Silverstone BTCC

[EDLT]

fatboy69 said:

Easier way to do that - as I have been saying for over 12 months. Get rid of the horrible, IMO, NGTC cars, get rid of the turbo's & bring in 5 litre normally aspirated V8's.

That way there can be no arguing, no bhing, no whinging etc. it would simply be down to whoever builds the better car.

It works in Aus - just watch the Bathurst 1000 from the weekend.......

You're conveniently forgetting that the Aus teams have 2-3 times the budget, it would effectively kill BTCC again. Also, I find it difficult to believe that supertaxis is the only motorsport on the planet where nobody argues, bhes or whinges.

Is your next stop going to be a WRC thread to say "Bring back Group B"?

Edited by EDLT on Monday 8th October 19:33

[StoatInACoat]

jasonplato said:

Just in case any of you are interested in facts, here are some:

Silverstone Official mph Speed Trap figures: number is an average of Q, R1,R2,R3 bests

Trap 1: Wellington Straight

Matt Jackson 137.77
Jason Plato 134.73
Matt Neal 132.00
Gordon Shedden 131.53

Trap 2: Finish Line

Matt Jackson 127.47
Jason Plato 125.85
Matt Neal 122.48
Gordon Shedden 122.80

So, really, what this tells us is that Jackson and you are faster through the speed traps than any Honda? Or am I missing something? I am not trying to argue the toss but I don't see how figures that show you have a speed advantage really help your argument unless speed traps are irrelevant in which case what is the point in posting it?

Really what I want to understand is WHY all the NGTC cars which use the same basic parts etc don't ALL have the same power/tourque output because surely that was the point of the whole thing in the first place. Ginetta Juniors manage to equalise the entire grid for example.

Edited by StoatInACoat on Monday 8th October 19:21

[Dan Friel]

jasonplato said:

Interesting reading wouldn't you say

Cheers JP

Did you get a "draft" down the back straight in that round? Don't understand the figures if you did!

The problem I have with BTCC at the moment is that the rules as they are can make a car completely uncompetitive for an entire weekend (Honda this weekend for example). And that makes BTCC completely uninteresting.

[IainW]

jasonplato said:

Interesting reading wouldn't you say

Cheers JP

No disrespect to any of the drivers on that timing sheet, as they're all better racing drivers than I'll ever be, but a lot of that just isn't right. There are guys up near the top of that sheet that really shouldn't be up there and vice versa. It's like last year when everyone was getting excited about the Audi and the Toyota being fast and at the pointy end of the grid come mid-season. Yes Frank and Rob are good drivers, but they were only up there because of the boost in a straightline. If you actually watched the cars go round, the handling looked like something prehistoric. All about straightline oomph because somebody tinkered with the boost figures.

[Vocal Minority]

Everyone comes from a point of view. I have a soft spot for the Honda's, as they are built in my home town, and I will never not be amazed that little. old pershore has mustered something a little more high octane than a local market. Also Pirtek was kind enough to put up with me abling round the garage and generally getting in everyones way during race 2 (a big thank you, as I was chuffed in my own little way). I also have to say Flash seems a pretty personable chap.

Unfortunately there are lies, damned lies and statistics and whilst the speed traps tell half the story, the other half is that in race 3 (as a good example) especially toward the end ad the S2000 tyres went away, Shedden would be alongside a BMW coming out of a corner only to be outdragged. I think Messrs Plato and Jackson would have stayed away, but at any other meeting this year, he would have been past those 3 series' at the end.

As someone said above it is entertaining, and Alan Gow has his 3 way finale. After all it is his business and livlihood, with many participants livlihoods involved in the series being commercially successful as well as winning. I guess the 'soap opera' element of a bunch of feuding drivers probably helps too, but I may be reading into that too much.

But ultimately whilst I am entertained I guesd, there is a twinge of uneasiness that its not [i]quite[\i] real, and the hand of god as there to ensure parity in the points table.

That said its no worse than any other major motorsport in that respect really I guess.

Edited by Vocal Minority on Tuesday 9th October 12:13

[Allyc85]

Is there any where we can see the cars boost levels for each meeting? Surely the fans deserve to know exactly whats going on if we have to hear about it in each interview!

[fatboy69]

EDLT said:

You're conveniently forgetting that the Aus teams have 2-3 times the budget, it would effectively kill BTCC again. Also, I find it difficult to believe that supertaxis is the only motorsport on the planet where nobody argues, bhes or whinges.

Is your next stop going to be a WRC thread to say "Bring back Group B"?

Pardon me for having an opinion or daring to actually post it!

What is your solution then because the way the BTCC is going it will kill itself with the bhing, backbiting, moaning etc.

It isn't good to see top line drivers a) being slagged off all the time & b) punting each other off when the opportunity arises.

It is getting boring race after race, day after day.

Budgets can be set & capped as is being done in F1 so why not do it in the BTCC? If Bernie can do it then no reason why Alan Gow can't sort it out.

[decadence]

I'd like to know from Jason that if they had by his own words the boost levels so wrong at Knockhill, why he feels the boost levels were just right at Silverstone?
is it because he won 2 races at silverstone and in truth should of been all three bar the break down, which was Alan Gow pressing a button off screen to keep it all level!!

[MonkeyHanger]

jasonplato said:

Interesting reading wouldn't you say

Cheers JP

Too much Haribo & Tesco's sandwiches methinks

[EDLT]

fatboy69 said:

EDLT said:

You're conveniently forgetting that the Aus teams have 2-3 times the budget, it would effectively kill BTCC again. Also, I find it difficult to believe that supertaxis is the only motorsport on the planet where nobody argues, bhes or whinges.

Is your next stop going to be a WRC thread to say "Bring back Group B"?

Pardon me for having an opinion or daring to actually post it!

What is your solution then because the way the BTCC is going it will kill itself with the bhing, backbiting, moaning etc.

It isn't good to see top line drivers a) being slagged off all the time & b) punting each other off when the opportunity arises.

It is getting boring race after race, day after day.

Budgets can be set & capped as is being done in F1 so why not do it in the BTCC? If Bernie can do it then no reason why Alan Gow can't sort it out.

You come into a thread about the BTCC just to say its crap, more than once, whats the point of that? If you don't like it go and watch something else.

You still haven't named one series that doesn't have bhing, the BBC did a mini series on Stock car racing and they were even complaining about cheating in that.

A budget cap in BTCC is just funny.

[fatboy69]

I dont recall having said that the BTCC was/is crap. The racing, when they race is good to watch. Always has been. I made no direct reference to Silverstone because I saw very little of the racing.

Why is a budget cap funny? If you are so clever what is your solution or don't you have one?

What I said was the bhing, moaning, punting each other off is getting boring as is the constant whinging on PH.

As for other categories - this is a BTCC thread so why go off on a tangent? It's immaterial IMO.

[Martyn D]

jasonplato said:

Read the rules buddy, think you will find that 1 wheel on the white line is perfectly within the regs.
This is the problem, so many of you on here talk utter nonsense. You believe you are experts from an armchair.

Cheers JP

I take it this is in reply to the picture I posted with the comment about driving on the grass I can't see anything mentioned of rules, lines, regs etc but one thing I would comment on is it's the people like use who pay our dues to come and watch who keep the BTCC alive, don't you think we have views and opinions?
All this "hater" bks is just back to the playground stuff, if you believe your skill as a driver took you through the field I'll raise my glass, if you think the boost reduction for the Hondas took them out of the equation then that's a different matter.
It would be interesting to know if the teams overall performance is taken into account when accessing a level playing field concerning the boost or is everyone accessed as an individual?

Edited by Martyn D on Monday 8th October 20:12

[Killer2005]

jasonplato said:

Just in case any of you are interested in facts, here are some:

Silverstone Official mph Speed Trap figures: number is an average of Q, R1,R2,R3 bests

Trap 1: Wellington Straight

Matt Jackson 137.77
Jason Plato 134.73
Matt Neal 132.00
Gordon Shedden 131.53

Trap 2: Finish Line

Matt Jackson 127.47
Jason Plato 125.85
Matt Neal 122.48
Gordon Shedden 122.80

Good luck in final round

[Ponk]

Martyn D said:

jasonplato said:

Read the rules buddy, think you will find that 1 wheel on the white line is perfectly within the regs.
This is the problem, so many of you on here talk utter nonsense. You believe you are experts from an armchair.

Cheers JP

I take it this is in reply to the picture I posted with the comment about driving on the grass I can't seen anything mentioned of rules, lines, regs etc but one thing I would comment on is it's the people like use who pay our dues to come and watch who keep the BTCC alive, don't you think we have views and opinions?
All this "hater" bks is just back to the playground stuff, if you believe your skill as a driver took you through the field I'll raise my glass, if you think the boost reduction for the Hondas took them out of the equation then that's a different matter.
It would be interesting to know if the teams overall performance is taken into account when accessing a level playing field concerning the boost or is everyone accessed as an individual?

I was wondering the same thing. I assume it's based on each team as I would expect there to be bigger gaps between the Pirtek and 888 cars. Although it seems odd that TOC was so much faster than Collard.

[decadence]

I echo the poster asking for boost level read outs per round, that is way more interesting than top speed through a speed trap. But we will never know that info from Gow. Regardless of what people think of Plato and Neal
what about Sheddon? lovely bloke fair racer, good racer yet spent 3 races having to defend on the straights and in the corners at one point against last years Civic with a guy who is only on second race weekend in BTCC... something wasn't right... Sheddon didn't suddenly wake up slow, it's was his car... unfair regardless of who you support frankly.

[LukeSi]

In the Formula Renault was there a Jake Dalton racing? Started 18th finished 8th. If so I'm in the same class as him at college.

[acer12]

decadence said:

Who Mat Jackson?

That MG is a Triple 8 car, like i say they are a bit damn good and can make a car go well....its not an MG thats rolled off the Chinese production line and and some flash alloys fitted and been lowered...its a full race car engineered by triple 8 hence why that Andy Neate fella can get anywhere near the top ten cause the car is that good.......i'd be shocked if it wasn't winning with Plato at the helm to be honest...

Give it a rest please. You sound like a deranged stalker, same crap from you on all the btcc threads you stick your nose into, getting very boring at this stage

[EDLT]

LukeSi said:

In the Formula Renault was there a Jake Dalton racing? Started 18th finished 8th. If so I'm in the same class as him at college.

Someone from the back finished higher up? Must have been fixed.

[refoman2]

jasonplato said:

Read the rules buddy, think you will find that 1 wheel on the white line is perfectly within the regs.
This is the problem, so many of you on here talk utter nonsense. You believe you are experts from an armchair.

Cheers JP

strange,i always thought the race track was the black stuff! another example of touring car drivers thinking they are above the rules and regs! what you seem to forget is all the kids watching who are karters/future karters/future BTCC drivers watch the antics of the so called 'superstars' and them getting away with it and then feel that it is the norm to drive off track/punt people out of the way and then wonder why they get their licences suspended etc at club level!

its about time the governing body starting coming down hard on these kind of antics then we might actually see some proper racing on the black tarmac stuff!

[EDLT]

refoman2 said:

jasonplato said:

Read the rules buddy, think you will find that 1 wheel on the white line is perfectly within the regs.
This is the problem, so many of you on here talk utter nonsense. You believe you are experts from an armchair.

Cheers JP

strange,i always thought the race track was the black stuff! another example of touring car drivers thinking they are above the rules and regs! what you seem to forget is all the kids watching who are karters/future karters/future BTCC drivers watch the antics of the so called 'superstars' and them getting away with it and then feel that it is the norm to drive off track/punt people out of the way and then wonder why they get their licences suspended etc at club level!

its about time the governing body starting coming down hard on these kind of antics then we might actually see some proper racing on the black tarmac stuff!

This AGAIN? As was mentioned earlier in the thread, touring cars has its own section in the blue book regarding track limits, contact and other things. Plato is correct, you have to have all four wheels off the track several times before you get a drive through.