Thursday 28th March 2013

Peugeot 208 GTI: Driven

First Fiesta ST, then Clio 200 and now the 208 GTI - Peugeot has a lot to live up to...

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It's fair to say that Peugeots are in my motoring bloodstream. I learned to drive in a 309. I also learned to crash in it, and discovered a passion - if not a knack - for oversteer somewhere between the two. My first 'sporty' car was a 106 Rallye which I loved like a human baby before eventually modifying it so badly that I ruined it. I mourn it still.

The 208 GTI and the elephant in the room...

So this car matters to me. A lot. Because the world is a better place with a proper Pug GTI in it. Because Peugeot has produced some of the iconic hot hatches over the years. The 106 GTI, 306GTI-6 and Rallye and of course, the daddy of them all, the 205GTI. The colossal shadow of which towers over this launch like the Alpes Maritimes that crowd the hotel base in St Paul de Vence. One sits just outside reception looking pert and perfect and making the car park full of 208s feel just a little under pressure.

What was interesting, and a bit worrying, was sitting in the press conference prior to the test drive and being told what the GTI isn't. It isn't radical. It isn't aggressive. It isn't optimised for the track... And it isn't oversteery.

Identity crisis
So what is the 208 GTI? Sporty, fast, refined, supple, playful but secure, chic and versatile, apparently. It is designed to be multi-purpose. A car to live with every day - so not too harsh, not too noisy, but efficient and well-mannered.

We drove these same roads in the Fiesta ST

The spec sheet does hint at excitement, too, thank goodness. A slightly wider track front and rear. The 200bhp, 203lb ft 1.6-litre turbo that endows it with a top speed of over 140mph and a 0-62 time of under seven seconds. It gets 302mm front discs behind 17-inch alloys, 205-section Michelin performance rubber, and tweaked suspension and steering settings - both of which are meatier.

The styling is designed to add muscle to the 208's shape. The new grille and headlamps are a bit fussy and don't really do it for me and although I like the rear-quarter badging - a knowing nod to the 205 - there's not enough menace or swagger to make the car stand out as something truly special.

Though for some I guess that subtlety may be a plus point. But you can't help but look at that old 205 - no wings or flares yet somehow the stance of it just oozes controlled menace in a very sexy way.

Fun? Yes. Any sense of danger? Nope.

The first stretch of our test route is exactly the same as the last stretch of the Fiesta ST launch, interestingly enough. Up the Col de Vence and on to Coursegoules and Greolieres. Fabulous roads and absolutely perfect for a sports hatch to strut its stuff.

Where's the rush
The first thing to notice is that the GTI doesn't feel hugely quick. It seems a tad breathless on the climb and struggles out of tighter turns. True, there are only a few hundred clicks on this car but it doesn't seem to have the guts and grunt of the Fiesta. Doesn't sound as good, either, from the inside. Slightly muted with a bit of raspy induction on boost but not much in the way or burble or bassline.

It rides beautifully though: supple, taut, smothering the bumps, allowing a bit of roll but dealing with rapid direction changes well and never once feeling lurchy or wallowy. The six-speed box is light and accurate which pretty well describes the steering, too though the latter is not hugely feelsome.

Classy, competent ... yeah, just that really

Mind you, that isn't a major issue because the press conference spoke the truth. There is absolutely no hooliganism in the 208's chassis. It is very competent, puts its power down incredibly well and hangs on to its line with tenacity. But back off, chuck it in or trail brake into a turn and there is just a mild tightening of the line and perhaps a lift of the inside rear wheel.

There isn't that window of exploitable adjustability that the Fiesta ST offers, that mild dose of oversteer that allows you to trim your line and also that makes you feel like the key factor in the driving experience.

Life on the edge
I like cars that encourage you to push your own abilities and reward with an extra layer of involvement. A bit of an edge. It's what hot Peugeots always had in spades. But perhaps educating young hot shoes by hurling them backwards into hedges isn't the done thing any more. So although there is a lot to commend dynamically, it doesn't blow my frock up or set my pulse racing like the Fiesta did, and that reference point is there at the back of my mind all the time, nagging away.

The interior is nice, the seats huggy and kit levels good. I like the little steering wheel and dials set above it allowing your focus on the road ahead. The splashes of chrome, the alloy pedals and the leather trim all lift the ambience nicely and add to the premium feel. It's a bit more grown up than the Fiesta. A bit classier. A bit pricier, too, at £18,895 (compared to the entry-level ST at £16,995). Peugeot hopes to sell 10,000 per year.

Sadly it's still in the shadow of that 205

I have yet to drive the new Clio, but the general consensus among those that had was that the Pug is the better all-round machine. Nicer to drive, more engaging. And as the day progresses and the miles rack up I find I like the GTI more and more. It's quick, stable and incredibly exploitable. On roads that threw ice, snow, water and broken surfaces at us, the 208 never once showed a spiteful side or felt like it was inclined to punish driver error. Even with the ESP off it was reluctant to spin away power and its light weight (just 1,160kg or so) translated to good agility on the switchbacks.

Is the 208 worthy of its GTI badge? I want to say yes. It's a good car. Really good. But not, for me at least, a great car. And so, although I'm impressed, I'm also disappointed. Disappointed that this Pug GTI isn't quite what I hoped it to be. Disappointed, perhaps, that this new age of hot hatches might not be the golden age we all wanted it to be. Expectations can do funny things to you, I guess, and I'm as keen as anybody to see the Pug in a UK group test and find out how it measures up toe-to-toe with its rivals. But right now, if it was my choice, and the driving experience was what mattered most, I'd be opting for the Fiesta.

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PEUGEOT 208 GTI
Engine: 1.6-litre 4-cyl, turbo, direct-injection
Transmission: 6-speed manual, front-wheel drive
Power (hp): 200@5,800rpm
Torque (lb ft): 203@1,700rpm
0-62mph: 6.8 sec
Top speed: 143mph
Weight: 1,160kg
MPG: 47.9mpg
CO2: 139g/km
Price: £18,895

[avm1987]

It's getting a bit old this comparison to the old 205. Times have changed, regulations, consumer demand, environmental concerns...
Chris Harris did a good video last night on the new hot Clio, explaining why things have changed and looking for the positive in these changes.
These car companies are not there to satisfy a few enthusiasts, let's just be grateful that there is demand for anything "hot" or "warm" as the case may be and of course there are always the classifieds!

[Deranged Granny]

As already said, it's hardly surprising. So many hot hatches have been a disappointment in the last few years. There's not enough demand, and they're never going to be able to emulate an era when the regulations were far less stringent. It's 285 kg heavier than a 205 Gti, for a start.

Personally, the new wave of hot hatches all look very similar to me - overstyled, overtyred, ugly chintzy box-like cars that are too high and too heavy - certainly compared to the hot hatches of the 80s and 90s.

[veevee]

I think after the last few efforts, noone is expecting them to bring back the 205; all we want to know is whether it's a total waste of time, like the 207, or not.

[astra la vista]

"the 205GTI. The colossal shadow of which towers over this launch like the Alpes Maritimes that crowd the hotel base in St Paul de Vence. One sits just outside reception looking pert and perfect and making the car park full of 208s feel just a little under pressure."

as soon as i saw that picture of the two cars together i thought "why do they do it?". as in, why do car manufacturers always try and show the lineage from the amazing original to the latest "imagining"? they're on a hiding to nothing straight away. to then say the new car isn't radical or aggressive puts a tin hat on it.

new cars have to stand on their own through design and engineering. it's okay for me and other ph'ers to lament the loss of hot hatches from the 80's but the car makers shouldn't be comparing and contrasting. i can only imagine that if a young hack turned up at that shindig he'd want to drive that old 205 first to see what all the fuss was about.

[Antj]

[Technomatt]

So, a better looking, 3 door, manual, similar priced competitor.

Overall, a very similar drive to the new Clio RS and Fiesta ST then, with just a few different flavours to hopefully lure those now pigeonholed 20 year olds welded to their iPhones into a showroom.

Looks like this one will appeal more to the ladies than the Ford or Renault.

Looks like the Ford will appeal more to those 20 year old blokes waiting to sow their seed than the Pug or Renault.

Where does this leave the Renault Clio RS, arse in the breeze?

[anonymous-user]

Hmm, this car certainly looks better in Gti form than it does as standard. The 208's I've seen on the road up until now look an utter mess. A mess of curves and chrome. The interior is even worse - an even more complex mess.

Leonardo da Vinci said: "Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication." The 205 embodied that perfectly. This new car is the anti-christ so far as I'm concerned. Panda 100hp seems to be the only small car that's got this right recently, and despite the curves the 208 can't compete with the Citroen DS3 or Fiat 500 in the looks department. It's just not distinctive enough and that's a big problem.

The biggest crime with this car seems to be the numb steering. That's the biggest thing that kills a hot hatch, or any car for that matter - making you feel instantly detached from what's going on down below. Surely Peugeot could have got that right at least?

Sorry Peugeot but I won't be coming back to you yet.

[W00DY]

avm1987 said:

It's getting a bit old this comparison to the old 205. Times have changed, regulations, consumer demand, environmental concerns...

Peugeot are the ones trying to make the comparison, so it's their own fault.


I don't think anyone's surprised that it's missing the old je ne sais quoi. Competent, bt without that magic that makes the 205 appeal to such a broad range of people.

[Limpet]

W00DY said:

Peugeot are the ones trying to make the comparison, so it's their own fault.

This.

There was a preview drive in Top Gear mag last month with a Peugeot test driver banging on repeatedly about how their overriding goal was to capture the character and fun factor of the 205. I think, given Peugeot's repeated failure to deliver anything like a compelling hot hatch since the 306 GTI/Rallye, and the benchmark status of the 205 GTI, you will always get the journos wondering if this next hot Pug is "the one", but Peugeot haven't exactly discouraged this, or managed expectations when it comes to the 208.

[anything fast]

mmmm fake chrome plastic door mirrors, yes very classy indeed. A biased article I think. If a Fiesta came with laminated fake chrome mirrors you would be laughing your ass off!

Classy is not word you associate with modern pugs... I will give you a few more common and apt words.

UGLY

UNRELIABLE

FLIMSY

HEAVY

STODGY

TAT

Sorry but this car is an insult to the GTi badge.

[Krikkit]

As usual the anti-anything French brigade come crawling out of the woodwork!

[Krikkit]

Do you really think this looks awful? It's hardly a world-beating, classic design, but aside from the DS3 and 500 Abarth most of the sporty hatches look much the same to me. I also think this design is very colour-specific, the ones at Geneva looked quite nice in the metal, the pictures of this one really don't do anything for it.

[bagseye]

I was in a Peugeot garage yesterday and reading their Rapport magazine, there was a article on the 208 GTI.

And my immediate thought from their own arcticle was this car is aimed at women and half-men/tarts. As mentioned before, its too glitzy, as the new RS Clio seems to be.

Problem is, from a money making point of view, a straight out hooner does not appeal to the masses and is not a big money maker. So now we have these soft-hatches.

[750turbo]

Krikkit said:

As usual the anti-anything French brigade come crawling out of the woodwork!

Yep, always happens now.

Place is mostly full of people only interested in upping their post count IMO. They have little/no idea of the current motor industry, and what they need to do to survive.

Anyway, I like it.

[Limpet]

Krikkit said:

As usual the anti-anything French brigade come crawling out of the woodwork!

I don't see anything in the comments above having a go at French cars. A few pops at Peugeot for failing to live up to past glories by building boring, unreliable dross for the past decade, and a few comments about modern drivers cars being a victim of changing legislation and consumer preferences. Both views have a fairly strong root in fact, surely.

I've owned half a dozen Peugeots and have nothing against French cars.

[anonymous-user]

Krikkit said:

As usual the anti-anything French brigade come crawling out of the woodwork!

Hardly anti-anything French, just anti-bad car.

I've critisised this car because it would seem nowhwere near as good as the French car's I've had the delight to own in the past. These are the 205gti 1.6, Clio Williams, Clio Renaultsport 197 and 306 DTurbo. All 4 cars were great cars. This just isn't I'm afraid.

Edited by anonymous-user on Thursday 28th March 11:52

[kayzee]

I like the look of these things, much better than the 207 and other models they brought out around that time.

Out of the new 3... I definitely wouldn't go for the Clio RS (despite owning a 182 atm, and loving it) I just couldn't live with 5 doors. So that leaves the ST or the GTi. It's a close call, it really is. I'm sure the ST drives better, but going purely on looks, I think the GTi might have it. It's such a shame the ST didn't come out pre-facelift as that was far, far better looking, and I would have gone for that one no question.

[deadtom]

The Crack Fox said:

The 208 Gti looks like Peugeot would be happy with a mid-field result for the 208 Gti, it looks less appealing than (deep breath) a MINI Cooper, a RenaultSport Clio, a Fabia VRs, a Polo Gti, a DS3, a Veloster, a Fiesta ST, a Corsa VXR and an Abarth 500. Any others I missed ?

Kia pro cee'd?

[anonymous-user]

I think the trouble with the last few Gti's from Peugeot is that the cars they are basing it on are a complete pile of sludge anyway. Heavy, ugly, inert, complex, with no feedback and very little driver involvement. If you look back to the 205 and 306 then even the base models were fun, class leading, handled well, simple, good looking and practical.

The 205 appealed like no other and was a truly classless car - happy to be owned by a mum doing the school run, or in Gti trim a hard thrusting city banker looking for a more practical alternative to a 911 in the 80's. Who does the current 208 appeal to? Probably to people who don't much like driving and know very little about cars mostly.

Renault have never started with as good a base car as Peugeot did in the 80's and 90's. Base model Clios have always been just average, never class leading. What Renaultsport (and Williams) have achieved with them though has been noting short of a miracle. They have successfully turned an average car into something very special.

[renaultgeek]

Is it smaller than the 206 and 207 were? I wonder will the aftermarket tuning parts market have a field day with these new small hot hatches? Or will the EU kill them off?