xj8 with nikasil problems new engine or new liners?

[nigelwilliams]

Thanks for the advice Alex, no I dont know what year the engine is yet, I will be going over to visit Stephen Haywood after the weekend.
The light at the end of this particular tunnel is well and truly in sight, although it will leave a hefty dent in our bank balance, I suppose thats the cost of driving something so rewarding as a Jaguar.

[RedOctober]

Aye, no gain without pain, as they say Painful though big motoring bills are, the blow is softened by the fact the car being repaired is a wonderful car when running properly.

I came from a long line of BMW's but always secretly lusted after a Jag. I realised the dream 2 weeks ago and bought a 1995 X300 model Daimler Double Six, with the 6 litre V12.

It was love at first test drive and I had to have the car as it was such a wonderful experience. The V8's were a bit out of my budget for a non-nikasil 2001 or later model year car, so when this particular V12 appeared on the market I had to go and view it.

It's a massively different driving experience to my old E34 BMW 5-series, and they feel like beat-up growly, unrefined old hatchbacks now by comparison and I've gone right off driving them-even the 286bhp 4 litre V8 540i.

The X300 model Jag is easily the most attractive and graceful shape ever produced for a modern big luxury car, and it's quite an event just sitting inside the car and soaking up the ambience-the German cars just can't compete on this level, and the ugly modern BMW's and so-so looking Mercs just leave me cold.

I've got the guzzling V12 and live in fear of a major breakdown, but just know that whatever sized repair bill I could one day receive, I'd just have to find the money to repair the car even if it meant feasting on bread and water for months

Everyone else thinks I've lost the plot but nothing provides such soothing balm with effortless pace like the big Jag-they should provide them as therapy for stressed people

Alex

[DAVYCOSWORTH]

Hi there fellow petrol heads.I am currently having problems with my gorgeous carnival red xjr v8. 1998 i've had the car from few months old,former dealer principals car,it is like the olympic torch, never goes out,much, it has covered a meer 56000miles trouble free till now, recently it has developed a starting problem and i am worried its the dreded NIKASIL issue.. i have had the car serviced by selling, JAGUAR, dealer up until 3 years ago when i was going thru a nasty divorce and couldn't afford to. however i am an autmobile design engineer myself so i did change oil (castrol RS) etc each year even though the car was only doing a few hundred miles,it has been stored in a heated de-humidified garage and treated like a baby, maybe why i,m divorced now, sorry to go on. But when I called my dealer, they said I would be responsible for total replacement costs myself.. they said jaguar didn't know the fuel companies were going to increase sulpher content in petrol, which apparently is the cause of liner failure? any advise you can give me will be greatly appreciated.surely as i bought it from them and mileage is so low they must bear some of the responsibility?? please help.

[P700DEE]

Low mileage is a major contributer to Nikasil liner damage. Jaguar have withdrawn the replacement engine scheme as ultra low sulphur petrol has been supplied since 2000 so the problem should no longer occur. All Nikasil engined cars should have had a blow by test done (field service action code S491)Any car with a reading over 40 was replaced however many will have been close to this value and possible to fail later. I hope your problem is not lining failure as whilst Jaguar can be pursuaded to contribute to engine failure others here have found they can fit a replacement engine for much less than the cost of one from Jaguareven with a contribution. Poor starting can be caused by other problems and is a sign of the last stages of Nikasil failure. Early stages are high oil use amoungst others

[mike888]

Sell it ! Get some piston ring seal , the stuff that we all used to keep our cars going in the seventies, pour it in and get rid of it. Your time plus the cost are not worth messing around with it. It is not a collectors car so there will be another. I had a 540 like that and I sold it as was - a non runner. The total value of the car did not add up to the effort and expense I had to put in to get it running again. I now have an immaculate 1998 4.4litre 7 series which cost less than the quote you have had for an engine. Time to say goodbye I think.

[RedOctober]

Before assuming the most dire problems you at least need to confirm if the engine has worn liners by getting a proper blow-by test done at a Jaguar dealer.

If the Nikasil bores are worn you should have noticed higher oil consumption initially as the oil escapes past the excessive bore/piston clearance.

Only when the bores are massively worn will the engine not start, as there is not enough compression generated to make the air/fuel mixture ignitable by the spark plug.

Slight bore wear will be partly compensated for by the piston rings expanding slightly to take up the clearance.

Engines with badly worn bores usually generate clouds of blue oil smoke from the exhaust when you accelerate hard-remember those old smoking Cavaliers and Sierras you'd see years ago?

Whilst you may have a Nikasil problem, it may even be something as simple as a good old fashioned electrical/ECU fault causing the non-starting, so it's important to have a blow-by test done.

If this confirms the worst and you don't have a large budget, then there's no cheap fix and the only realistic option is to sell the car, unless you can get an engine from an accident-damaged vehicle.

Sometimes you can nurse them along for a bit by pouring a small amount of oil down the spark plug holes to seal the bores and give enough compression to start the engine, but this is a desparate measure and not exactly practical to remove 8 spark plugs every day you use the car, knowing that eventually even this will not stave off the inevitable.

Hope it's just a simple electrical fault like a faulty relay or something-either way you really need to get the blow-by test arranged at a dealer.

Best of luck!

[DCOSWORTH]

Thanks for that red october, there is no loss of oil and no smoking tailpipes, the car looks and drives as it did when it left the factory. compression test and electrical diagnosis is the obvious next step.if it is more serious, i guess this is the time for that 4.2 500bhp conversion i've been thinking about.. cheers.

[sprinter885]

Hello all you "Cat" owners. I'm a bit chuffed at having just viewed a 2000 S Type 4.0 V8 which I think I'll be buying. It's a 72K miler BUT had replacement factory engine at 48K (Nikasil problem- believe the steel liner engine fitted) It's in fine body condition-no boot leaks no obvious signs of header tank leak/splits & all bells & whistles-Satnav, Mem seats,A/c traction control etc. Got to confess more than a little excited anticipation. Waiting to get garage check over & HPI check etc.
If anybody out there has any views/comments or opinions I'd welcome all replies.

[xjrguy]

Hi all just joined up / in - am impressed at the info - wish I'd seen this back in 2001 when I bought my XJ.
Anyway, am looking for 2001 XJR or XKR - have a 99 XJ 3.2 in perfect condition - any takers ?
What does anybody reckon it's worth as a trade in, and how much for a 2001 XKR ?
My Xj has 48k miles FJSH, is Topaz ext. and cashmere int. with Celtic alloys.

thanks

[k18kys]

I've just got my XJ8 back from the garage today after she wouldn't start as a result of flooding. I did the fatal thing of moving it about 10 yards after being stood all day in the car park. She wouldn't start when I came back to her two days later, apparently flooded. Had the AA out to it twice, first patrolman broke a plug, they were in that tight. Note: the plugs were fitted by a Jaguar main agent at the last service - not impressed. The second patrolman eventually threw the towel in after 3 hours. The AA arranged for the car to be towed to a garage, the mechanic at the garage changed all the plugs and then told me he left it sat with the ignition on for about 15 to 20 minutes as this resets the ECU from the cold start condition. Started her up and taken for a test drive, all OK. Has anyone heard this before ?
I'd be interested to know if anyone has success with this, cost me £171.45 to find out this info - all donations gratefully received.
P.S. Does anyone know the approximate cost of the blow-by test ?

Edited by k18kys on Tuesday 6th June 20:30

[robocop]

That is a known problem with Jags. Main condition which caused this fault was the clasic starting a car to move out of a garage on a Sunday morning then wash it, then try and start it to put it back in the garage again!

These engines need to warm up properly each time, before you switch off. The ECU seems to be really sensitive to adjusting through the warm up time. Not sure why, but if you want to look after the engine let it warm thoroughly before switching off.

God knows why anyone would want to keep putting them in the garage anyway!!! [wink]

Rgds
Robocop

[a8hex]

robocop said:

God knows why anyone would want to keep putting them in the garage anyway!!! [wink]

You've obviously never kept a car in a garage

The biggest problem with short runs is having to start the XJ, that now has to live in front of the garage , to move it out the way to get the XK out to play

Anyone remeber Butterflies?

Cheers
Ken

[John-Michael]

I have XJ8 with Nikasil problem. Living in South Africa, getting a second hand engine is difficult and price would be prohibitive. I will have to go the relining the bore route. I would be so pleased if anyone has actually done this and can give me any advice

[a8hex]

There's been a recent discussion on www.jag-lovers.org in the X300 forum with a title of "99 XJR engine needed". In here there is a pointer to a CD available on exactly how to do this rebore/rebuild operation and some discussion from people who have done this.

Cheers

Ken

[John-Michael]

Thanks, Ken

Have contacted John Heffner regarding the CD, as the rebuild is really my only option.

Mike

[ChampagneCharlie]

Hello.
I have a 1998 XJ8 which has these problems, can anyone help?
It starts and runs ok from cold but, occasionally after around 10 miles it stalls. If the engine is warm/hot it wont start again until cooled (approx 30 mins).
Also there is an intermitant click sound coming from the engine which is worse when it is cold than warm.
I have been told this is a nikasil problem but I have my doubts.
Thanks
Barb

[a8hex]

ChampagneCharlie said:

Hello.
I have a 1998 XJ8 which has these problems, can anyone help?
It starts and runs ok from cold but, occasionally after around 10 miles it stalls. If the engine is warm/hot it wont start again until cooled (approx 30 mins).
Also there is an intermitant click sound coming from the engine which is worse when it is cold than warm.
I have been told this is a nikasil problem but I have my doubts.
Thanks
Barb

I don't have a V8 myself, but my understanding was that the nikasil problem tended to effect the startup of the engine. I guess once the oil is pumping round nicely it's easier to get a bit of a seal with the piston rings.

Have you read Broadbean747's guide?

http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&t=195961

[P700DEE]

I doubt your car has Nikasil problems and the description is not a symptom. Symptom is descriptive of throttle body, has the recall work been carried out ? Can be a number of other things related to fuel mix but surprised anyone suggested Nikasil Click sound could easily be VVTs that get noisey

Edited by P700DEE on Monday 17th December 10:18

[ChampagneCharlie]

Thanks for the information, what is a VVT? I am in touch with the local Jag Dealer at Lincoln and am awaiting their call at this moment.
A while ago, there was a problem when the car wouldn't start from cold, the mechanic said that this was due to Nikasil problems as he thought the valves were stuck as the compression was low on one side.
Will let you know the results from Jag Lincoln.

[ChampagneCharlie]

Just had a call from Jag Lincoln. At first they said that they couldn't give me any idea of the problem without taking it in for tests, I then mentioned the Throttle Body Replacement issues and lo and behold they did know about it and have booked it in for a replacement. They also mentioned that the steering pump had a recall and this would also need looking at although the ECM didn't need re-setting.
Well let's see how we go on from here!
Thanks again

Edited by ChampagneCharlie on Monday 17th December 18:18

Edited by ChampagneCharlie on Monday 17th December 19:23