous changes. The car runs pretty darn well at the moment. Just worried that the ticking is a worn component that's secreting fragments into the bearings. And the ticking / tappety sound just bugs me!
I've got no shunting and the car pulls smoothly. As the revs rise it certainly feels like it has a power-band.From 3-5.5k it absolutely sings. It's the only one I've ever been in, let alone driven. If it's on the original camshaft, I love it.
I'd say I'm not specifically looking for more power. For me, more power = less time at wide open throttle with the hairs on my neck standing up and grin like a Cheshire cat. On the road, for me at least, getting to high speeds as quick as possible due to huge power is less fun than working for it.
I want the feeling of driving the car at 10/10ths more of the time. It's already far more capable than the public roads will let me exploit on a day to day basis.
So I've plumped for brake and suspension upgrades over power.
The car is a 1998 450. 75k miles. Still running a 14CUX and dizzy.
It's green, so I' believe that makes it the fastest...
I'll defo do the followers with the shaft.
I'd love to whip the engine out and give it a complete refresh but it'll likely more than double the cost of the job...and where do you stop!! If I've got the block out..what about the gearbox and diff.
Mark
Good idea, enjoy it for what it is.
I’ve just hit an extremely large hole in £5000 that started off as a cam swap but slowly escalated!
Has possibly gained me 50 bhp but was it worth it, probably not as I sold a perfectly good daily driver to fund it.
I would probably go forced induction if I wanted to chase ultimate performance but that a whole other topic in itself!.
I’ve just hit an extremely large hole in £5000 that started off as a cam swap but slowly escalated!
Has possibly gained me 50 bhp but was it worth it, probably not as I sold a perfectly good daily driver to fund it.
I would probably go forced induction if I wanted to chase ultimate performance but that a whole other topic in itself!.
Just been told the camshaft on my 450 looks like its shot - cams well rounded. So am interested in how long the job takes. As a poster above, I am meticulous and like to be sure everything is correct so I'm not a fast worker.
Unfortunately, garage didn't take any pics. What's best way to confirm worn cam? Lift rockers and measure the lift?
Its a 450. Would love to do this myself but not stripped an engine before - done oil pump gears, sump off and oil pick up, rocker gaskets etc and ancilliary stuff but not much else.
Above says you can do it with engine in the car. Is this a lot more difficult?
Are you working from beneath?
How difficult is it to pull an engine out and get it back in again on a Chimaera?
I've also been told that if the garage change the camshaft and find the bearings are shot it is a full engine rebuild job. Is that right? Why not just change the bearings? Perhaps because indicative that crank bearings and bores will also have similar wear?
Thanks.
Unfortunately, garage didn't take any pics. What's best way to confirm worn cam? Lift rockers and measure the lift?
Its a 450. Would love to do this myself but not stripped an engine before - done oil pump gears, sump off and oil pick up, rocker gaskets etc and ancilliary stuff but not much else.
Above says you can do it with engine in the car. Is this a lot more difficult?
Are you working from beneath?
How difficult is it to pull an engine out and get it back in again on a Chimaera?
I've also been told that if the garage change the camshaft and find the bearings are shot it is a full engine rebuild job. Is that right? Why not just change the bearings? Perhaps because indicative that crank bearings and bores will also have similar wear?
Thanks.
If the cam has been declared as shot then it should be possible to confirm just with a ‘push rod’ and a ruler. Remove plugs and both rocker shafts. Make a push rod long enough to poke well clear of the valve gear and make it with a flat top and add a cross bar so that you can’t accidentally drop it down into the engine. Pop the rod in so it sits in the first lifter. Position a ruler alongside the rod. As you turn the engine over (by hand) you can measure the lift of the cam. As soon as you find one that is significantly different to the others you will know it is cam change time. Better still if the garage can tell you which cam lobes are worn.
Doing in the car is a pain particularly if you have a bad back/old like me but doable.
You don’t work from beneath but you will need to undo some sump bolts and some timing case bolts are easier to access/see from below.
It is unlikely the bearings will be shot. The engine will need to come out to change them and special tools are required (note I have never found a tool to buy for this job). If the engine is otherwise in good health I would probably pull a main and bigend bearing or two for a quick look but anything more will depend on what you find at each stage.
Steve
Doing in the car is a pain particularly if you have a bad back/old like me but doable.
You don’t work from beneath but you will need to undo some sump bolts and some timing case bolts are easier to access/see from below.
It is unlikely the bearings will be shot. The engine will need to come out to change them and special tools are required (note I have never found a tool to buy for this job). If the engine is otherwise in good health I would probably pull a main and bigend bearing or two for a quick look but anything more will depend on what you find at each stage.
Steve
Id avoid taking the block out unless you plan to refresh the crank bearings, its an awkward job access wise.
Access to the cam is pretty good if you take off the bonnet, y piece, crossmember and cooling ancilliaries and work from the front of the car.
Will be awkward to degree the cam if you choose something non standard and worth bearing that in mind.
Access to the cam is pretty good if you take off the bonnet, y piece, crossmember and cooling ancilliaries and work from the front of the car.
Will be awkward to degree the cam if you choose something non standard and worth bearing that in mind.
phazed said:
Mileage Taylor?
If it is not outrageous, as Steve said, the bearings will likely be okay. Just check a few big ensd and a mains for bearing shell wear.
Also, very doable with the engine in situ. Easier with the Bonnet removed.
72000 milesIf it is not outrageous, as Steve said, the bearings will likely be okay. Just check a few big ensd and a mains for bearing shell wear.
Also, very doable with the engine in situ. Easier with the Bonnet removed.
How many hours we talking to strip, change cam and rebuild?
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