Friday 10th January 2014

Ariel Atom titanium chassis new details

What, you thought Ariel would let Zenos hog all the headlines at Autosport?

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It was back in April when news first surfaced of an Ariel Atom with a titanium chassis. It's been a little quiet since then but the guys at Ariel have revealed its first titanium prototype at the Autosport show.

Titanium road car will be NA like Mugen

Using titanium saves 40 per cent from the weight of the chassis and around seven per cent from the overall kerb weight. But aside from that and the complex construction methods required, we didn't know any more about this fascinating project as a road car.

With the Autosport reveal and a quick chat with Simon Saunders, there's more to tell. And it's very exciting. Though still very much in the development stages, Ariel is planning a limited run of around 5-10 cars (similarly to the Mugen) with the titanium chassis. Moreover, the lightweight ethos of the construction will extend throughout the car to create a super slight Atom.

Ariel is in discussions with a supplier for a titanium exhaust which would save further precious kilos, and it would use magnesium wheels too. For fear of 'ending up with an F1 car' that his customers wouldn't want, the tiny weight advantages of using titanium for the fasteners and hubs won't be used according to Simon.

However the car will be naturally aspirated, again on weight grounds. Again like the Mugen though, it will be close to the supercharged models on power. This is the titanium car's current development stage as Ariel work out the best way to achieve this.

As more information from Ariel is available, we'll be sure to keep you updated.

[WMP]

7% off the kerb weight, worth the bother?

Would even Colin Chapman go to such extraordinary lengths (and costs) for that? I personally doubt it, he would probably look to carbon fibre like every other engineer.

Even in the very weight conscious world of cycling titanium is rarely used for frames.

[scubadude]

WMP said:

Even in the very weight conscious world of cycling titanium is rarely used for frames.

Because Carbon is lighter (in context of a bike frames at the top end) but Titanium is often chosen for people buying a "bike for life" type extravagance, supposedly gives a stiffer frame for good power transmission (like Aluminum) but with the comfort of Steel and weight somewhere in between.

Carbon Ariel anyone?

[sanj7]

Never mind the titanium, why is that bloke wearing his wife's jeans?

[wemorgan]

AFAIK titanium has the same specific stiffness as steel, the same as aluminium.

[bogie]

sanj7 said:

Never mind the titanium, why is that bloke wearing his wife's jeans?

showing off his lovely figure to his mates I guess ...

weight loss is always a good idea this time of year...Ariel are doing a great job at it

[mrmr96]

WMP said:

7% off the kerb weight, worth the bother?

7% better power to weight
7% better acceleration
7% better cornering
7% better braking
etc

Yeah, it's better than adding more power because it affects ALL aspects of handling.

[P4ROT]

I seem to remember reading that the problem is the setup costs of a oxygen free environment for welding; the setup looks similar to a spray booth or autoclave (at least it does to my untrained mind lol)

[RocketRabbit]

mrmr96 said:

7% better power to weight
7% better acceleration
7% better cornering
7% better braking
etc

Yeah, it's better than adding more power because it affects ALL aspects of handling.

You will not get 7% improvement at all!

The titanium chassis is a silly idea. If Ariel designed a chassis that was function over form and used Reynolds steel alloys the car would be much lighter.

[Gorbyrev]

No cheap Atoms so I guess this is still the cheapest way in.

[WMP]

mrmr96 said:

WMP said:

7% off the kerb weight, worth the bother?

7% better power to weight
7% better acceleration
7% better cornering
7% better braking
etc

Yeah, it's better than adding more power because it affects ALL aspects of handling.

I don't think your maths add up, whilst the power to weight ratio may be directly proportional to weight loss the other factors (acceleration/cornering/braking) have different variables affecting them which will result in a less than 7% improvement.

Don't get me wrong, I can see the attraction but my point was/is that the huge cost in achieving such a small weight loss does not really seem worth it especially when there are better methods of achieving the same result. Maybe I am missing the point.

[stolenink]

As Richard Osman and Alexander Armstrong might say, "That is a Pointless answer!" Seems a shame to me though as no-one seems to have asked the question in the first instance...

[Itsallicanafford]

..if it's good enough for the SR71.

[underphil]

mrmr96 said:

7% better power to weight
7% better acceleration
7% better cornering
7% better braking
etc

Yeah, it's better than adding more power because it affects ALL aspects of handling.

even if the weight saved did work as you've written, it'd be more like 5% once you add in the weight of the driver

[stooch]

if my maths is correct, 7% represents around 40kg saving. That's a leg and part of an arm :-)

[Itsallicanafford]

stooch said:

if my maths is correct, 7% represents around 40kg saving. That's a leg and part of an arm :-)

Thats one heavy leg and arm! Hope i never meet you in a dark alley.

[tram50]

stooch said:

if my maths is correct, 7% represents around 40kg saving. That's a leg and part of an arm :-)

Does that mean an average Aerial driver weighs about 140kg, or 22 stone

[Uncle John]

sanj7 said:

Never mind the titanium, why is that bloke wearing his wife's jeans?

Ha Ha!

He certainly wouldn't be able to get in that Atom with those on!!

[loveice]

WMP said:

7% off the kerb weight, worth the bother?

Would even Colin Chapman go to such extraordinary lengths (and costs) for that? I personally doubt it, he would probably look to carbon fibre like every other engineer.

Even in the very weight conscious world of cycling titanium is rarely used for frames.

The important thing is it saves 40% over the same steel chassis, that's quite a lot. That 7% overall weight saving means only chassis is changed, everything else are still the same as normal Atom 3. I'm sure Ariel will do some other weight savings as well as the 40% saving on the chassis. Let's see if they can reduce the overall weight inc. all the fluids below 500kg. I don't think there's a single 'light weight' car engined track day toy really weights under 500kg with all the fluids...

[Dr Imran T]

sanj7 said:

Never mind the titanium, why is that bloke wearing his wife's jeans?

Brilliant

[TooMany2cvs]

stooch said:

if my maths is correct, 7% represents around 40kg saving. That's a leg and part of an arm :-)

Mebbe even enough to help that bloke fit into his jeans...