Help me convince my partner that MLM is bad news...

[williamp]

Eric Mc said:

Sounds like old style pyramid selling given a fresh lick of paint.

Every generation gets conned to some extent by this scam. It keeps coming around and around.

Ahhh, they say...this is different. Pyramid schemes are illegal. MLM are not.

I had a custoemr once wanting a business bank account. I refused on thre grounds it wasnt a real business, she wont make money, they are possibly illegal, and why if she was in ot for sales, can she not sell it in any shops?? etc etc. All the common sense questions you migbht ask...

Her whole "clan" complaied to the bank about my decision. Manyy fans were hit with much excrement.

I got into a lot of trouble for being honest, but I often wonder where they are all now. I know I was right, and they have all lost money. I felt sorry for her really...

[ashleyman]

I posted about one of these a few months back when my cousin got involved. Yours sounds very similar to his in the fact that there is no actual product they sell it's more about selling a lifestyle or dream. From what I have been told my cousin stil has to buy a product or something that he then sells to others, or at least has to sign others up. I don't know but it was all super shady and didn't make any sense at all. I think he sold his car to get some money to invest. He doesn't listen to anyone and it's become such a sore subject that nobody is allowed to talk about it now.

We were knocking some golf balls around last year and he talking 'business' he was asking how much I learnt from doing what I do and how I did it etc... So I enquired the same. He didn't have any answers but was asking for me to 'invest' I said no but agreed that if he can show me a payslip or bank transfer from them to him as payment for what he's 'selling' I'll give him the £5k he wanted.

This was last year and I am yet to see anything. It's a scam as far as I'm concerned, that or he's earning so much he doesn't want my money!

I've not spoken to him in ages but apparently he just sits in his room on his computer doing 'entrepreneur' things...

You can see my thread here: https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

Edited by ashleyman on Friday 21st July 00:28

[lastofthev8s]

Interesting to see that these things are as fake as I thought they may be. A work colleague started her 'health products' business in 2014 and lasted about 18 months. She still works for our company.
Having setup a new Facebook profile with her name and product brand name mixed together it was full of posts of 'my business', 'amazing opportunity', 'road trips to learn from business gurus', 'so inspired', 'speechless at my bonus' and the like.
Sadly it does seem that they buy into it heavily, but push the talk in order to entice more people to join the 'business' so that they benefit.

Unfortunately have recently seen another friend set off on the same 'journey' and all the posts read pretty much the same as what I've seen before.

If it seems to good to be true....

[technodup]

lastofthev8s said:

full of posts of 'my business', 'amazing opportunity', 'road trips to learn from business gurus', 'so inspired', 'speechless at my bonus' and the like.
Sadly it does seem that they buy into it heavily, but push the talk in order to entice more people to join the 'business' so that they benefit.

Here's another one. Someone I knew went for this a few years ago, hadn't been launched in the UK yet. Single mum, special needs kid, sold everything in her flat to get the cash to go to the US to one of these roadshow events to 'get in on the first level' or some such pish. The 'launch' got put back and back, and it basically petered out, although it seems to still be going in some shape or form.

She really did believe getting rich was as simple as writing out the names of a hundred people you know. The product will sell itself etc.

You can understand why some get carried away though. https://youtu.be/BS3lYUFTKpk?t=4m41s

I've been offered so many of these things because of the business I'm in, they see us as a gateway to riches. I even got hoodwinked into attending a presentation once. Again, all 'pre launch' bks. Which was supposed to explain the misspelt slides, the unauthorised use of Branson and Beckham's images and the wonky iPhone photos of a PC screen showing the initial payouts. That one went tits up in short order. The guy selling it jumped straight to LifeTree World, which was the next big thing.

A quick look on the pricks FB tells me he's now into annoying bluetooth marketing kits and some guaranteed 30 day finance something or other. fking magpies the lot of them. Shameless.

[Gtom]

Is this the make up thing that seems to be all over social media?

An old friends wife does it. I refer to it as peddling st to scrubbers on Facebook. She got blocked after a week because it became her life.

I will be honest I had no idea what MLM was so I googled it. It took me a few seconds to realise it's pyramid selling in a new frock.

[Eric Mc]

These schemes will never die as there will always be gullible fools who are suckered in by them.

They fail every basic business test you can apply.

[MickyDncl]

To the OP I think you have more than enough ammo to combat her not doing this. I would also try to re focus her energy and enthusiasm into something new.

It sounds as though money is no object to you as a couple and she is in a great position to follow one of her passions and retrain etc. Tell her to play the long game and do something she actually enjoys for the rest of her life.

This is a great video to watch
https://youtu.be/khOaAHK7efc

[4x4Tyke]

These are the Dunning Kruger effect in action. They've always deliberately target the people least able to see behind the façade. The (single) mothers who've never worked and have little or no family support, witnessed by getting themselves in that position in first place.



The latest incarnation are lifestyle coaches, you pay to be coached as a lifestyle coach, classic MLM but with the new element. They are also using gullibility filters to choose their victims instead of pushing to everybody. They always push the latest crazy belief, life the resurgence in flat earth under the guise of 'open mindedness' over the last year or so.

They are actually quite easy to set up and waste their time. Next time you see somebody pushing nonsense on FB respond with 'that's interesting, what do you do in real life?' and you will get the pitch and you can report them to FB as fake profiles. Very satisfying to waste their time with so little effort.

[akirk]

the PH question is why are all those stickers advertising "work from home to make your fortune" never seen on a Ferrari, but are found on a rusty nissan? This concept has been around for decades cons only make money for those doing the con - get in at the start and you do make money - from all those who come after you!

[EddieSteadyGo]

4x4Tyke said:

These are the Dunning Kruger effect in action. They've always deliberately target the people least able to see behind the façade. The (single) mothers who've never worked and have little or no family support, witnessed by getting themselves in that position in first place.

This picture gave me a wry smile. It also fits with the question I was raising earlier that perhaps the inclination to get involved with MLM is the symptom and the cause is (somewhat harshly) described in your wikipedia link.

[DSLiverpool]

https://www.cabionline.com/

The current hot one, your opening stock is circa £3k and a trip to Boston paid by you.

When will they ever learn.

[Johnnytheboy]

http://www.juiceplus.com/gb/en

Seems to be popular...

The U OK Hun Facebook group are always ripping in to them, it's quite amusing

[anonymous-user]

MLMs are fantastic if you want to cut down your circle of friends and family.

My Sil got involved with a couple of MLMs, and within a year had managed to alienate just about everyone she knew, she finally killed off some long standing friendships when going on about some Hawaiian flower juice could cure everything from eczema to stage 4 cancer and she had testimonials from the cured. Sheila from coventry was riddled with cancer at deaths door, she drink 6 cases of flower juice, now she is better than ever and lives in a big house, has 3 time share apartments in Magaluf and drives a convertible evoque.

Snake oil praying on the gullible and daft.

[ymwoods]

Got a girl at the moment on one of these scams. Everything is about how wonderful it is and how X or Y representative has earned a bonus holiday or is picking up their new car.

Constantly trying to recruit new people and spouting such crap as "Triple bonus payment streams" ...WTF is that, I asked...would only tell me over a private message. All it is was that she gets a percentage of the 3 reps below her, so the rep she directly recruited, the one that rep recruited, etc, etc. didn't like it when I said about it just being a Pyramid scheme.

I got sick of it, she is now muted.

My Girlfriend did look into one not long ago as a friend of hers was trying to get her to sign up to it, said friend is now more broke than she was before. Luckily, GF took my advice.

[Hoofy]

I think there is a difference between MLM and Pyramid schemes. In the latter, no product or service is being sold. In MLMs, it's basically overpriced products that are being sold. So you might have lost all your friends but at least you'll have a really, really clean kitchen.

[anotheracc]

anotheracc said:

C722 said:

Watch 'Betting on Zero' on Netflix, should put her off

Never knew this existed, the film, not the company Herbalife. I'm definitely going to do as you say with some prior knowledge of the the similarities between her MLM and Herbalife of which I already understand there to be many.

Thanks for this - could be a real help

So I watched this last night on my own. I'd say Herbalife practices are far more ruthless that what I hear from my partner but the ethos is still the same:

The Business Opportunity on the face of it is to sell product, when in reality, at their 'events' its the recruitment of others that should be focused on. My partner is certainly led to believe that its' the selling of the lifestyle that will lead to a nice residual income.

They say in the film what we all know, that a pyramid scheme is a business model focused on the recruitment of others rather than selling actual products. The MLMs seem to scrape past this by actually selling a few products, publicly claiming it's about the products but behind closed doors its all about the ongoing recruitment of others

[EddieSteadyGo]

I spoke with my wife about this earlier today, to ask if she had come across much of it on facebook etc.

She told me that it becomes cult like, and the organisers specifically train people like your girlfriend how to handle "the haters" e.g. people like you who want to look out for their best interests.

[anotheracc]

lastofthev8s said:

Interesting to see that these things are as fake as I thought they may be. A work colleague started her 'health products' business in 2014 and lasted about 18 months. She still works for our company.
Having setup a new Facebook profile with her name and product brand name mixed together it was full of posts of 'my business', 'amazing opportunity', 'road trips to learn from business gurus', 'so inspired', 'speechless at my bonus' and the like.
Sadly it does seem that they buy into it heavily, but push the talk in order to entice more people to join the 'business' so that they benefit.

Unfortunately have recently seen another friend set off on the same 'journey' and all the posts read pretty much the same as what I've seen before.

If it seems to good to be true....

yeah exactly this load of tripe. My partner is recently posting about her 5th holiday of the year coming up and if you want to know how she went from 0 to 5 holidays in a year you should enquire....

Well I can tell you how and it's got nothing to do with an income from an MLM scheme LOL. Its to do with her having a full time job and me financing a decent chunk of it but to others who don't know it looks like this dreamscheme is financing her travels etc

Another of my facebook friends, a woman would you believe it, has just set up on a juice based weight loss venture, same old rubbish being circulated. UNFOLLOW.

Why are they so take in by it all.....

[anotheracc]

EddieSteadyGo said:

I spoke with my wife about this earlier today, to ask if she had come across much of it on facebook etc.

She told me that it becomes cult like, and the organisers specifically train people like your girlfriend how to handle "the haters" e.g. people like you who want to look out for their best interests.

I think some are worse than others but this is true. My partners MLM is at the lesser end of the evil spectrum having researched it heavily of late but dealing with sceptics is definitely covered.

What I'd like to know is how does HMRC not clamp down on the fact that none of the are declaring this 'income' although probably because their isn't any to be fair!! Even at a loss they should be registered, which they are not.

Also Trading Standards - is it legal to sell a dream which you are not actually living, or financing by other methods?

[Zoon]

My wifes friend did Forever Living, was supposedly making £10k a month, 15 holidays a year and a new car.
Packed her job in that she'd had for over 10 years to do it full time.

18 months later, working back in an office and getting divorced.