Thursday 27th February 2014

Next R8 to share Huracan chassis

OK, so no big surprise but Lambo tech day reveals more about carbon/aluminium 'hybrid' chassis

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We've spent all day as guests of Lamborghini learning all about the new Huracan, of which we'll be telling you more very shortly. Notable by his presence alongside the Lambo development team though was Audi's Dr Ulrich Hackenberg, self confessed architect of the VW group's platform philosophy and seemingly present to offer steely interjections to the Lambo love-in just in case they'd forgotten who was actually in charge. 

Hackenberg on hand to show off VW tech

Where Ferrari has confirmed it's sticking with aluminium for its 'mainstream' models and McLaren has bet the farm on productionised carbon fibre Audi, sorry, Lamborghini, has instead gone for a mixture of the two. Hackenberg was quick to assert that the new Huracan platform is, as is his style, an adaptable platform that'll underpin a series of models and apparently known as the Modular Sportscar System or MSS. In the Huracan's case it amounts to a 50 per cent increase in stiffness compared with the Gallardo's all-aluminium design with a simultaneous 10 per cent reduction in weight. 

Like the Gallardo and current R8, the engineering expertise that's gone into it comes out of Audi's Neckarsulm plant and combines Audi Space Frame aluminium production techniques with new productionised carbon fibre. To keep costs down this uses simpler sections of carbon bonded and riveted to aluminium pieces - hence the 'hybrid' description. From the bare shell on show it'd seem the carbon components include the rear bulkhead, transmission tunnel and rear section of the sills. 

MSS means RWD is possible...

In the Huracan's case - and the next R8's - it'll be a platform for mid-engined cars with longitudinal engines and four-wheel drive but while Lamborghini execs were reluctant to speculate further Hackenberg interjected that rear-wheel drive models would also be possible.

Hackenberg told us the initial plan for MSS is four models across two brands, by which you'd assume he means coupe and roadster versions of both the Huracan and next-gen R8. Who else in the group could benefit? Well, like BMW and others Audi is clearly keen to expand use of carbon fibre elements in the construction of mainstream models but whether we'll see MSS-derived models from others in the group remains to be seen. There is, of course, that rumour of a new Porsche model to sit between 911 and 918 that might well benefit...

 

[anonymous-user]

Shouldn't the title be:

Next R8 to share Huracan platform

Chassis components are wishbones, links, knuckles, dampers, springs etc. This seems to be referring to the body.

[Dave Hedgehog]

how much more expensive is this going to make the R8s

they have gone from just about affordable with man maths to how much!! in a very short period of time

[smilo996]

Imagine a foreign automotive company taking over a German automotive company and injecting some fun and decent design into it.

Oh yes that could never happen because you cannot purchase German companies. So instead the rest of us have to put up with more and more companies becoming foreign brands based on German cars.

Hopefully Jaguar will hold out, seeing as Aston is now just a coach builder and TVR will be back.

The Huracean just looks dull and it will also be dull. Lambo, is to VW what Lexus is to Toyota.

[kambites]

smilo996 said:

seeing as Aston is now just a coach builder

[Fittster]

Dave Hedgehog said:

how much more expensive is this going to make the R8s

they have gone from just about affordable with man maths to how much!! in a very short period of time

How does an R8 compare on price to a 911?

[Dave Hedgehog]

smilo996 said:

Imagine a foreign automotive company taking over a German automotive company and injecting some fun and decent design into it.

Oh yes that could never happen because you cannot purchase German companies. So instead the rest of us have to put up with more and more companies becoming foreign brands based on German cars.

Hopefully Jaguar will hold out, seeing as Aston is now just a coach builder and TVR will be back.

The Huracean just looks dull and it will also be dull. Lambo, is to VW what Lexus is to Toyota.

but would lambo have survived if VAG had not bought them? they went bust what twice and Chrysler where desperate to unload them so presumably they where in a bad financial state then as well

[Dave Hedgehog]

Fittster said:

Dave Hedgehog said:

how much more expensive is this going to make the R8s

they have gone from just about affordable with man maths to how much!! in a very short period of time

How does an R8 compare on price to a 911?

there are so many 911 models and "specials" its hard to tell, a GT3 in reasonable spec is going to be about 120k a V10 plus R8 about 130k so pretty close but eye wateringly expensive

[crispyshark]

I get the business model for the shared platform and appreciate the amount of profit and technological advances you achieve with pooled resources.....however a little piece of purist in me dies every time I read an article like this.

Advancements = wonderful/awe inspiring

Soul of the car = fading/disintegrating like the portrait of Dorian Gray.

All I can hope is that the gap left continues to be filled by smaller sports car developers.

[Dan Trent]

RenOHH said:

Shouldn't the title be:

Next R8 to share Huracan platform

Chassis components are wishbones, links, knuckles, dampers, springs etc. This seems to be referring to the body.

Engine and gearbox are Audi supplied on Huracan (stamped as much in the castings!) and the chassis/platform that comes under MSS includes front and rear subframe assemblies and therefore, in all likelihood, suspension hardpoints too. Not too much of a stretch that R8 will make use of suspension components as well, given that the whole point of MSS is a cost saving economies of scale thing. Huracan uses magneto-rheological dampers too, which is also established Audi tech. All of which adds up in my book.

We shall see though!

Cheers,

Dan

[Dave Hedgehog]

Dan Trent said:

RenOHH said:

Shouldn't the title be:

Next R8 to share Huracan platform

Chassis components are wishbones, links, knuckles, dampers, springs etc. This seems to be referring to the body.

Engine and gearbox are Audi supplied on Huracan (stamped as much in the castings!) and the chassis/platform that comes under MSS includes front and rear subframe assemblies and therefore, in all likelihood, suspension hardpoints too. Not too much of a stretch that R8 will make use of suspension components as well, given that the whole point of MSS is a cost saving economies of scale thing. Huracan uses magneto-rheological dampers too, which is also established Audi tech. All of which adds up in my book.

We shall see though!

Cheers,

Dan

was there not a thread on PH about how the old R8 and gallardo had the same suspension hard points?

[danielj58]

smilo996 said:

Imagine a foreign automotive company taking over a German automotive company and injecting some fun and decent design into it.

Oh yes that could never happen because you cannot purchase German companies. So instead the rest of us have to put up with more and more companies becoming foreign brands based on German cars.

Hopefully Jaguar will hold out, seeing as Aston is now just a coach builder and TVR will be back.

The Huracean just looks dull and it will also be dull. Lambo, is to VW what Lexus is to Toyota.

But the majority of companies that the German marques buy are faltering financially, none spring to mind where that hasn't been the case? I'll side with you on the way all of VAG is slowly merging into a vast blob of bland similar-ness, but I don't think it justifies writing all german marques off in one broad stroke as boring.

Jaguar Land Rover is already a wholly owned subsidary of Tata Motors, so hold out from what? And how is Aston a coachbuilder too? I'd rather see a German partnership than off the shelf LS engines, and I'd sooner see that than watch them bankrupt themselves.

Just my 2p anyway..

[goron59]

Dan Trent said:

RenOHH said:

Shouldn't the title be:

Next R8 to share Huracan platform

Chassis components are wishbones, links, knuckles, dampers, springs etc. This seems to be referring to the body.

Engine and gearbox are Audi supplied on Huracan (stamped as much in the castings!) and the chassis/platform that comes under MSS includes front and rear subframe assemblies and therefore, in all likelihood, suspension hardpoints too. Not too much of a stretch that R8 will make use of suspension components as well, given that the whole point of MSS is a cost saving economies of scale thing. Huracan uses magneto-rheological dampers too, which is also established Audi tech. All of which adds up in my book.

We shall see though!

Cheers,

Dan

Huracan _looks_ a little tame for me for a Lambo, but I hope it'll act as a shakedown for the new R8, which a) is kind of meant to be a bit tame looking and b) is on my shopping list for t-2 years. I just hope I can afford to keep my current R8 (manual V8) as it won't be worth much then and it's still a big smile inducer every time I jump in

[phat_phil1987]

smilo996 said:

Imagine a foreign automotive company taking over a German automotive company and injecting some fun and decent design into it.

Oh yes that could never happen because you cannot purchase German companies. So instead the rest of us have to put up with more and more companies becoming foreign brands based on German cars.

Hopefully Jaguar will hold out, seeing as Aston is now just a coach builder and TVR will be back.

The Huracean just looks dull and it will also be dull. Lambo, is to VW what Lexus is to Toyota.

Don't see the problem with that seeing as they can actually be used and the alternative is they go bust?
Also I would say audi is to vw what lexus is to Toyota

[Duffman83]

If they are sharing platforms and components between the brands to reduce costs, why are they getting even more expensive?

10 years ago the Gallardo was £120k, the huracan looks to be 170-180.

I'm guessing more profit?

[kambites]

Duffman83 said:

If they are sharing platforms and components between the brands to reduce costs, why are they getting even more expensive?

10 years ago the Gallardo was £120k, the huracan looks to be 170-180.

I'm guessing more profit?

Well inflation alone would take 120k in 2003 to over 160k today, so it hasn't really gone up that much.

[ceebmoj]

Shame there are no pictures of the platform that was on display.

[SeenTheStrings]

smilo996 said:

...seeing as Aston is now just a coach builder...

Oh, you mean like Rolls-Royce?

What utter nonsense!

[Dan Trent]

ceebmoj said:

Shame there are no pictures of the platform that was on display.

Fixed that for you! Apologies, we'd had our cameras taken off us and were only supplied with official pics as we left.

Cheers,

Dan

[aka_kerrly]

smilo996 said:

Imagine a foreign automotive company taking over a German automotive company and injecting some fun and decent design into it.

Oh yes that could never happen because you cannot purchase German companies. So instead the rest of us have to put up with more and more companies becoming foreign brands based on German cars.

Hopefully Jaguar will hold out, seeing as Aston is now just a coach builder and TVR will be back.

The Huracean just looks dull and it will also be dull. Lambo, is to VW what Lexus is to Toyota.

What a utter load of bks.

Lamborghini were in a terrible state when Audi bought them, for the previous two decades they had been flogging barely 200 Diablos a year. The Diablo had been milked dry and only in it's best year of sales Lamborghini just reached break even.

The Gallardo & Murcielago are far better cars than those of the past, I've seen/read a fair few reviews of the older cars and whilst the Countach was very the poster car of the 80s it wasn't [i]that[i/] good a car compared with rivals.

You must be a fan of the sort of "character" which was the excuse for years for supercars that were unreliable whilst suffering copious amounts of quality control problems.

[Nors]

aka_kerrly said:

smilo996 said:

Imagine a foreign automotive company taking over a German automotive company and injecting some fun and decent design into it.

Oh yes that could never happen because you cannot purchase German companies. So instead the rest of us have to put up with more and more companies becoming foreign brands based on German cars.

Hopefully Jaguar will hold out, seeing as Aston is now just a coach builder and TVR will be back.

The Huracean just looks dull and it will also be dull. Lambo, is to VW what Lexus is to Toyota.

What a utter load of bks.

Lamborghini were in a terrible state when Audi bought them, for the previous two decades they had been flogging barely 200 Diablos a year. The Diablo had been milked dry and only in it's best year of sales Lamborghini just reached break even.

The Gallardo & Murcielago are far better cars than those of the past, I've seen/read a fair few reviews of the older cars and whilst the Countach was very the poster car of the 80s it wasn't [i]that[i/] good a car compared with rivals.

You must be a fan of the sort of "character" which was the excuse for years for supercars that were unreliable whilst suffering copious amounts of quality control problems.

You my friend are talking sense!!

Saying that 610bhp NA and 0-125 in under 10 seconds is dull........