Thirsty Discovery and Z4 thread

[bakerstreet]

C70R said:

Another day, another rubbish L322 for sale.

It looked promising, and a call to the dealer seemed to reinforce the condition that the photos were showing. The listing was limited and the car was top of my budget, but stated "full service history". When I asked him to send detailed photos of the rear arches and the last couple of pages of the service book, there was suddenly a "mistake" in the listing. It had no service history.

This is painful.

Thats just dealing with car traders in general. Not really L322 or LR specific.

[bakerstreet]

BlackStang5point0 said:

Just to chip in here personally I'd try and join some L322 forums / fb groups and see whats for sale as chances are you will be buying off an enthusiast that may have addressed all the usual issues and / or will be able to demonstrate a load of preventative maint has been carried out. Buying one off some random private punter / used car dealer is asking for trouble IMHO.

Buying from someone on a FB group/forum and badging them as an enthusiast means absolutely nothing. I've been on the D3/4 FB group for years and advice of 'chuck some anti judder' in the gearbox is basically bodge, but its ok, because they are an 'enthusiast'

Treat the forums as an outlet for purchase prospecting, but no way would I expect the car to be significantly better.

However the part about evidence of crucial repairs is right though. For L322s it would be.

Gearbox
Turbos
Suspension (Air bags, compressors and sensors are common failure points)

The rust and fuel prices will continue to make L322 prices tumble. The rust on the arches isn't exactly a quick or an easy fix. Finger in the air could be £500 a side depending on how bad it is. Also, people just wont spend that on cars that are now costing £150+ to fill up and even the TD6s only do about 25mpg average. 4.4 BMW V8 is probably about 15!

[bakerstreet]

C70R said:

There seem to be more Range Rover Sports in my price bracket, which is a more logical and direct comparison to the Cayenne.

Am I more or less likely to get a good Sport at my budget?

The RRS is very much the baby of the group if you compare if you D3/4, L322 and L405 and I suspect even the P38 will feel bigger inside than a Sport. Also there is much less of a sense of occasion in a Sport compared to even an early shabby L322.

The early 2.7s are gutless IMO and are one of those cars that errr towards needing a remap rather than just wanting it. All the usual LR issues.

Gearboxes. Torque converters fail at £1400 all in and rebuilt 6Sp box is £2.5k. Later 8Sp car is better
Suspension arms
Air Compressor, air tank, valvle blocks, but the air bags are quite robust
Sills rotting out and its all hidden behind the arch liners
EGRs/glowplugs can cause issues too and on 3.0s you can't delete and map them out either.

3.0 is much more powerful, but be prepared to shell out £7k if the crank snaps on the 3.0 engine. They have a very poor reputation.

Interior in black is super drab imo and beige interior cars do sell better IME. Also of that era, I think the Sport interior was the worst from LR.

Boot on the sport is small compared to L322 and D3/4 and its no where near as practical as the D3/4 and that is why its cheaper. Seats don't fold flat either and that was a no no for me.

However, I am now looking at Sports as they are good value compared to

Edited by bakerstreet on Monday 20th June 10:08

[C70R]

bakerstreet said:

C70R said:

There seem to be more Range Rover Sports in my price bracket, which is a more logical and direct comparison to the Cayenne.

Am I more or less likely to get a good Sport at my budget?

The RRS is very much the baby of the group if you compare if you D3/4, L322 and L405 and I suspect even the P38 will feel bigger inside than a Sport. Also there is much less of a sense of occasion in a Sport compared to even an early shabby L322.

The early 2.7s are gutless IMO and are one of those cars that errr towards needing a remap rather than just wanting it. All the usual LR issues.

Gearboxes. Torque converters fail at £1400 all in and rebuilt 6Sp box is £3.5k. Later 8Sp car is better
Suspension arms
Air Compressor, air tank, valvle blocks, but the air bags are quite robust
Sills rotting out and its all hidden behind the arch liners
EGRs/glowplugs can cause issues too and on 3.0s you can't delete and map them out either.

3.0 is much more powerful, but be prepared to shell out £7k if the crank snaps on the 3.0 engine. They have a very poor reputation.

Interior in black is super drab imo and beige interior cars do sell better IME. Also of that era, I think the Sport interior was the worst from LR.

Boot on the sport is small compared to L322 and D3/4 and its no where near as practical as the D3/4 and that is why its cheaper. Seats don't fold flat either and that was a no no for me.

However, I am now looking at Sports as they are good value compared to

I'm not buying a diesel...

[C70R]

bakerstreet said:

C70R said:

Another day, another rubbish L322 for sale.

It looked promising, and a call to the dealer seemed to reinforce the condition that the photos were showing. The listing was limited and the car was top of my budget, but stated "full service history". When I asked him to send detailed photos of the rear arches and the last couple of pages of the service book, there was suddenly a "mistake" in the listing. It had no service history.

This is painful.

Thats just dealing with car traders in general. Not really L322 or LR specific.

Called up two private sellers yesterday, both who described the cars as variations on "good condition". When asking for photos of the rear arches, both admitted to "some bubbling". I pretty much ended the calls there and then.

[C70R]

In spite of the above, I might have found a car at the other end of the country. Service history is 'lost', but the dealer has given me the name of the garage that maintained it. Once I've gotten a satisfactory response from them, I'm going to book an inspection via the RAC.

If that comes back ok, then I'm going to have it shipped straight to Overland Vehicle Services in Norfolk for a mega service (inc. transmission fluids etc.). They can give me a second assessment of the condition before they start, which should hopefully give me the peace of mind that I need.

[C70R]

bakerstreet said:

BlackStang5point0 said:

Just to chip in here personally I'd try and join some L322 forums / fb groups and see whats for sale as chances are you will be buying off an enthusiast that may have addressed all the usual issues and / or will be able to demonstrate a load of preventative maint has been carried out. Buying one off some random private punter / used car dealer is asking for trouble IMHO.

Buying from someone on a FB group/forum and badging them as an enthusiast means absolutely nothing. I've been on the D3/4 FB group for years and advice of 'chuck some anti judder' in the gearbox is basically bodge, but its ok, because they are an 'enthusiast'

Treat the forums as an outlet for purchase prospecting, but no way would I expect the car to be significantly better.

However the part about evidence of crucial repairs is right though. For L322s it would be.

Gearbox
Turbos
Suspension (Air bags, compressors and sensors are common failure points)

The rust and fuel prices will continue to make L322 prices tumble. The rust on the arches isn't exactly a quick or an easy fix. Finger in the air could be £500 a side depending on how bad it is. Also, people just wont spend that on cars that are now costing £150+ to fill up and even the TD6s only do about 25mpg average. 4.4 BMW V8 is probably about 15!

Every dealer I've spoken to who had a car with rusty arches tried to convince me it was "just a bit of paint". Bloody charlatans.

My experience of owners groups mirrors yours. While there are some enthusiasts out there, 90% of the posts seem to be looking for the cheapest way to fix problems.

[bakerstreet]

C70R said:

Every dealer I've spoken to who had a car with rusty arches tried to convince me it was "just a bit of paint". Bloody charlatans.

My experience of owners groups mirrors yours. While there are some enthusiasts out there, 90% of the posts seem to be looking for the cheapest way to fix problems.

If there is rust there, there will be rust in places you can't see as well, namely, the sills behind the arch liners. Top section of the boot rust out as well, but seem to be better than the arches and because its an isolated panel, it can stay in the same state for years.

I'll probably buy a Range Rover in some flavour in the next year even though I already have a Series in the garage. Due to the nature of our driveway, I need a 4x4 just to clear it and that not a joke either

Best of luck in your hunt. Have a couple of grand spare as I recon the garage will find many many things. I waited in reception of my local garage and I recon he rang up about 4 people in that time saying they 'needed' brakes doing. Everyone took them up on it as well.

[C70R]

Well, I might have answered my own thread title. I just called up a Land Rover specialist close to the dealer, and they've agreed to inspect the car at their workshop for less than the king's ransom the RAC were quoting.

I'm much happier giving my money to a small, indie specialist than the RAC.

[bolidemichael]

I must've been really forunate with my FFRR given the experiences that you've had to date.

[andy_ran]

I have just been down this road when i bought my L322

Loads of cars miss advertised and total waste of time going to see

I saw 2 after nearly a 2 hour drive to see that I didnt even want to drive but where advertised as in amazing condition. I ended up traveling to get the one i did, seller was honest, open and easy to deal with. Nothing was too much trouble and he imo undersold the car.

[C70R]

bolidemichael said:

I must've been really forunate with my FFRR given the experiences that you've had to date.

If yours has zero rust and no issues with the air suspension, you've done better than I've managed so far.

I'm optimistic about the one I've found. Deposit paid and inspection happening on Thursday.

[bolidemichael]

No rust and only self-induced issues with air suspension!

[C70R]

bolidemichael said:

No rust and only self-induced issues with air suspension!

I think I was unnecessarily hamstringing myself by looking for cars with lower mileage, mainly because the higher mile cars tended to show it quite obviously on the interior.

[bolidemichael]

C70R said:

bolidemichael said:

No rust and only self-induced issues with air suspension!

I think I was unnecessarily hamstringing myself by looking for cars with lower mileage, mainly because the higher mile cars tended to show it quite obviously on the interior.

Once again... not in my case

[C70R]

bolidemichael said:

C70R said:

bolidemichael said:

No rust and only self-induced issues with air suspension!

I think I was unnecessarily hamstringing myself by looking for cars with lower mileage, mainly because the higher mile cars tended to show it quite obviously on the interior.

Once again... not in my case

If you've managed to avoid the saggy driver's bolster and worn steering wheel, then you've found a unicorn based on my experience of the past month or so.

[bolidemichael]

C70R said:

bolidemichael said:

C70R said:

bolidemichael said:

No rust and only self-induced issues with air suspension!

I think I was unnecessarily hamstringing myself by looking for cars with lower mileage, mainly because the higher mile cars tended to show it quite obviously on the interior.

Once again... not in my case

If you've managed to avoid the saggy driver's bolster and worn steering wheel, then you've found a unicorn based on my experience of the past month or so.

I guess so, it's pretty neat. However steering wheels do wear. Mine isn't falling apart but there's always Royal Steering Wheels or another if you fancy titivation.

[andy_ran]

C70R said:

If you've managed to avoid the saggy driver's bolster and worn steering wheel, then you've found a unicorn based on my experience of the past month or so.

I had the same battle!! They are out there mind you. But you have to look and look and look

[C70R]

andy_ran said:

C70R said:

If you've managed to avoid the saggy driver's bolster and worn steering wheel, then you've found a unicorn based on my experience of the past month or so.

I had the same battle!! They are out there mind you. But you have to look and look and look

I'm hoping that the one I've found is going to do the job. It's bloody miles away, so I'm relying on a local LR specialist to do a good job of the inspection at their workshop. Plan is to factor any major works into the price. Dealer seems amenable, more so since I paid the deposit of course.

Spoken to a local mobile 'detailer' (it pains me to use that word), who's going to do a proper deep clean of the car (wet vac carpets, ceramic coating outside, blah blah) before I collect, which should be a treat.

Everything rests on Thursday's inspection...

[C70R]

It's inspection day. How exciting.

Waiting for the phone call from the specialist has me feeling oddly like an expectant father. That said, given some of the utter toss that I've seen recently, I'm trying hard not to get ahead of myself here. Then, on the other hand, I remember it's a one-owner car from new, and has been maintained to within an inch of its life.

If there's anything major wrong with it, I'll probably leave it and chalk it down to experience. If there's anything in the middle ground, I'm going to ask the specialist for a quote, and see if the dealer is amenable to negotiation. I'm hopeful that he'll be pragmatic in the current climate, and be happy to move the car on.

If the result is a list of odds and sods that need addressing, I'll probably do a bit of gentle haggling and get the garage to sort the most pressing bits alongside a good service (coolant, brake fluid, gearbox and diff oils etc.).