Griff 500 nut and bolt rebuild

Griff 500 nut and bolt rebuild

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Discussion

Olly-B

Original Poster:

143 posts

245 months

Monday 2nd April 2018
quotequote all
Hi all,

I've had a P reg Griff for 15 years that's due for a proper rebuild to showroom standard. I hope I can get feed back on who to choose for:-
a) Chassis retsoration
ai)Suspension and brakes
b) Body strip and repaint
c)Interior retrim
d)Engine rebuild to 400BHP ++ (must be a rover V8)


It's been years since I posted here but briefly, I've owned my '96 Giff for 15 years and I'd like to have a nut a bolt resto on it. For half of that 15 years it was a daily driver even in the snow. I've driven 60,000 miles in it and never slowly... Austec and TVR power tuned it and I fitted Nitrons and had a nice front and rear light conversion. The electrics were sorted and alarms upgraded.

Now its due a full rebuild. I have seen TVR specialists offering excellent modded chassis, non Rover engines etc but that's not for me. Frankly if I want something that doesn't drive like a TVR I'll buy a a car that's not a TVR

Whilst reading around I see that the reduced availability and rising values of Griffs means that members have been through this process ahead of me in the last five years.

Boiled down - is there a one or two stop stop shop/s or should I move the car between specialists ( which I suspect is best per task but there is a break in continuity/synergy)

For instance, a good chassis replacement company is easy to find but who do I trust to strip and repaint the body which has stars, crazing etc. Who still builds Rover V8s to + 400bhp for TVRs. Who can re-upholster the interior exactly as per 1996?

I'm not alone and others are following. I respect the old brute too much to mod it nor let it rot away so please tell me who you think is the very best ( monet no object)

Many thanks

Oliver

spagbogdog

764 posts

259 months

Monday 2nd April 2018
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Good post Olly..pretty much the exact same is on my radar..thus be really interesting to hear the suggestions..

Must admit to being more swayed to Sportmotive or Topcats atm tho and LS power..simply due to (or what appears to be) the lack of onward ‘fettling’....and ‘surety’ that it ain’t gonna go ‘pop’...

seaside

110 posts

125 months

Tuesday 3rd April 2018
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Personally I have used RT Racing for chassis, suspension,brakes, etc.; Dave the Trimmer for the interior; Option1 for exterior bodywork/respray; and Topcats for general maintenance, upkeep, and fettling as needed and I would recommend them all for their respective skills and being generally good guys all around.... and if you did go the LS route then Topcats could certainly sort you out.

I did also see/read that Central TVR do a one-stop package for refurbs which I don't think includes an engine rebuild but seems to have received pretty good reviews.

anonymous-user

53 months

Tuesday 3rd April 2018
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It very much depends on your budget and how much time you can invest in the project IMO. I have just gone through this and spoke to loads of specialists for various things. I found there was a huge difference in what various people charge, some of these costs, for me, seem to be more about reputation than any technical advantage over one another? It can be easier to just leave it with one garage and let them do all the leg work, but make sure that they give you a firm price, in writing, so you don't have any surprises at the end!

I can definitely recommend Straight6, Dave the Trimmer, John Eales and TVR Parts. Suspension, I called Ben Lang and ordered his mk4 dampers, so many options depending upon use and budget. There are very good paintwork shops all over the country, I found someone fairly local who has extensive TVR experience. I'll be picking mine up in two weeks and you are welcome to come and see it. You probably already know, having owned them that TVR's are just big mechanical jigsaw puzzles and there is nothing too complicated about them.

Check out my thread, it details most of it. I wish you all the very best on your rebuild.

Edited by anonymous-user on Tuesday 3rd April 12:24

chris52

1,560 posts

182 months

Tuesday 3rd April 2018
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400bhp is going to be tricky unless you go forced induction. The rest is fairly straight forward. The big thing you have to remember is that if you go to the extremes and spend a fortune on Paint trim etc you then can end up being a bit precious about using the car for fear of scratching/marking it.
Chris

Matthew Poxon

5,329 posts

172 months

Tuesday 3rd April 2018
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My preference would be as follows based on my experiences:

a) Chassis restoration
Mine was done at RT Racing, good result and pleased with it. I would have a look at TVR Power now though as they are offering upgraded chassis with a 15??? year warranty. Check with Dom for exact details. Don't forget if you want to go all out then Sportmotive do a Evolution chassis.

ai)Suspension and brakes
Lots of options here. I went for Alcon 4pots and the mk4 Bilsteins on mine and I am happy. More reading here:
https://matthewpoxon.wordpress.com/2015/07/26/brak...
https://matthewpoxon.wordpress.com/2017/02/28/rear...

b) Body strip and repaint
No question for me - Surface and Design
https://matthewpoxon.wordpress.com/2017/11/17/resp...
https://matthewpoxon.wordpress.com/2017/12/22/sira...

c)Interior retrim
Dave the Trimmer for me. I have seen some excellent work come out of Trim Unique, although no personal experience with them.
https://matthewpoxon.wordpress.com/2016/02/29/cerb...

d)Engine rebuild to 400BHP ++ (must be a rover V8)
It would be worth asking around regarding this. You need to consider ECU here as well. If I were in your shoes I would go to TVR Power and ask them for a new engine + ECU and be very specific with what you want. You here too often of the engine building blaming the mapper and vice versa at least TVR Power is a one stop shop with one accountable party.

ray von

2,912 posts

251 months

Tuesday 3rd April 2018
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I know you said money no object, but as you say you haven't posted for years are you aware that little lot could run to around £30k?

LeeHodges

399 posts

282 months

Wednesday 4th April 2018
quotequote all
Matthew Poxon said:
My preference would be as follows based on my experiences:


b) Body strip and repaint
No question for me - Surface and Design
https://matthewpoxon.wordpress.com/2017/11/17/resp...
https://matthewpoxon.wordpress.com/2017/12/22/sira...
Hi Matthew

I am planning to convert my Griff to Corrado mirrors also but don't like the extenders as they make the mirrors stick up/out too far imho. Was the custom solution complex for SD to complete or was it straight forward? I spoke to someone at Central and they were not convinced about it working without cracking at a later date.

Cheers,

Lee

black_potato

282 posts

238 months

Wednesday 4th April 2018
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ray von said:
I know you said money no object, but as you say you haven't posted for years are you aware that little lot could run to around £30k?
That was my thought.. A quick calculation came to a yikes number ,still if she is a keeper she maybe worth it biggrin



900T-R

20,404 posts

256 months

Wednesday 4th April 2018
quotequote all
" I want something that doesn't drive like a TVR I'll buy a car that's not a TVR"

Echo the sentiment, but I feel your 400+ BHP requirement is somewhat at odds with this (not to mention the limits of the OEM chassis which can barely contain the torque of the boggo 5 litre engine to begin with).

I would strongly advise to reconsider this point if you want to retain the driving character of the Griffith. As an aside, I see people spending huge amountsand going through no end of trounle for what basically amounts to bar room bragging rights, then find themselves not driving their car very often because it's not all that nice to drive on the road, andd ending up selling after 1-2 years at a massive loss.

Matthew Poxon

5,329 posts

172 months

Wednesday 4th April 2018
quotequote all
LeeHodges said:
Hi Matthew

I am planning to convert my Griff to Corrado mirrors also but don't like the extenders as they make the mirrors stick up/out too far imho. Was the custom solution complex for SD to complete or was it straight forward? I spoke to someone at Central and they were not convinced about it working without cracking at a later date.

Cheers,

Lee
Hi Lee,

I agree with you on the extenders, never really liked them. I don't recall the conversion being overly complex, bearing in mind it was already in for a full respray. Maybe have a chat with S&D and Central to gather some more info. All the later Cerberas and T-cars have the mirrors directly attached to the doors and they do not suffer from cracking so I am not sure I understand what the issue might be.

Matthew

Matthew Poxon

5,329 posts

172 months

Wednesday 4th April 2018
quotequote all
900T-R said:
I would strongly advise to reconsider this point if you want to retain the driving character of the Griffith. As an aside, I see people spending huge amountsand going through no end of trounle for what basically amounts to bar room bragging rights, then find themselves not driving their car very often because it's not all that nice to drive on the road, andd ending up selling after 1-2 years at a massive loss.
I agree with you on that Eric. As a general observation those who buy a TVR and decide to plough load of cash into it always seem to end up selling shortly after and I can never quite work it out as you would never get anywhere near the money spend back on it after sale. I can only imagine people are trying to transform the car into something that it will never be, fail and then sell.

My personal preference is to spend money on one specific areas at a time, get that right and then move onto the next. More often than not in my experience of modifying and enhancing TVRs it is not a simple case of do a mod and then move onto the next. The mods often require time to bed in and then revisit make a few small changes to get it spot on and fit for purpose.

The OP seems keen on oginaliy both with trim and chassis but a 400BHP engine is not going to be remotely original. 400BHP will either require larger going beyond 5.0 litre in NA form or going forced induction. You could probably get 350BHP out of the original engine and ECU if you went to town porting gas flowing etc. I have just under 330BHP out of mine with stock internals (aside from cam), and everything from the ACT catalogue bolted on. For road use mine does not need any more power!

My advice to the OP would be to get the original engine rebuilt by TVR Power or JE and be done with it. That should yield around 330BHP and will look completely original. 400BHP is a huge ask and there will need to be compromises made on originality for sure.

citizen smith

743 posts

180 months

Wednesday 4th April 2018
quotequote all
Matthew Poxon said:
Hi Lee,

I agree with you on the extenders, never really liked them. I don't recall the conversion being overly complex, bearing in mind it was already in for a full respray. Maybe have a chat with S&D and Central to gather some more info. All the later Cerberas and T-cars have the mirrors directly attached to the doors and they do not suffer from cracking so I am not sure I understand what the issue might be.

Matthew
I've seen a conversion on RaceTech TVR,s website.

Olly-B

Original Poster:

143 posts

245 months

Saturday 7th April 2018
quotequote all
Hi Everybody,

Many thanks for all the great advice. I will be following it up. £30k is where I estimated so no shocks there. Just want to make sure I give it to the right people.

After hearing your views on 400bhp and after speaking with others I now realize that it's unnecessary and over the top. I'll settle for a well sorted 320bhp or maybe 350bhp if achievable without changing the outward appearance. Old Rolling road test show her running at 245bhp in the past so add 75/100bhp to that and I should be able to feel the difference....

I'll post back when I have moved things along

Cheers!

Oliver

ray von

2,912 posts

251 months

Saturday 7th April 2018
quotequote all
Olly-B said:
Hi Everybody,

£30k is where I estimated so no shocks there. Just want to make sure I give it to the right people.

Cheers!

Oliver
You're off to a good start in that you have a realistic budget/idea what the costs are. The amount of people who have no idea what things cost nowadays is staggering.
The second sentence I snipped is going to give you the most problems. There are some decent recommendations on this thread but also some whose work I've seen and wouldn't let them anywhere near my car, there are some mentioned on here who have worked on my cars and I wouldn't use them again. It's a bit of a lottery.
The only things I would say, may have been said already, whoever does the engine let them do the ECU side as well.
Some people are excellent interior trimmers but not so good at the roof and fitting seals.
Feel free to pm me

ChimpOnGas

9,637 posts

178 months

Monday 9th April 2018
quotequote all
900T-R said:
" I want something that doesn't drive like a TVR I'll buy a car that's not a TVR"

Echo the sentiment, but I feel your 400+ BHP requirement is somewhat at odds with this (not to mention the limits of the OEM chassis which can barely contain the torque of the boggo 5 litre engine to begin with).

I would strongly advise to reconsider this point if you want to retain the driving character of the Griffith. As an aside, I see people spending huge amountsand going through no end of trounle for what basically amounts to bar room bragging rights, then find themselves not driving their car very often because it's not all that nice to drive on the road, andd ending up selling after 1-2 years at a massive loss.
This is an extremely incisive post, the OP needs to listen to these wise words and those of Mathew Poxon yes.



mk1fan

10,507 posts

224 months

Tuesday 10th April 2018
quotequote all
Olly-B said:
a proper rebuild to showroom standard.
I'd aim a lot higher than the [frankly] poor factory standards.

400bhp+ out of a RV8 is going to be hard without either forced induction or huge money on bespoke components inc management. All of which isn't very original nor in keeping with the original character.

Best of luck with it.

Always good to hear a car is being a, used and b, looked after.

ThePrisoner

1,055 posts

207 months

Tuesday 10th April 2018
quotequote all
ray von said:
Olly-B said:
Hi Everybody,

£30k is where I estimated so no shocks there. Just want to make sure I give it to the right people.

Cheers!

Oliver
You're off to a good start in that you have a realistic budget/idea what the costs are. The amount of people who have no idea what things cost nowadays is staggering.
The second sentence I snipped is going to give you the most problems. There are some decent recommendations on this thread but also some whose work I've seen and wouldn't let them anywhere near my car, there are some mentioned on here who have worked on my cars and I wouldn't use them again. It's a bit of a lottery.
The only things I would say, may have been said already, whoever does the engine let them do the ECU side as well.
Some people are excellent interior trimmers but not so good at the roof and fitting seals.
Feel free to pm me
OP. Have a look at my old PreCat on Str8six's website. It was a ' Roll in and Roll out ' turn key restoration. No expense spared to keep it original ( Of course it isn't now). Top work by Jason and the lads, only to be let down by one of his third party suppliers.( Paint). As mentioned above , 30K is about right. A little bit of advice:

Don't get carried away with the Resto, otherwise it could add another 5 K to the bill.


Edited by ThePrisoner on Tuesday 10th April 21:41

BIG DUNC

1,918 posts

222 months

Tuesday 10th April 2018
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Another factor is location. OP, say where in the country you are.

Its OK saying "I want the best", but if it is at the other end of the country then you give it to them and maybe don't see it for months.

It is much better if it is within a sensible drive so you can pop over as often as you want, see progress, chat to the lads who are actually working on it (rather than the boss) and discuss where they are at and how you want them to tack the current issues and the next stage.

You mentioned Austec which may suggest you are in the South East. In which case you are looking at a very different pool of specialists to if you were in the North West.

Pete Mac

755 posts

136 months

Monday 16th April 2018
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Olly

I'm doing it myself, very slowly as I've had other projects but hoping to really get stuck in now I've retired.

https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

You are not a million miles from me, happy to compare notes if you want to mail me.

Cheers

Pete