Discussion
I suppose worse things happen at sea but...
Anyway, last week my XK refused to start. Dashboard lights on as usual, fuel pump primes, then 'click'. Nada. This after a few similar times when it did this a few times but then did eventually start.
I've only had the car a month and it has a six-month AA warranty so I call the indy dealer who sold it to me. After ruling out a faulty 'Jaguar Watch' - it doesn't have it - they reckon the battery is the most likely. They're 120 miles away; I can't get the the car to them and they don't suggest sending their tech bloke over. So I call my breakdown service out and ask them to bring a new battery and fit it. They bring a nice new Exide battery (£150 paid up front) and fit it. Dashboard lights on as usual, fuel pump primes, then 'click'. Nada. The breakdown bloke is as surprised as I am. He's 95% certain it's the starter motor. At least that's covered by the warranty. The dealer is OK with me getting it recovered to a local garage so apart from having a £150 battery I don't need it should be easy and free from here.
The local garage take a chunk of the engine bay to pieces and discover that, actually, the starter motor is fine. They check it every which way and it's fine. They check the old battery and that's also fine. The actual fault is a blown fuse. And fuses are not covered by the warranty, so I have to pay the garage's bill.
And that, ladies and gentlemen, is how a fuse came to cost £403.
Anyway, last week my XK refused to start. Dashboard lights on as usual, fuel pump primes, then 'click'. Nada. This after a few similar times when it did this a few times but then did eventually start.
I've only had the car a month and it has a six-month AA warranty so I call the indy dealer who sold it to me. After ruling out a faulty 'Jaguar Watch' - it doesn't have it - they reckon the battery is the most likely. They're 120 miles away; I can't get the the car to them and they don't suggest sending their tech bloke over. So I call my breakdown service out and ask them to bring a new battery and fit it. They bring a nice new Exide battery (£150 paid up front) and fit it. Dashboard lights on as usual, fuel pump primes, then 'click'. Nada. The breakdown bloke is as surprised as I am. He's 95% certain it's the starter motor. At least that's covered by the warranty. The dealer is OK with me getting it recovered to a local garage so apart from having a £150 battery I don't need it should be easy and free from here.
The local garage take a chunk of the engine bay to pieces and discover that, actually, the starter motor is fine. They check it every which way and it's fine. They check the old battery and that's also fine. The actual fault is a blown fuse. And fuses are not covered by the warranty, so I have to pay the garage's bill.
And that, ladies and gentlemen, is how a fuse came to cost £403.
DuraAce said:
Ridiculous. What sort of 'mechanic' just throws parts at a car rather than doing some actual fault diagnosis? (a very poor one!)
What parts were just thrown at it?OP called breakdown and asked them to fit a battery, they did. It didn't fix the issue but that's not the breakdown companies fault.
The garage then thought it was the starter motor, checked it, not faulty so traced the fault back.
Ideally yes, they would have checked the fuses first (but then the OP should have reallllyyyyy
) but nobody has just thrown parts at it have they?Butter Face said:
OP called breakdown and asked them to fit a battery, they did. It didn't fix the issue but that's not the breakdown companies fault.
When I was talking over the findings with the dealer afterwards he said he was amazed that the breakdown guy didn't think to check the fuse. In his opinion that's where it went wrong. But then, HIS technicians didn't mention a fuse either when asked what might be causing the problem!He also said four things which I noted:
1) He said that If his technician had seen the car it might have been different. Perhaps, but my car was disabled in 120 miles away and I think it highly unlikely that he'd have downed tools to pop over, nor the dealer sent a low-loader to get it. Ergo, there was no choice but to go locally, and they were happy with that.
2) He said that “a low battery can go into ‘safe mode’ and this can blow a fuse”.
3) He said the fuse must have blown when the battery was changed – but the symptoms were exactly the same both before and after the battery change.
4) He said ‘Fuses can wear out’.
Comments welcome.
The moral of the story is that the innocent punter can have all the cover he thinks he needs, and that when his car breaks down he takes advice from people who know more than him, and he can do everything as right as he possibly can - but he still gets the bill with all the parties saying 'Not my fault guv'. I doubt there is much I can do about it.
As for why the fuse blew, nobody knows. I found it in front of the nearside widscreen wiper.
1) Who knows
2) Er, what?
3) Highly unlikely if the symptoms remained the same (did it still click when you tried to start it?)
4) Yes, fuses can fail due to fatigue - if you have the old fuse and the wire is visible, did it blow (large gap, black marks) or did it part gently?
The fuse would not be for the starter motor directly as that takes too much current for a fuse.
If there is a fuse which can interrupt the starting process, I would expect both the dealer and the indy garage to have checked it before looking elsewhere.
What was the location and function of the fuse that failed?
The breakdown guy was asked to fit a battery and that's what he did. I suspect his model specific knowledge would be limited.
Edit - actually, I might be wrong about the Starter motor fuse. This site seems to suggest you have a High Power Protection Module somewhere with 3 x 250 amp fuses!
http://www.jagrepair.com/JaguarXKXJSTypeNoStart.ht...
http://www.jagrepair.com/images/AutoRepairPhotos/H...
2) Er, what?
3) Highly unlikely if the symptoms remained the same (did it still click when you tried to start it?)
4) Yes, fuses can fail due to fatigue - if you have the old fuse and the wire is visible, did it blow (large gap, black marks) or did it part gently?
The fuse would not be for the starter motor directly as that takes too much current for a fuse.
If there is a fuse which can interrupt the starting process, I would expect both the dealer and the indy garage to have checked it before looking elsewhere.
What was the location and function of the fuse that failed?
The breakdown guy was asked to fit a battery and that's what he did. I suspect his model specific knowledge would be limited.
Edit - actually, I might be wrong about the Starter motor fuse. This site seems to suggest you have a High Power Protection Module somewhere with 3 x 250 amp fuses!
http://www.jagrepair.com/JaguarXKXJSTypeNoStart.ht...
http://www.jagrepair.com/images/AutoRepairPhotos/H...
Edited by ctdctd on Friday 21st July 10:22
ctdctd said:
1) Who knows
2) Er, what?
3) Highly unlikely if the symptoms remained the same (did it still click when you tried to start it?)
4) Yes, fuses can fail due to fatigue - if you have the old fuse and the wire is visible, did it blow (large gap, black marks) or did it part gently?
On 3, yes, the symptoms were exactly the same, as described. Changing the battery made absolutely no difference to anything that I could tell.2) Er, what?
3) Highly unlikely if the symptoms remained the same (did it still click when you tried to start it?)
4) Yes, fuses can fail due to fatigue - if you have the old fuse and the wire is visible, did it blow (large gap, black marks) or did it part gently?
On 4, it's a clear spade type with '25' on the top which I presume means 25A, and there's been a small black explosion on one side about 2 x 3mm across. The garage man did say it had properly blown - presumably the first time I tried to start the car last week.
Maybe I'll stick a 0BA bolt in it to be on the safe side
So yesterday the car wouldn't start again - exactly the same symptoms as before. I sprang out with my trusty packet of fuses, changed #19, and - still wouldn't start. Arse.
The problem seems to be entirely random. The workaround is to get out, lock the car, unlock it, get back in and try again. After 2- 3 attempts it starts. So we seem to have a random electrical problem. The dealer has offered to take a look at it - but as well as taking a day and 230 miles, there's no guarantee the car will play up while they're looking at it, or that if it does they will find the fault - and what if it needs a new part? I can hardly camp in the showroom...
The problem seems to be entirely random. The workaround is to get out, lock the car, unlock it, get back in and try again. After 2- 3 attempts it starts. So we seem to have a random electrical problem. The dealer has offered to take a look at it - but as well as taking a day and 230 miles, there's no guarantee the car will play up while they're looking at it, or that if it does they will find the fault - and what if it needs a new part? I can hardly camp in the showroom...
Thanks Steve.
I changed the fuse but on testing the old one found it was fine - so it's not the fuse.
I tried both fobs - no difference. One is original, the other programmed new by the dealer when I bought the car.
A few days ago I did once glimpse a warning message about the steering lock, and in fact when the breakdown man came to recover it last time (backwards on a spec-lift) we couldn't get the lock to engage and he had to tie the wheel up with rope. But I haven't seen the message since, including yesterday when it was really playing up.
Tried re-shoving it into 'P' but this didn't help.
I think I have to let the dealer try to fix it (I'm waiting for their technician to contact me), or persuade them to let me take it to a Jaguar main dealer 12 miles away. Re the first idea, I've suggested they collect it on a trailer and then they could keep it for a few days, because I think the chance of their finding and fixing the fault while I wait are slim.
I changed the fuse but on testing the old one found it was fine - so it's not the fuse.
I tried both fobs - no difference. One is original, the other programmed new by the dealer when I bought the car.
A few days ago I did once glimpse a warning message about the steering lock, and in fact when the breakdown man came to recover it last time (backwards on a spec-lift) we couldn't get the lock to engage and he had to tie the wheel up with rope. But I haven't seen the message since, including yesterday when it was really playing up.
Tried re-shoving it into 'P' but this didn't help.
I think I have to let the dealer try to fix it (I'm waiting for their technician to contact me), or persuade them to let me take it to a Jaguar main dealer 12 miles away. Re the first idea, I've suggested they collect it on a trailer and then they could keep it for a few days, because I think the chance of their finding and fixing the fault while I wait are slim.
Well the wheels have finally clunked round and tomorrow I get to ride from Essex to Buckinghamshire in an AA recovery truck. Not that I particularly want to, but because they want me to collect a courtesy car, which I don't really need, so that they don't have to deliver the XK back to me. Still, what's another two round trips and 10 hours of my time eh? Let's just hope they fix the bloody thing.
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