RE: PH Fleet Intro: Mazda RX-8

RE: PH Fleet Intro: Mazda RX-8

Wednesday 1st February 2012

PH Fleet Intro: Mazda RX-8

A warm welcome to the car that may (or may not) live up to the name 'RX-Sub8'...



There’s no going back now. I’ve bought a Mazda RX-8. Not only that, but I’ve bought one of the cheaper ones too - only £2,800 for a 2004, 231hp six-speed manual. Stop! Don’t hit ‘comment’ just yet...

I needed to replace my turbocharged Eunos track car with something standard, modern and easy to swap between the UK and German registration systems. And my budget was capped at the £2,750 I got for the Eunos.

Sorry Chris, but an EP3 Civic Type R would have ticked all the boxes ... except I’m a snob when it comes to rear-wheel drive.

Running in process well under way
Running in process well under way
Honda S2000s  were my next favourite, decent ones were just a little bit out of my budget, and I nearly got my fingers burnt looking at cheaper examples. The next sensible choice was a BMW 330Ci. The more I looked the more I wanted to change though. A great car, no doubt, but too heavy and no LSD.

Noise test
While conducting vital ‘research’ into the S2000, I’d happened across one of the Hot VersionInternational videos. In it the S2000 was compared to the RX-8. And there was a modified RX-8, with its 9,500rpm rotary screaming through titanium racing pipes like a tin-bucket full of chainsaws thrown down a well.

This was the sort of vital information I needed. An RX-8 it would be!

Already aware of the drawbacks of rotary motors, I began doing my research. The issue of RX-8s blowing up without warning isn’t quite as dire as some would have you believe. Yes, if used incorrectly and poorly maintained, they are rotary hand-grenades simply waiting for a location to explode. One of the quirks is the fact sump oil is metered by the ECU into an injection system and sprayed into the combustion chambers to lubricate various seals. If you thrash it the ECU pumps more oil in. If you don’t check the level and let it run dry, then it doesn’t get lubricated.

Failing to maintain the ignition system doesn’t result in a typical piston engine misfire either, instead you just end up with a lack of power and a load of unburnt fuel washing away the vital lubrication. Starting from cold repeatedly, without really warming up the car, is another way to ensure poor ignition over time as the plugs get oiled. A lack of compression in the engine more often than not comes from one of these problems, and a guaranteed rebuilt motor is about £3,000.

This is where the Rex will spend its days
This is where the Rex will spend its days
Pop goes the rotary?
So the car I eventually chose didn’t just have full Mazda service history, but a recent compression check and an upgraded ignition system too. To be fair, the forums have plenty of anecdotal tales of people with engines lasting less than 50,000 miles. But I took heart in the few examples being used on track regularly with over 100,000 miles on the original motor.

And how do I intend to keep my rotary engine sweet? Even though it’s going to be thrashed around the Nurburgring every week? Through proper maintenance and lubrication. Dedicated rotorheads recommend pre-mixing a quality two-stroke oil into the fuel with ratios from between one part oil to 250 parts fuel, right up to 1:100 depending on how you’re driving the car. Indeed American firm Racing Beat dyno-tested one of their race cars with pre-mixed fuel at a whopping ratio of one part oil to only 76 parts fuel (that’s over half a litre to a tank full) and got a 4hp power increase. So better lubrication, peace of mind AND more power? I like it.

The kind of numbers we like on a rev counter
The kind of numbers we like on a rev counter
Gadget freak
Regular oil changes are one way to prevent dirty sump oil leaving carbon deposits in the chambers. Another complementary tactic is to block the automatic system’s oil intake from the sump, and instead feed it nice fresh two-stroke oil (designed to be burnt) from a separate container. One example of this is the Sohn Adaptor, which I really like.

My first opportunity to drive the ‘new’ RX-8 at full speed on the ‘Ring came recently and the experience was far from disappointing! 

Handling is like a slightly bigger MX-5, which is no surprise considering they share the same overall layout of double wishbone fronts and multi-link rear. But the balance is what really excites me. I hate understeer that can only be turned into ‘snap’ oversteer by violent methods of lifting and stabbing the gas. But in the Mazda understeer and oversteer are dictated by the driver and not the chassis. Check out the entrance to Adenauer Forst at 2min 40sec in the video below to see what I mean.

The standard car even has a Torsen limited-slip diff too, so drive from the tighter corners of the Nordschleife is perfect, no understeer at all.

The brakes, even with stock pads and knackered discs are a definite cut above the average too, with big vented discs all round (323mm on the front!) and not much weight to slow down. I can’t wait to stick new fluid, discs and pads in there. With stock power there’s no way the car will need a big brake kit.

RX-8 shows great promise as a track toy
RX-8 shows great promise as a track toy
Now the fun starts
Anyway, there’s no real way to increase the power significantly without doing crazy stuff like turbocharging (Greddy does a kit) or supercharging (Pettit Racing). Things that I can’t consider if I want to put the car on the German system this summer. I will, however, definitely be looking at an equal-length exhaust manifold and free-flowing exhaust, not to mention a de-cat (for the private trackday events only, guv) and a nice intake. But that will be more for sound and revs than overall power increases.

It would be a shame to rip out the lovely red and black leather interior, so for this season at least I’ll probably resist the urge to cage it all up.

After all the service items are done (brakes, tyres, oil), but before I blow cash on extravagant exhausts, there’s one thing I am keen to work on more; the awesome chassis. I want to drop it a little more, stiffen it up but still keep that balance. Yes, I’d like to have my cake and eat it too. Options range from the predictable (Eibach lowering springs), to the sensible (Koni Yellow dampers with H&R springs), and all the way up to the ludicrous (Ohlins track and street coilovers, costing the same as the car).

One thing is for certain, I’m already loving my new Rex and I can’t wait for summer. Nurburgring F1 track, the Nordschleife and even a few trips to Spa. Let’s just hope I’m right about the motor and the nay-sayers are wrong... and NOW you can leave your hand-grenade comments below.


FACT SHEET
Car:
 2004 Mazda RX-8 
Run by: Dale Lomas
Bought: December 2011
Purchase price: £2,800
This month at a glance: Ignored the critics, bought a Wankel, made grand plans for modification but secretly hopes the mod budget won’t be spent on a re-con motor...


Author
Discussion

gmh23

Original Poster:

252 posts

179 months

Wednesday 1st February 2012
quotequote all
You're a braver man than me.

Going to keep an eye on this one, a lot of car for the money, always temped when I look in the classifieds.

Best of luck

Gizmo!

18,150 posts

208 months

Wednesday 1st February 2012
quotequote all
Fleet intro?

New journo intro too?

Sounds good by the way. I'm starting to get tempted by these RX8s... they can't all be that ruinous, can they?

andy97

4,691 posts

221 months

Wednesday 1st February 2012
quotequote all
Looking forward to hearing alot more about this. Its a car I onsidered myself for virtually the same reasons (and being aware of the same concerns) but a change in job fortune put paid to that!

steveb8189

473 posts

190 months

Wednesday 1st February 2012
quotequote all
No critisism here. I went for the S2000 instead and with over 85k on the clock it's still not caused me any problems at all - except when I got stuck in the snow on my drive and ran out of petrol...

Good luck with it and enjoy!

Nice driving by the way - definitely where the RX8 should live

AngryPartsBloke

1,436 posts

150 months

Wednesday 1st February 2012
quotequote all
I dont see how anybody could consider something that you need to check and top up the oil so much and even go to the lengths of making pre-mixed fuel to avoid engine failure as "Reliable" in anyway.

Its not that i dont like them, they look ace and i bet they are fun but id rather drive something that i dotn have to worry about after a thrashing quite so much.

marcosgt

11,011 posts

175 months

Wednesday 1st February 2012
quotequote all
At last - someone talking sense about the RX8.

Hope all goes well, nice to see one being driven in anger biggrin

M.

PS Angryman - There are plenty of multivalve piston engined cars that use more oil than the RX8, it's a definite myth about oil consumption, although with regular track use, you'd need to keep an eye on it. There is a gauge too, so you'd have to be a right numpty to get into trouble wrt oil consumption.

Edited by marcosgt on Wednesday 1st February 10:32

Scottie - NW

1,284 posts

232 months

Wednesday 1st February 2012
quotequote all
Two years ago to the month, I bought a 2007 RX8 PZ, the prodrive version.

It was as the sensible family car, it had to do school run, the Nurburgring each year, and the odd track day when my more dedicated track car was not available.

I had a compression test done this Saturday just gone, car has hit 48k and almost 5 years old. Still very good compression figures across front and rear rotors, the specialist commented there was no reason it wouldn't hit a 6 figure mileage without a problem as long as well looked after.

I bought it with one private owner at 3 years and 36k miles old.

First job, replace the spark plugs, uprated coils and leads. I'd do these every 30k.

Apart from that it needs one service a year (I only do 6k PA).

Use Fuchs XTR oil, about £20 online for 5 litres, one for the annual oil change and one for topping up throughout the year, my car uses 500ml every 1k miles.

All the PZ needed for it's second trip to the Ring was yellow stuff pads, braided hoses and good fluid.

The standard Eibach and Bilstein suspension is superb on road and track, as good as any car I have tried.

These cars are great and so much fun, yet practical enough to carry four adults and has a decent size boot.

I'm so glad I never listened to the horror stories and actually bought one, just make sure you get a hot compression test done first.

Pierscoe1

2,458 posts

260 months

Wednesday 1st February 2012
quotequote all
good stuff...

will look forward to future updates about the Ring-Rex :-D
they are SO tempting at the prices they have gotten down to now!
(mind you, 350Z's are also getting really cheap now too!)

Scottie - NW

1,284 posts

232 months

Wednesday 1st February 2012
quotequote all
AngryPartsBloke said:
I dont see how anybody could consider something that you need to check and top up the oil so much and even go to the lengths of making pre-mixed fuel to avoid engine failure as "Reliable" in anyway.

Its not that i dont like them, they look ace and i bet they are fun but id rather drive something that i dotn have to worry about after a thrashing quite so much.
You see I don't understand this, I only check the oil and top up as much as any other car I have ever had.

If you are doing a track day in any car you should be checking the oil regularly anyway.

And whereas my other cars require expensive oils, the oil for the annual service was less than £20, and I needed £12 worth to top up over 12months and 6k miles.

Compared to my friends modern company cars, the RX8 uses less oil than the average consumption across their prestegious German brands :-)

Dale Lomas

218 posts

154 months

Wednesday 1st February 2012
quotequote all
Oil consumption on the RX8 isn't controlled by how worn-out your engine is like on a piston engine, it's actually metered out by the ECU. Go on a trackday, thrash the arse out of it, and you'll notice the oil level plummet as the ECU squirts oil into the seals etc... at high rpm. Drive like Miss Daisy's chauffeur and you will barely touch it.

Interesting fact: the RX8 has not just 4 litres of oil in the sump, but actually 7 litres due to the two large oil coolers and pipework.


Robstar111r

97 posts

160 months

Wednesday 1st February 2012
quotequote all
I'll be watching this one. I've ways liked the RX8 and was thinking about buying one. In the end I went for it's little brother, MX5. I was put off by the horror stories, plus I like to have the top down. At the money thay'er going for now and you know what to look for and look after it, I reckon it's a cracking buy.

RAClNG SNAKE

3,606 posts

231 months

Wednesday 1st February 2012
quotequote all
I have been looking at these in the classifieds for some time.

There are good and bad examples at all mileages it seems. One chap I spoke to had ignition coil failure at only 36k but drove it home and to the garage, washing unburnt fuel through the rotors and cat with plumes of smoke out the back. He seemed to think replacing the offending ignition coil was all it needed.

Only advertisers who don't decline my request for a compression test are likely to get my money.

andy97

4,691 posts

221 months

Wednesday 1st February 2012
quotequote all
Can you fit an accusump to these car & would it help?

Found this article about racing an RX-8 in Britcar: http://www.guglielmimotorsport.co.uk/press/britpop...

I think the car was up for sale recently but not sure what happened to it.

y2blade

56,029 posts

214 months

Wednesday 1st February 2012
quotequote all
Brave man...Good luck with it, following with interest smile

STW2010

5,714 posts

161 months

Wednesday 1st February 2012
quotequote all
I miss mine so much.... weeping

Ali_T

3,379 posts

256 months

Wednesday 1st February 2012
quotequote all
Brave? Damned lucky more like. Very good choice and hugely under-rated amongst the PH snobs. I still miss my PZ version.

Alex

9,975 posts

283 months

Wednesday 1st February 2012
quotequote all
This is a really un-PH request, but I would be interested in what MPG you get during different types of driving.

blacksunmanta

7 posts

161 months

Wednesday 1st February 2012
quotequote all
Looking into one of these as we speak. Need a car for our baby but I dont like boring cars, or front drive. Even considering putting a rotary in my manta having seen a viva HC build on retro rides.

Interesting info to bear in mind on the engine compression test.

Dion20vt

252 posts

161 months

Wednesday 1st February 2012
quotequote all
They are awesome cars! I bought one with 26k miles on the clock, never had any troubles at all with a few years of ownership.... now my mates civic type r of the same age/milage on the other hand.... new linkages, new clutch, new bearings, noisy steering rack... the list goes on!!

The reliability of the "8" is much better than what people say! Good all-rounder!! biggrin

Fastdruid

8,623 posts

151 months

Wednesday 1st February 2012
quotequote all
Don't forget the reflash once you've swapped the exhaust and de-catted.
http://www.racingbeat.com/mazda/performance/pcm-fl...

Rotary engines have *really* hot exhaust gas temps so to prevent melting the cat it's setup to inject extra fuel to cool things down which reduces your power and probably your mpg too.

Enjoy.

PS Our RX-8 uses less oil than our Mondeo (although part of that is down to the mileage on each and number of miles driven), it uses less per 1000 miles than my bike and plenty less than a lot of piston engines. It's really *not* the big deal some people make it out to be. Well except that the dipstick is awkward and the oil filler in the middle almost guarantees a spillage.

After the initial weekly checks we settled down to a once per month check and top up where we put in 0.25-0.5l. Works out to be about 4l/year or ~£30. Hardly the end of the world.