Weapons-grade home WiFi suggestions
Discussion
So I now have fibre to the house!
The router that was provided is rebranded with the fibre suppliers name, I do not know what the router is or if it is any good? Can anyone hear identify it or tell me if I am better off purchasing a known decent router before I start trying to expand the WiFi around my house so I get it in all rooms?
Here are some pics:
Here are a couple of pics of possible relevant stuff when I log onto the router. I am NOT very literate when it comes to router/IP/PC stuff, so you'll have to forgive me if these pics are irrelevant:
Speed wise, when connected direct to the router with an ethernet cable I'm getting this:
When connected via the 2.4GHz WiFi I get this (sat next to the router):
When connected via the 5GHz WiFi I get this (sat next to the router):
However, the WiFi speeds drop off very quickly as soon as I move away and into other rooms. The room where my SKY Q box is situated is around 15ft away (as the crow flies) and the SKY Q box cannot pick up a signal from either of the WiFi's. I have an ancient crappy set of powerline adapters that I'm having to use and the best speed I can get with them is around 20/30Mb at the SKY box.
I definitely need to get a mesh network to give decent WiFi around the house as most of the rooms don't get a signal at all from the current router, the 5GHz is especially bad and pretty much useless unless you are in the same room as the router. Obviously if the router IS crap and it would make sense to buy a better one then I'd be happy to do so. I'm guessing that if I bought a decent nesh system it would be hobbled if the router is rubbish?
I would be very grateful for any help!
The router that was provided is rebranded with the fibre suppliers name, I do not know what the router is or if it is any good? Can anyone hear identify it or tell me if I am better off purchasing a known decent router before I start trying to expand the WiFi around my house so I get it in all rooms?
Here are some pics:
Here are a couple of pics of possible relevant stuff when I log onto the router. I am NOT very literate when it comes to router/IP/PC stuff, so you'll have to forgive me if these pics are irrelevant:
Speed wise, when connected direct to the router with an ethernet cable I'm getting this:
When connected via the 2.4GHz WiFi I get this (sat next to the router):
When connected via the 5GHz WiFi I get this (sat next to the router):
However, the WiFi speeds drop off very quickly as soon as I move away and into other rooms. The room where my SKY Q box is situated is around 15ft away (as the crow flies) and the SKY Q box cannot pick up a signal from either of the WiFi's. I have an ancient crappy set of powerline adapters that I'm having to use and the best speed I can get with them is around 20/30Mb at the SKY box.
I definitely need to get a mesh network to give decent WiFi around the house as most of the rooms don't get a signal at all from the current router, the 5GHz is especially bad and pretty much useless unless you are in the same room as the router. Obviously if the router IS crap and it would make sense to buy a better one then I'd be happy to do so. I'm guessing that if I bought a decent nesh system it would be hobbled if the router is rubbish?
I would be very grateful for any help!
Your fibre plugs directly into the provided router ?
Not sure if its the same as OpenReache's GPON implementation, but the ONT is specific to the OLT and cannot be changed as the serial number must match whats expected.
I imagine its routing is good enough, so it would probably be ok to turn off the wifi and connect some BT discs (white ones and do not get the premium ones) for a cheapish mesh.
Not sure if its the same as OpenReache's GPON implementation, but the ONT is specific to the OLT and cannot be changed as the serial number must match whats expected.
I imagine its routing is good enough, so it would probably be ok to turn off the wifi and connect some BT discs (white ones and do not get the premium ones) for a cheapish mesh.
Toilet Duck said:
5GHz is especially bad and pretty much useless unless you are in the same room as the router.
5GHz doesn't go through walls well. The faster the connection, the more obvious this is. If you've only got 100 Mbit, you'll never notice that 5GHz wifi struggles to do more than say 300Mbit unless conditions are pretty favourable.What are the clients you want fast WiFi on? Are they 802.11ax (WiFi 6) or 802.11ac (WiFi 5) ?
Gary C said:
Your fibre plugs directly into the provided router ?
Not sure if its the same as OpenReache's GPON implementation, but the ONT is specific to the OLT and cannot be changed as the serial number must match whats expected.
I imagine its routing is good enough, so it would probably be ok to turn off the wifi and connect some BT discs (white ones and do not get the premium ones) for a cheapish mesh.
Thanks for the reply. Apologies but I don't understand most of what you posted as I'm not up to speed on router/pc type stuff Not sure if its the same as OpenReache's GPON implementation, but the ONT is specific to the OLT and cannot be changed as the serial number must match whats expected.
I imagine its routing is good enough, so it would probably be ok to turn off the wifi and connect some BT discs (white ones and do not get the premium ones) for a cheapish mesh.
Are you saying I can't change the router?
I'm guessing it's the router that limits the current WiFi speeds? I don't mind spending the money to get a good mesh network, I've been looking at the Deco M9 triple pack that's been mentioned in this thread. I don't want to buy them though if the existing freebie router is a turd and will create a bottleneck?
I can confirm that the fibre plugs directly into the router though. They have run a new fibre all the way to my house with no copper, it's a "hyper fast" network according to the blurb.
Thanks again.
Is anyone using giganet as a provider? They’ve just installed fibre near us and offering 900mbps up/down for £40pm. Router I believe is this: https://support.giga.net.uk/hc/en-gb/article_attac...
Currently have 2 x Tenda MW6 but would look to upgrade them to a wifi6 option this year.
Currently have 2 x Tenda MW6 but would look to upgrade them to a wifi6 option this year.
xeny said:
5GHz doesn't go through walls well. The faster the connection, the more obvious this is. If you've only got 100 Mbit, you'll never notice that 5GHz wifi struggles to do more than say 300Mbit unless conditions are pretty favourable.
What are the clients you want fast WiFi on? Are they 802.11ax (WiFi 6) or 802.11ac (WiFi 5) ?
Thank you for that What are the clients you want fast WiFi on? Are they 802.11ax (WiFi 6) or 802.11ac (WiFi 5) ?
When you say "only got 100Mb", what do you mean, where is that 100Mb cap?
Regarding clients for fast WiFi, i don't have anything WiFi 6 compatible (although that may change in the future). Maybe it's just me showing my ignorance, but I just assumed that the higher the WiFi speed available the better. If I'm getting 600Mb hardwired then surely 20Mb WiFi two rooms away is a bit crap?
At my old house I had 30Mb broadband and the sky box downloaded stuff significantly quicker than where I am now, so I'm asuming it can be improved by a large magnitude.
What sort of WiFi speeds would a "decent" router offer? This one doesn't have any visible antenna on it, I assume that must effect performance (unless I've fallen victim to marketing spiel
) Mattt said:
Sorry, not sure if that's aimed at me but that link doesn't work (unless it's because I'm viewing on a mobile)? Toilet Duck said:
Thank you for that
When you say "only got 100Mb", what do you mean, where is that 100Mb cap?
Regarding clients for fast WiFi, i don't have anything WiFi 6 compatible (although that may change in the future). Maybe it's just me showing my ignorance, but I just assumed that the higher the WiFi speed available the better. If I'm getting 600Mb hardwired then surely 20Mb WiFi two rooms away is a bit crap?
At my old house I had 30Mb broadband and the sky box downloaded stuff significantly quicker than where I am now, so I'm asuming it can be improved by a large magnitude.
What sort of WiFi speeds would a "decent" router offer? This one doesn't have any visible antenna on it, I assume that must effect performance (unless I've fallen victim to marketing spiel)
I'm saying the faster the service coming in, the more obvious it is that WiFi loses performance as you put obstructions in the way. If a broadband connection is only 100 Mbit, who is going to notice the Wifi is only capable of say 300 Mb?When you say "only got 100Mb", what do you mean, where is that 100Mb cap?
Regarding clients for fast WiFi, i don't have anything WiFi 6 compatible (although that may change in the future). Maybe it's just me showing my ignorance, but I just assumed that the higher the WiFi speed available the better. If I'm getting 600Mb hardwired then surely 20Mb WiFi two rooms away is a bit crap?
At my old house I had 30Mb broadband and the sky box downloaded stuff significantly quicker than where I am now, so I'm asuming it can be improved by a large magnitude.
What sort of WiFi speeds would a "decent" router offer? This one doesn't have any visible antenna on it, I assume that must effect performance (unless I've fallen victim to marketing spiel
) 20Mb two room away is a bit crap, but what are the walls made of, how much furniture or similar is between the router and the client?
Think of a car tuner - How fast do you want to go, how much do you want to spend? Do you know what spec the wireless hardware on the current router is, and is the router sensibly placed (typically up reasonably high and unobstructed)? https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2020/02/the-ars-te... may be worth at least glancing at.
Visible antenna may be a bit better, but aren't a good criteria for selecting a good wireless access point. As a tip, mentally separate routing and Wireless access points - you can get kit that does both, but it doesn't have to, and you'll just get confused conversations at some point.
A "decent" access point will offer say 600 Mbit, but everything has got to be right for that to be the case. Look at the charts at https://youtu.be/f5WUifimRcE?t=1381 for example - that's a WiFi 6 AP with WiFi 6 clients (so pretty much best case), the speed you get is highly variable depending on where the client is relative to the AP.
That's partly why I'm asking what clients you have/plan to have. Wifi 5 (802.11ac) is reasonably fast and reasonably affordable, and if you don't have any 6 clients, or need higher speeds from them, then it is potentially a better value for money choice. If you want WiFi 6 to have the latest, then until you've got a client with WiFi 6 hardware, it won't benefit you.
Toilet Duck said:
Mattt said:
Sorry, not sure if that's aimed at me but that link doesn't work (unless it's because I'm viewing on a mobile)? https://usermanual.wiki/Altice-Labs/FGW-GR240BG
jimmyjimjim said:
So 4 x 4 5Ghz 802.11AC. That's a pretty decent spec and if they went to the trouble/cost of implementing 4 x 4 rather than 2 x 2 they were intending for it to be pretty good.Here is my plan, anyone see any issues?
Buy 2 x 3 packs of WHW030 Velops.
Put 1 next to the BT modem. Disable wifi on the bt modem.
Then that leaves me 5 nodes.
Kitchen
Office+master bed
Lounge
Garage
Bed 4/5
The only issue I can see reading online is a lot of people comment that the velop likes <10m between nodes. Should be ok in most places but the run from the lounge to the garage is c.15m?
Thoughts?
Any better solutions for sub £500 ish?
Buy 2 x 3 packs of WHW030 Velops.
Put 1 next to the BT modem. Disable wifi on the bt modem.
Then that leaves me 5 nodes.
Kitchen
Office+master bed
Lounge
Garage
Bed 4/5
The only issue I can see reading online is a lot of people comment that the velop likes <10m between nodes. Should be ok in most places but the run from the lounge to the garage is c.15m?
Thoughts?
Any better solutions for sub £500 ish?
red_slr said:
The only issue I can see reading online is a lot of people comment that the velop likes <10m between nodes. Should be ok in most places but the run from the lounge to the garage is c.15m?
15m and presumably the outside wall of the house and the garage? That's going to be a potential issue. Is there at least a handy window to reduce signal attenuation at one end or the other?red_slr said:
It would be 1 wall (plaster board, insulation and 1 layer brick) - 15m fresh air - 1 layer brick.
I guess you are talking 6dB. I dont know anything about the specs on wifi but I guess 5 gig might struggle but 2.4 ok?
https://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/free-space-path-loss.png suggests you'll just about get acceptable performance on 2.4, but 5GHz will be near non existent in that scenario.I guess you are talking 6dB. I dont know anything about the specs on wifi but I guess 5 gig might struggle but 2.4 ok?
I suppose suck it and see, but depending on how much bandwidth you want in the garage you may need powerline or an ethernet cable run.
Mattt said:
jimmyjimjim said:
Toilet Duck said:
Mattt said:
Sorry, not sure if that's aimed at me but that link doesn't work (unless it's because I'm viewing on a mobile)? https://usermanual.wiki/Altice-Labs/FGW-GR240BG
xeny said:
I'm saying the faster the service coming in, the more obvious it is that WiFi loses performance as you put obstructions in the way. If a broadband connection is only 100 Mbit, who is going to notice the Wifi is only capable of say 300 Mb?
20Mb two room away is a bit crap, but what are the walls made of, how much furniture or similar is between the router and the client?
Think of a car tuner - How fast do you want to go, how much do you want to spend? Do you know what spec the wireless hardware on the current router is, and is the router sensibly placed (typically up reasonably high and unobstructed)? https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2020/02/the-ars-te... may be worth at least glancing at.
Visible antenna may be a bit better, but aren't a good criteria for selecting a good wireless access point. As a tip, mentally separate routing and Wireless access points - you can get kit that does both, but it doesn't have to, and you'll just get confused conversations at some point.
A "decent" access point will offer say 600 Mbit, but everything has got to be right for that to be the case. Look at the charts at https://youtu.be/f5WUifimRcE?t=1381 for example - that's a WiFi 6 AP with WiFi 6 clients (so pretty much best case), the speed you get is highly variable depending on where the client is relative to the AP.
That's partly why I'm asking what clients you have/plan to have. Wifi 5 (802.11ac) is reasonably fast and reasonably affordable, and if you don't have any 6 clients, or need higher speeds from them, then it is potentially a better value for money choice. If you want WiFi 6 to have the latest, then until you've got a client with WiFi 6 hardware, it won't benefit you.
Thanks for that.20Mb two room away is a bit crap, but what are the walls made of, how much furniture or similar is between the router and the client?
Think of a car tuner - How fast do you want to go, how much do you want to spend? Do you know what spec the wireless hardware on the current router is, and is the router sensibly placed (typically up reasonably high and unobstructed)? https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2020/02/the-ars-te... may be worth at least glancing at.
Visible antenna may be a bit better, but aren't a good criteria for selecting a good wireless access point. As a tip, mentally separate routing and Wireless access points - you can get kit that does both, but it doesn't have to, and you'll just get confused conversations at some point.
A "decent" access point will offer say 600 Mbit, but everything has got to be right for that to be the case. Look at the charts at https://youtu.be/f5WUifimRcE?t=1381 for example - that's a WiFi 6 AP with WiFi 6 clients (so pretty much best case), the speed you get is highly variable depending on where the client is relative to the AP.
That's partly why I'm asking what clients you have/plan to have. Wifi 5 (802.11ac) is reasonably fast and reasonably affordable, and if you don't have any 6 clients, or need higher speeds from them, then it is potentially a better value for money choice. If you want WiFi 6 to have the latest, then until you've got a client with WiFi 6 hardware, it won't benefit you.
If the current router is outputting a download speed via ethernet of circa 600Mb, does that mean that in theory the WiFi download speed should be the same under ideal conditions i.e. practically sitting on top of the router with zero interference or any walls/metal etc in the way (which I appreciate isn't going to happen in the real world)? If I'm "only" getting circa 230Mb over 5GHz WiFi and circa 45Mb over 2.4GHz WiFi when sat two feet away from the router, is that indicative that the WiFi capability of the router is not great? If I was to purchase a mesh system e.g. Deco M9 and plug it into my current router, would the WiFi speed of the mesh network be limited by the WiFi speed of the router? Or is that independant so should give a lot faster WiFi? Am i right in thinking that I would log onto the router and disable it's WiFi when using a mesh system?
Again, many thanks for all your help and patience
Toilet Duck said:
If the current router is outputting a download speed via ethernet of circa 600Mb, does that mean that in theory the WiFi download speed should be the same under ideal conditions i.e. practically sitting on top of the router with zero interference or any walls/metal etc in the way (which I appreciate isn't going to happen in the real world)? If I'm "only" getting circa 230Mb over 5GHz WiFi and circa 45Mb over 2.4GHz WiFi when sat two feet away from the router, is that indicative that the WiFi capability of the router is not great? If I was to purchase a mesh system e.g. Deco M9 and plug it into my current router, would the WiFi speed of the mesh network be limited by the WiFi speed of the router? Or is that independant so should give a lot faster WiFi? Am i right in thinking that I would log onto the router and disable it's WiFi when using a mesh system?
Again, many thanks for all your help and patience
Realistically no (you actually want a few foot gap, too much signal can be an issue), 600Mb is really pushing best case for wifi - did you look at the numbers in the video I linked yesterday? That's for a latest spec WiFi 6 AP and WiFi 6 client and his very best figure doesn't reach 600Mb.Again, many thanks for all your help and patience
What is the spec of the client you're testing with? ~230Mb might be a single radio 802.11ac client with 40 Mhz channels, in which case the performance is roughly as expected.
If you bought a mesh system, then the speed of the mesh would be unrelated to the wifi speed of the router (you connect the two systems together with an ethernet cable)., and you would indeed turn the router's WiFi off.
Realistically, WiFi is almost always slower than a cable, and much more susceptible to environmental reduction in performance, even down to you standing between the client and the AP. Work out how much you want/need rather than obsessing about as fast as possible.
xeny said:
red_slr said:
It would be 1 wall (plaster board, insulation and 1 layer brick) - 15m fresh air - 1 layer brick.
I guess you are talking 6dB. I dont know anything about the specs on wifi but I guess 5 gig might struggle but 2.4 ok?
https://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/free-space-path-loss.png suggests you'll just about get acceptable performance on 2.4, but 5GHz will be near non existent in that scenario.I guess you are talking 6dB. I dont know anything about the specs on wifi but I guess 5 gig might struggle but 2.4 ok?
I suppose suck it and see, but depending on how much bandwidth you want in the garage you may need powerline or an ethernet cable run.
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