Paddle clutches, fact not friction please.

[taz turbo]

Having just finished the engine rebuild of my TVR (a turbocharged 2.8 ford V6) I am having a dilema about clutches, prior to the rebuild it was 242bhp/249lb/ft of torque. The standard clutch was never upto the job and slip was always a problem. Now the engines rebuilt and running forged pistons and a tricky cam for a turbo application, (the pistons were always the weak point) I hope to run a little higher boost, and achieve a little more power/torque. Hence the clutch is now a serious issue, I was steered away (by a supplier) from a 4 paddle clutch, as "it will be a pig in a road car - only on or off" and advised to go for a 6 paddle clutch "all the advantages of a 4 paddle but much more driveable". I am of course using an uprated cover (an AP item). From the wealth of PH knowledge what is other peoples findings / experiances of ceramic metalic paddle clutches / organic material clutches.

Regards,

Chris.

[scuffham]

avoid *any* metalic clutches paddle or otherwise, they are NOT road friendly.

if you are having a problem with the one you have, go find a stronger cover and plate.

[trackcar]

the 4 - v - 6 thing was what we heard from burton power products for our own race turbo tassie.

from what we find with our race car a 6 paddle clutch would be quite civilised for road use. ours pootles around the paddock quite happily.

[matt_fp]

A 6 paddle clutch won't be as 'nice' in traffic as a normal organic friction plate but it will be useable'ish

A 4 paddle is 95% on/off.

If it were my car I'd be looking at a standard'ish friction plate with a monster pressure plate.

Regs
Matt

[GavinPearson]

I recently evaluated a twin disc 6 paddle cerametallic clutch by Valeo that is now OE for the Lamborghini Gallardo in a fairly powerful car. I was impressed, it was chatter free and very traffic driveable. And that wasn't down to the low pedal loads either, the material chosen seemed to be very progressive.

This would seem to be the exception rather than the rule. Even the best manufacturers can make a miscalculation when it comes to chatter and selecting the right material makes a big difference. Valeo FA810 seems to be a good material for a road car, doesn't judder, wears well, has excellent heat capacity.

For a road car I would tend to put the biggest diameter organic clutch in with the least clamp load that enabled the torque capacity requirements to be met.

The Cologne engine has a fairly small diameter flywheel, but Ford uses it in the Mustang V6 which makes 240 ft lbs torque. Using that set up might be entirely feasible.

I have seen many clutches fail due to a pedal return spring not being fitted, the weight of the pedal provides enough force to just ride the clutch and microslip, which then causes failure.

I have also seen clutches fail because they have poor heat dissipation in the cover, the material then just overheats and fails.

The answer is more than just fit brand A or brand B, making a good road car is difficult.

[350matt]

GavinPearson said:

I have seen many clutches fail due to a pedal return spring not being fitted, the weight of the pedal provides enough force to just ride the clutch and microslip, which then causes failure. I have also seen clutches fail because they have poor heat dissipation in the cover, the material then just overheats and fails.

Interesting...
Cerbera don't have a pedal return spring.... make of that what you will

[taz turbo]

Thanks for the info folks,

I have a 6 paddle plate on the kitchen table, where else. I will fit it and give it a try and update this post with my findings. Glad to hear some of you have used this type of clutch with some reasonable results. I won't be out and about in the car until after the winter salt is gone, sorry to mention the winter word.

Regards,

Chris.

[Mr Whippy]

Why not try over at the Interford forums.

Plenty of people there running the 2.8 and 2.9 V6 with turbo's and all sorts in Sierra's and Capri's etc.

Not sure if there are any problems but I'm sure the Escort Cosworth uprated clutches fit the 2.9, and I'm pretty sure they fit the 2.8 too...

Best to ask over there anyway if you need lots of advice from people running these engines with high outputs on the road.


Pretty sure Minker made a 2.8 XR4x4 with 300bhp+... quite sure there are plenty of "normal" ish road clutches that would easily fit and hold the torque your after.

Cheers

Dave

>> Edited by Mr Whippy on Monday 17th October 17:10

[taz turbo]

Well the update as promised.....

The six paddle clutch plate and HD AP cover has made it from the kitchen table to the car. I have only covered 50 miles so far, and have experianced different traffic, heavy congestion crawling on / off the clutch, town driving, hill starts and the more pleasant A and b roads when quieter. The clutch isn't as progressive as an organic clutch, but still perfectly driveable, and thats my plan for the summer, and lots of it.

Thanks for your time,

Regards,

Chris.